Ceramiclear Paints - Be Careful

[mg6045]

First of all: Don't take this the personally, I might not be the best detailer around, but I do know about (and own) supercars... Nothing personal below, picture me smiling while reading this.

EVERY single car, no matter the sticker price will be shipped to North America in a container or simply exposed to the elements on the deck of a gigantic boat, even Ferrari and Lamborghini (been there, done that)... BEFORE the car arrives at the dealer, it will go trough a car wash with those sandy terry towels basically to remove all the ship/sea gunk, this is done by the transportation company, the dealer has NO saying whatsoever... Even if you hire your favorite transportation company to bring your Zonda straight from Italy, the driver will have to wipe down the car...


Also, please tell me which Mercedes cost $500k. Even the SLS model costs only $220k and can be had for $180k (been there, done that). Heck I own a Maybach 57s and it costs only $400k (And it's far superior to ANY Mercedes in ANY aspect).



I completely agree that clear coats should be thicker and also agree that car companies should think about the big picture and stop working backwards, but expect the car to be 100% swirl free from the factory floor... That's unrealistic (unless it's a Rolls-Royce, been there done that)

The only company that actually cares about future detailers is McLaren, they lay down 3 layers of clear coat on every single MP4-12c... When I asked the Plant Manager about that, he said "So the owners can polish the car several times over" (his words).


Again, not trying to call anyone out, but I'd like to stop and keep misconceptions from developing further..

many cars arrive off of the boat and into the dealer without defects on them. I would say more cars arrive pristine rather than riddled with defects. Somewhere along the line somebody is probably touching some of the car, I agree. But you usually have a better chance of your vehicle showing up at the dealer (pre PDI) with no defects. More than 75% of the vehicles are now covered in protective plastic.

Also, could you please further explain WHICH misconceptions you are trying to stop from "developing further" ?

The only thing I saw you post that was relevant to a misconception was the price for a mercedes likely being exaggerated some (no biggie).

Also, Mike P wrote this :

"A BRAND NEW vehicle with a Ceramiclear finish shouldn't need any kind of correction work."

I dont think thats a misconception. Because like I posted earlier in most case's you have a better chance of your car arriving off the boat defect free, rather than WITH defects. So I disagree that his post was a misconception.

The only thing I got out of your post was the fact that you stated and reiterated the fact that you own and know everything about owning a supercar. (something you made clear more than 3 times in your post. Actually 5 times).

Believe it or not, but Supercars have a history of arriving to the owners in worse shape than your standard 25K dollar car. But you already knew that. More ferrari's, and lambo's arrive to the states with sanding marks, holigrams and burnt edges than a toyota prius. For more information on this just do a google search for Todd Cooperider from Esoteric Detail, and look into his writeups and detail blog's on all the latest and greatest supercars that come straight off the boat to his shop.

So please further explain these misconceptions that are being posted in this thread that need to stop ?

[Mike Phillips]

Ive read every single article Mike has written

That's a lot of reading...

and i'm doubting this thread was made as a scare tactic to not polish cermaiclear.

Correct.



This article wasn't a scare tactic to prevent anyone from polishing a car with a Ceramiclear finish but instead to make two point, which I thought I did?

1. Be careful - It's part of the title.
Always use the least aggressive product to get the job done which is something a lot of people post and quote as do I but I actually wrote out what the saying means and explain it here,





2. Be aware - Pay attention to your Test Spot
If you're working on a factory Ceramiclear finish and Red Flags start to raise up, like I shared that Sean Kelly was experiencing, do some investigative work and make sure you're not being set-up to take the fall for some other guys botched buff job.


For both points above, re-read my original post.

[TrKent]

Mike,
Do you know about Ford's Tri-Coat metallic paint? Is it thicker than normal automotive paints? I am measure between 155 & 180 Microns on my Focus ST. Could it be possible that there is a thicker ceramic portion on this paint?

Here is a 2011 mustang which should have had a ceramic clear coat but that was obviously removed:

[Ronnie]

I know over in the UK the ST models come with thicker paint readingsover the base models but some colours are 3 stage paints meaning there is an extra coat of paint. I know those reading are the same as on my ST Mondeo if thats any help.

[swanicyouth]

Mike,
Do you know about Ford's Tri-Coat metallic paint? Is it thicker than normal automotive paints? I am measure between 155 & 180 Microns on my Focus ST. Could it be possible that there is a thicker ceramic portion on this paint?

Here is a 2011 mustang which should have had a ceramic clear coat but that was obviously removed:

Does ceramic necessarily mean "thicker"?

[TrKent]

Does ceramic necessarily mean "thicker"?

What I was thinking is that the 'Tri-Coat' paints might be thicker.

[Shortspark]

I have a 2012 ML350. I paid extra for an option color called "Diamond White". How can I tell what kind of paint this is?

[rmagnus]

Well this resurrected thread is certainly interesting. Very educational. I have no experience with this Ceramiclear Paint but am at least aware of it now.

Having taken a break from custom painting the industry has made a big move to water based product. I worked with some of it when doing airbrushing. HOK was my favorite to work with and still prefer their clears. PPG also has a great reputation.

Thanks for all the great info.

[Shortspark]

I went to a Mercedes forum and asked my question there about the kind of paint on my "Diamond White" ML350. The answer I'll quote below is from a Mercedes sales representative whose office (I believe) is in Arkansas. Here is his response:

"The paint process on certain AMG models including Black Editions, matee paint, and the SLS are entirely different than the paint process/material used on Mercedes production cars.

That said - the clear coat used on your Diamond White" does qualify as a "ceramic clear coat" of a different type described by the "Dr". (The "Dr." refers to a paint expert I quoted to the Mercedes rep which came from one of Mike's earlier posts here on this subject).

This is straight from my collision guys - who not only are MB Certified but are also certified and highly respected nationwide on the AMG finishes as well.

Frankly, for best paint protection for your new Diamond White I personally would recommend a "polish" such as Einszett Glanz Wax (Blue top) or a Black Fire polish product.

With a correct polish on your clean/new Diamond White - then any add-on wax on top can easily be done with a spray "nano-carnuba".

With the specific Einszett product, that is a wipe-on a smooth thin coat, let dry/cure for 30 min, and then wipe off the haze with a microfiber towel".

I'm not sure he knows all that much about the products and the detail process but I have to believe he is accurate on the paint.

[RMM]

I have a 2012 ML350. I paid extra for an option color called "Diamond White". How can I tell what kind of paint this is?

Read this:

http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/...tml#post634104