Some help with an old fiberglass roof

[Crazy Amos]

I am currently working on an old mid 90's something Dodge Conversion van that has a raised fiberglass roof to accommodate the TV and VCR in the interior.

The roof is extremely oxidized with hairline cracks running all over from the expanding, contracting and flexing. The brown metallic paint is EXTREMELY thin due to the lack of protection all these years. It reminds me of a leopard to be honest; there are dark spots and light spots all over so I need to be very gentle with it. I knew going in that it wasn’t going to be fun, but had no idea it was going to be this bad. Picture a dried up pond.

The problem I am having is this; I can’t do ANYHTING to it! My original plan was to use some 205 with a white LC pad to at least smooth it out and give a little bit of a shine allowing it to reflect SOME light. It has no reflection the way it sits.

Getting to “the problem”

As soon as my pad touches the paint, the polish is gulped by the paint leaving behind a white haze similar to dried wax on plastic trim. (I can’t even get 2 passes in after spreading it) The polish (liquid) is absorbed through the cracks, and I’m thinking at a microscopic level, into the fiberglass. The only way to quickly remove it is to use a QD that provides enough moisture to allows the paint to release the residue.

After some thinking, I decided I would soak it with 4 applications of Megs #7 to quench its thirst by replenishing some of the oils and reducing its absorbency, hoping to then rework the 205. The #7 worked to a degree; the paint is darker and bolder but didn’t provide the shine most people relate to #7. The paints feels soft-er, and more slick leading me to believe the oils were absorbed.

After that I decided to top it with some 845 hoping to get the littlest bit of shine I could be happy with because I really don’t want to polish it. Well, the wax didn’t do much at all.

So now, I have a test spot with 4 apps of #7 and a coat of 845. Should I attempt to rework the 205, or go with what I have? If it doesn’t work, I will have to reapply the #7 4x’s and then add another coat of 845. But if it does, I will have more work to do. I really like the idea of just applying the #7 and topping it off-at least it will be sealed.

This is taking way too long!

What do you guys suggest? I am all ears.

I am only doing 1 step on the panels; 1 coat of an AIO and 1 white pad, but replaced when needed.

I would like to keep the roof process to a minimum.

Thanks in advance everyone.

[Mike Phillips]

As soon as my pad touches the paint, the polish is gulped by the paint leaving behind a white haze similar to dried wax on plastic trim.

Paint or Gelcoat?

Regardless, if it's oxidized single stage paint for Fiberglas Gel-coat, both are very porous and dry out and then you experience what you stated, it acts like it's gulping or soaking up all the liquid of your product.

What works best for dry coatings like single stage paint or a neglected gel coat finish is to use something oily on them like the M07 Show Car Glaze, the M03 Machine Glaze, or the M80 Speed Glaze, the #7 and #7 on non-abrasive and the M80 contains diminishing abrasives, it's like #7 on Steroids.

What you want to do is chop the dead, oxidized material off and then gorge the coating of gel coat with the oily polish, this will revitalize it and restore the color and then seal it in with a couple of coats of wax.

Vans like you speak of usually sit outside 24 hours a day, 7 days a week because they are too large to fit into a garage and so the sun and inclement weather, (wet weather), accelerates oxidation and deterioration and it's possible to get to the point of no return.

If the top is not important to you like a show car is important to you, I've washed extreme oxidized gel-coats and even single stage paints with things like Bon Ami and Comet, and a terry cloth wash rag and scrubbed the dead, dried-out oxidized material off and then after doing the grunt work this way then started in on restoring the finish using one of the above products.


Past the point of no return
Again, it could be past the point of no return. For things where the stability of the coating or material is in question, here's what I do.

Work on just a section, that is remove the oxidation and work the section up to as nice a finish as you can or as nice a finish that is possible AND THEN put the vehicle back into it's normal service duty and see if your results hold up over time. If they do you'll know if you buff out the entire "thing" that it will hold up over time.

If the small section dies back to ugly, then don't waste your time as your work probably won't hold up as the coating, (that's paint), or material, (that would be Gel-coat), is past the point of no return.

[tuscarora dave]

tfullercdi, that sounds like the vans that I work on. By your description it sounds like it is gel coat that has been painted over. If that's the case I would go with the Comet or Bon-Ami like Mike has suggested. and then use a cleaner wax to give it a little protection and call it quits.

I feel the way you are feeling about this every time I get a call about doing a bus or van for this guy because he buys vehicles that have never been cared for and they all soak up wax or polish instantly. I have tried all sorts of quick fix type of solutions for this super oxidized gel coat.

The only solution that I have found is to use a rotary with a cheap heavy compound that I get from a auto dealership supply and a wool pad to (as Mike stated) chop off the heavy oxidation, then I follow that with with a cheap cleaner wax with the rotary and the same wool pad (after spurring the pad). After chopping the heavy oxidation off it actually takes the cleaner wax well.

On gelcoat van roofs I apply a lot of product to the wool pad and then work it deep into the wool pad with my fingers. This way 100% of the pad is working for you and there is less splatter, I start out at 900 RPM and work the area for about 2 section passes then bump the speed up to about 2500 RPM and work it for an additional 2 section passes. Sometimes I need to repeat this entire process to attain the gloss I am after. Then I spur the pad and do the same thing with the cleaner wax in the same section before moving on to compound the next section.

These glass tops require that you use a lot of product to get results. That is why I get the products from a local supply house that has their own product line. Cheap professional grade products are generally loaded with oils and mineral spirits so they work well for these neglected vans and only cost around $20-$30 a gallon.

[Mike Phillips]

How about a picture?

Like get up on a ladder looking down and take a picture of the top of the Van?

[Crazy Amos]

I sure will guys, i will post it later tonight when I get home from work. I am limited on my internet access here. Thanks for getting back to me gotta go before 3:45

[Crazy Amos]

Snapped some pics of the roof tonight, be prepared, its pretty bad. Keep in mind, the only thing I am looking for is a better look. Not necessarily shiny persay but just not as chalky.

I don't plan to do anything to the "very" top that is over the cabin, only the front fairing you can see from the ground, the flats above the driver and passengers seats, and the sides that can also be seen. IMO the very top is too far gone and will never be seen anyway, but if you think I can bring it back to some extent I am willing to give it a shot.

I haven't dealt with anything like this before and I WILL NOT let it get the best of me. The way I look at it, is this is a trial and error run. My dad owns the van and doesnt care what I do, he just wants me to shine it up a bit to help it sell.

The rest of the van is cleaning up pretty good with just a VERY quick app of a cheap cleaner wax I get from a local detailing company. I will post the end result in another thread when its done.

Without further ado, here it is.

I let the garage warm up a little too long while my daughter and I ate supper. Over did it just a tad......




For some reason the complete front view of the hood won't upload, but I have the whole view in 2 seperate shots.

Above the drivers seat (untouched)

The hazing on the left is from the #7 & 845. The step in the section is from me switching from rotary to DA. I can reach further with my DA.




Above the passenger seat.

Wasn't quite as bad as the driver side before I touched it, but close.

I hit it with wool and rotary tonight with the same cleaner wax followed by #7. Regained a schmidgen of shine. You can see the hazing outline from last night. The part with some shine was actually two seperate sections.



View from back to front. The rectangle is actually a solar panel. Kinda wierd huh? Its around 15 years old.

The white specks in the bottom right corner is not missing paint, its sling from working on the side below it.



Very back. The big spots ARE missing paint.



This is one of the sides I would like to brighten. Deep cracks in the paint-if you wanted you could probably peel the paint off using them. To help visualize because of the poor quality and shading, they remind me of a dried up pond.



Another side shot.



And another....




I hope these help.

What do you think, can it be saved?

Thanks again guys.

[Crazy Amos]

Bump to today.....

[Crazy Amos]

Bump bump

[Mike Phillips]

The section you buffed and then applied the #7 looks a lot better, would you agree? Not perfect but forward progress. What I would try is buffing the section again and see if a little more polishing work now that the heavy chopping has been done makes it look even more better.

Then, seal it really well with whatever you're planning on using already and then put it back outside and into service for a couple of weeks and see if the results hold up. If they do then tackle the rest of the roof. If they don't hold up and the paint starts turning white like in the picture below, that indicates that the paint, which is resin and pigments, has become unstable.



Unstable is the term I coined for dealing with paints that have passed the point of no return. Actually coined the term in about 1991 or 1992 after learning the hard way and buffing out a 1951 Mercury to perfection only to watch the dark maroon paint turn white again after only a few hours of exposure to the summer sun.

Or...

Just buff it out as good as you can, seal it up and then put it up for sale and move onto a new project.

[Crazy Amos]

The section you buffed and then applied the #7 looks a lot better, would you agree? Not perfect but forward progress. What I would try is buffing the section again and see if a little more polishing work now that the heavy chopping has been done makes it look even more better.

I do think it looks better. I think it has a little more shine to give but I would like to try the Speed Glaze, just to see what it can do. This is a good one to learn off of.

Then, seal it really well with whatever you're planning on using already and then put it back outside and into service for a couple of weeks and see if the results hold up. If they do then tackle the rest of the roof. If they don't hold up and the paint starts turning white like in the picture below, that indicates that the paint, which is resin and pigments, has become unstable.



Unstable is the term I coined for dealing with paints that have passed the point of no return. Actually coined the term in about 1991 or 1992 after learning the hard way and buffing out a 1951 Mercury to perfection only to watch the dark maroon paint turn white again after only a few hours of exposure to the summer sun.

That must have been a kick in the gut. That would take the wind right out of my sails...

The center of the fairing was actually darker after I applied the #7 & 845 the first night but as you can see from the pics it went back to haziness.

Or...

Just buff it out as good as you can, seal it up and then put it up for sale and move onto a new project.

I think I will go this route. Normally I would go with option number one, but he is wanting to get this sold as quick as possible to get it out of his driveway.

I am going to try and bring it back as best as I can and hope it holds up for the next person. It may go back in the long run but it is definately a great learning experience.

I will post the finished pics regardless of the outcome for everyones reference.

Thanks for all of the help Mike.

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