From "stay tuned" to T U N E D !!

[Klasse Act]

Maybe our techs can decipher the abbreviations here

Got the EN back and while I didn't put my foot in it it felt great to be back behind the wheel of 300 hp again

What's coming next....stay "tuned"

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[Klasse Act]

So now I've got a decision to make:

(A) Take advantage of the free reflash on my original ECU

-decide on Stage 1 or 2, the latter calling for upgraded HPFP ($550) also makes a little more power.

(B) Buy what my buddy Marcin has, Stillen TruControl piggyback, doesn't call for upgraded HPFP.

(C)

Choice (A) has me salvaging some of the $1500 I spent w/N75, possibly spending more if I were to go Stage 2. I've already swapped out those MSD coils, not 100% sure they were even the problem on the dyno, maybe the tune was bad then, going bad, car not warmed up, etc

Choice (B) was dyno proven right infront of me (330 whp/353 wtq) The piggyback doesn't leave a trace of anything on the ECU

Choice (C) has me laying down next to my bowl and playing it safe and running my N Performance intake and Shark Racing turbo inlet pipe and Stillen mid-pipe, possibly adding the axle-back afterwards

I see/hear so many people with tunes having ZERO issues and enjoy that little extra making their driving experience a little more special when the time is right...WHY CAN'T I ENJOY THAT

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[Coatingsarecrack]

Plan D

Tune ECU… sell it…. Get Stillen set up. You see it being run in real life with no effects.

Or plan E… LS swap


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[Klasse Act]

Washed the EN before the Super Bowl today...then the code came back...again

They replaced the ECU, even though the code was for the knock sensor...again

We dropped it off, I left a note in the car and with the drop off box. God knows when it will be done, you'd think the knock sensor would be in stock

Here's the rentals...my buddy had the highlighter green one, I had the black Kona N-line, maybe the Sante Cruz this time

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[Big Dave]

That's so frustrating, it's like your own private hell, to have a car you love, that goes hard, but if you wash it, it throws a code at you, like, almost out of spite.

We don't get the Santa Cruz over here, yet. But it might be coming, they say Kia is developing something off the same platform for our market. They'd be crazy not to, the top 3 selling vehicles in Australia are all Utes (pickups), Ford Ranger is top, then Toyota Hilux, and Isuzu D-Max in third, so there's definitely a market for a smaller urban utility vehicle.

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[Klasse Act]

You said it all Dave!

The thing is my confidence is waining right now, between parts quality/engineering, diagnosis issues and the fact that car washes over time have worn the knock sensor out

I'll be on the phone with Hyundai corporate about this recurring issue. It's not the 3rd issue with the same problem but this is absolutely ridiculous

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[Desertnate]

Well this is frustrating. Consistently getting the same error every time the car gets wet makes no sense unless that sensor or the wiring between it and the next step in the engine control system it is taking on water and causing a signaling issue. To make things even more complicated, sometimes the error code being shown may not always indicate the problem assigned to the code. However, I've usually see than when it's multiple codes showing up at once, not a single one.

I did a little Googling to try and decrypt the acronyms on your service report. From what I can tell, the mechanics plugged in their laptop with Hyundai's diagnostic software, and the ECU (or ECM, same thing) not only triggered an error of some sort, but it also couldn't even pull the VIN off the ECU. Getting the VIN off the ECU I think is the first step in the software synching up with the car. Essentially, the car couldn't even give the mechanic it's name. That seems a little strange, but it does point to something not good in the ECU. No idea if that was due to a failure during the tune or the ECU failing on its own.

Once they get all of these issues sorted, I don't think I'd mess with flashing the ECU again. A piggyback isn't a bad option, and probably a safer way to go. While I don't doubt the integrity of your tuner, I can't help but think that the tuning of N cars is still a fairly new thing since they haven't been on the market all that long. There can still be some "growing pains" as the vendors and market learn more about the engines and the cars. Unlike some JDM and German tuners who have been working on the same brands for decades, the Koreans are fairly new, uncharted territory.

Keep us posted on what you find out!

[oneheadlite]

Sorry for the late check in.

I usually only have time to sit down and do posting during my lunch break, but lately I've been working through logistics of a thing I'll be building (might post in the non-detailing related, not that it's that exciting).

So, as a dealer tech they always wanted your story to have the 3 C's - Complaint, Cause, Correction. Reading your invoice, I read it basically as Desertnate did.

My read - because this is a repeat issue, they typically will escalate to contacting their manufacturer tech assist line. This puts them in contact with in house experts to help with diagnosing issues. This can also lead to them connecting with actual engineers from the company if answers can't be found.

During their connecting with the car, they found the ECM did not have the VIN populated which was the first red flag for them. Next was the fact that the fault would set on start up, not even requiring a drive cycle. (Side Note: JB tuners on BMW's will nuke communication with scantools unless the tune is disabled - this is likely a different issue than what you're having).

New ECM in, programmed as required (new control modules frequently need to be told what car they're in so they know what other stuff in the car they're looking for; IE: Manual/auto/etc. Plus certain modules get the VIN burned into them so they get locked to a specific vehicle - Due to immobilizer/component protection most German stuff won't let you swap modules between cars). As far as tech experienced, thought it was good.

I did a little poking around in the info I had available through our shop software, though really not much a lot was there for your N-Line. I ended up switching to a standard Elantra to see what I could see. Their trouble shooting table for the knock sensor is pretty basic, so not terribly surprising it's parts throwing time.

As far as I see it, options for the issue (especially since it's happening with stock ECM):
- Connection issue at the Knock sensor or ECM - they should check what's called "Pin drag" - make sure there's sufficient tension in the electrical contacts of the connector. Sometimes factory harnesses had issues with wire crimping at the terminals, sometimes just from being repeatedly plugged in/unplugged you can end up with loosened contacts. There's also a thing called "Fretting corrosion", where you get microscopic corrosion in the terminals just from the 2 pieces expanding and contracting at a microscopic level.
- Wiring issue - something in the copper between the knock sensor and the computer - There needs to be more than a simple open circuit (both ends unplugged) ohm check. A suitable load (light bulb) should be substituted in and the voltage drop measured for each wire. See below.
- Knock sensor issue - either a bad sensor or an improperly torqued sensor. Knock sensors are incredibly sensitive little guys that generate voltage from vibration; Too tight or too loose and they can be damaged or simply provide an incorrect signal.
- Computer processing issue - Seems like this should be off the table since it's new.
- An actual knock issue. Hate to say it, but if all other elements are functioning correctly, then the knock sensor could just be doing it's job and reporting that it's hearing noise it shouldn't be. Timing or timing chain issues, piston slap, or excessive bearing clearance could cause this. I saw a procedure in the repair info that they have a tool for testing for excessive bearing clearance ( https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/tsbs/20...90044-0001.pdf ). This is concerning because it means it's a thing they've seen enough to make a way to test for it. That might be a question to ask your service peeps and see if they can let you know what engines they've been seeing that on.

In your shoes, I'd be sure to ask the Service Manager (we're at too many visits here in my opinion for this to be a service writer discussion) to put their best diagnostician in the shop on it as you're tired of the repeat issues and make your loss of faith (politely) known. Unfortunately sometimes there are hard problems - it's all in how the experience of handling them goes.

Not sure this is of any help, but wanted to get back to you.


Below: My best attempt to explain voltage drop - A single strand of copper will pass a resistance (ohm) test, but you make that wire carry power in a live circuit and it turns into a heating element using up power. Basically a wire with corrosion or not enough material to carry the current turns into a consumer. Have a corroded engine ground? Car won't start because even though the starter is good, the ground cable is om-nomming all the juice (and likely getting toasty warm in the process).

[oneheadlite]

Oh! And back to a previous post of tunes "going away" on their own - I think I remember hearing about old BMWs where they would unlearn reflashes, but this is mid/late 90's stuff when it was an early concept. Can't say I've heard anything about it recently. Again, all my experience comes with a huge disclaimer that I'm only plugged into BMW/Audiland.

[Klasse Act]

Desert and One headlight...THANK YOU!

So because this is triggered by the carwash, although not every single wash as the first knock sensor, original one, lasted till July 2023 (1 calender year of using the carwash multiple times a week, 2nd knock sensor one from Mid July 2023 till Jan 30th of this year) the techline is suggesting a special dialectic grease that had to be ordered and should be here Sat. I promised not to run the car through the wash and they cleared the code, road tested it and said I can pick it up after work.

Now when I cleared the code on the 30th of January myself it lasted 4 days and 47 miles before coming on AND no carwash either, just an FYI.

What do the 2 of you think about this "fix" from the techline

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