Considering selling flex 3401 and buying griots random

[Mike Phillips]

Just to add for clarification...


Forced rotation ONLY = rotary buffer


FLEX 3401 = Forced rotation and forced oscillation

Makita PO500C = Forced rotation and forced oscillation

RUPES Mille LK 900E - Forced rotation and forced oscillation



The only reason I point this out is I tend to be a "Word Guy"' as words mean things and most of the time I see people typing about gear-driven orbital polishers they only describe ONE ACTION when in fact there are two actions.

[Mike Phillips]

This is always a fun topic!

I agree. Love talking tools with car detailing guys.... (and ladies)



Also am going to interject this article I wrote back in March of this year for everyone that will read this thread into the future...


FLEX 3401 or RUPES? - A question I get asked a lot! -Mike Phillips






No matter which tool you're thinking about buying.... click the link, read the info, it will help you to budget accordingly. That's all too.... no argument on my part as to which brand to go with, just what to plan for as it relates to your purchase.


BIG PICTURE

The big picture is this... no matter which tool you purchase, becoming GREAT with the tool is a matter of using great products, the right pad for the job and then investing the time behind the tool to become good with it.

When you master the tool... you an make it dance on the paint...

[Mike Phillips]

.


I used each one of these tools last night and except for the TOB, all of them removed swirls and scratches...











And I have them all set out in the garage right now for tonight's class. So if you're in driving range of Stuart, Florida, then come on by and have some fun!

[Joel1979]

I would write that to read,


"Free spinning orbital polishers, (no matter what the brand), only correct if pad rotation is maintained no matter what the shape of the body panel"


If the pad is not both rotating and oscillating, (for an orbital polisher), then you're not removing paint and thus you're not removing defects.


A pad simply vibrating against paint may remove some paint if you have the time to wait but one thing I've noticed about most detailers and even enthusiasts, they want the correction step and any polishing steps to take less time, not more time.

So i guess that Rupes 15 beats 21 because it spins faster and throw doesnt matter. And duetto is even more powerful then. Imagine you take sandpaper on your hand and do random orbital movement against paint and nothing happens?

The bigger the throw is the less important spinning is. With 21 throw Rupes it should be 70/30.

[Mike Phillips]

So i guess that Rupes 15 beats 21 because it spins faster and throw doesnt matter.

I have know idea what you mean?



By reading through your posting history, you appear to be a fan of RUPES polishers.


I'm good with that... heck... I'm the only guy on earth that has written a how-to book on RUPES tools which is an attempt at helping people master their tools and their system.




(link to book is in my Signature Line)


So I'm not sure what your point is?

[Mike Phillips]

So i guess that Rupes 15 beats 21 because it spins faster and throw doesnt matter.

Here's something I did last week, (taught a class on how to use the RUPES paint polishing system. And then took all the pictures and did a full write-up.


RUPES EASY GLOSS System - EXTREME MAKEOVER - 2006 Toyota Tundra - YEARS of neglect!



BEFORE





AFTER





How it was done --> RUPES EASY GLOSS SYSTEM






Name one other person that did this for RUPES or any tool company last week? Last month? Last year?



I think there's another 70 pictures and TONS of how-to information in just this one article dealing with all aspects of how to detail a car PLUS how to use RUPES tools, pads and products...


RUPES EASY GLOSS System - EXTREME MAKEOVER - 2006 Toyota Tundra - YEARS of neglect!

[Joel1979]

I have know idea what you mean?



By reading through your posting history, you appear to be a fan of RUPES polishers.


I'm good with that... heck... I'm the only guy on earth that has written a how-to book on RUPES tools which is an attempt at helping people master their tools and their system.


So I'm not sure what your point is?

Yes i am, but i also have Flex pe 14-2 and mille. All of those are.great but.by far my favourites are long throws.

My point is that you underestimate throws effect and make it sound that its all about pad spinning. That.it is true with short throw machines but not at all with long throw machines. And if its all about spinning then duetto corrects faster than 21 because it spins faster. Well we all know that its not the case.

[Mike Phillips]

Yes i am, but i also have Flex pe 14-2 and mille. All of those are.great but.by far my favourites are long throws.

My point is that you underestimate throws effect and make it sound that its all about pad spinning. That.it is true with short throw machines but not at all with long throw machines. And if its all about spinning then duetto corrects faster than 21 because it spins faster. Well we all know that its not the case.

I love your passion for what I call,

The art of polishing paint


Consider writing and publishing some articles to share your passion, that's what I do. Include pictures too...


It's very rewarding helping others both in the online world and in the real world...


That's what I'm doing right now. I just finished going through the pictures I took yesterday using close to 20 tools with the new Meguiar's D166. Now I'm going to rename each picture file and then resize and then upload to the gallery.

After that I'll add words to go with the pictures and hopefully share with others some real-world experience with this new cleaner/wax.

[Mike@ShineStruck]

OPM/RPM and Mm offset/throw are equally important in regards to Correction speed.
If one is lacking you need to compensate with the other.

Perfect example is the new po5000c and upcomming Mille to the 3401...less throw compensated for more opm an rpm..

Or the long throws to the standard throw polisher....12-21 mm to 8mm


As for correcting when stalled..its possible with a 21mm as along as your dragging the stalled, but oscillating pad back and fourth on panel .(massage technique)
ive done it on a 08 quad cab ram.
..never tried competely stationary nor with anything less the 21mm

Rupes said they upped the OPM on the 15 to keep up with the 21mm but ive heard it doesnt...so apparently not enough compensation to match the 21mm polisher(only thing I havent tested nor confirmed as I dont have Rupes and only have G21)


My findings with the po5000c is that its easily a pass quicker then the 3401

[jjamesh87]

.

Is the second from the left something new or am i just living under a rock?

Jesse