~*Just bought Flex!!*~ some Help from experts plz( PADS...etc)

[EuroTech]

In terms of pads for Cut Polish & Finish LC Hybrid Would you recommend something in-between these or will these ones work well..
Cut Orange
Polish White
Finish Black
I'd like to be able to work on newer car and paint in need of care 4+ years will these suffice?

[medicscott]

Could not agree any more with all of the above comments within this thread, Hybrid/Menzerna combo is sick, I was a die hard Pinnacle loyalist, but cant ignore the facts. I still use a ton of Pinnacle products, but for compound/polish the Germans figured it out just a little better I guess...

[Mike@DedicatedPerfection]

In terms of pads for Cut Polish & Finish LC Hybrid Would you recommend something in-between these or will these ones work well..
Cut Orange FG400
Polish White SF4000
Finish Black SF4500
I'd like to be able to work on newer car and paint in need of care 4+ years will these suffice?

These are the basic necessities to have on hand to get started and will tackle just about anything thrown at your way within reason.

Later on if you need more or less cut you can pick up a Hybrid wool for more cut or Hybrid blue for less cut.

Same goes for the polishing and finishing pads. Yellow for a bit less cut and higher finish.

In all of my testing, SF4000 on white was able to pull up anything left behind from the first cutting step while finishing out really well. This includes finishing up the paint even after the PE14, Hybrid wool pad, and Menzerna SC300.

[EuroTech]

These are the basic necessities to have on hand to get started and will tackle just about anything thrown at your way within reason.

Later on if you need more or less cut you can pick up a Hybrid wool for more cut or Hybrid blue for less cut.

Same goes for the polishing and finishing pads. Yellow for a bit less cut and higher finish.

iIn all of my testing, SF4000 on white was able to pull up anything left behind from the first cutting step while finishing out really well. This includes finishing up the paint even after the PE14, Hybrid wool pad, and Menzerna SC300.

Ok All these SF, SC etc are confusing so looking them up.

Cant find SC300 what does the acronym refer too?

So To begin I should look at buying both the SF4000 & SF4500?

1) I thought that the finish black pad was used with a sealant. It doesn't have any abrasive but you still find prefer this pad too use with SF4500?
2)So this is a 3 part correction process, and a 1+ part protection( I can do carnauba after something like wolf gang, or is there a better follow up?)
3)What would my results be doing 2 step correction FG400 followed by SF4000, vs. adding the SF 4500?

4) So the black pad is used for the last step correction, as well as the sealant?

[refreshauto]

I have followed Mike's procedure and havent looked back. 3401 with the hybrid pads is a great combo.

[psnt1ol]

These are the basic necessities to have on hand to get started and will tackle just about anything thrown at your way within reason.

Later on if you need more or less cut you can pick up a Hybrid wool for more cut or Hybrid blue for less cut.

Same goes for the polishing and finishing pads. Yellow for a bit less cut and higher finish.

In all of my testing, SF4000 on white was able to pull up anything left behind from the first cutting step while finishing out really well. This includes finishing up the paint even after the PE14, Hybrid wool pad, and Menzerna SC300.

Couldn't agree with Mike more..... I hardly ever would need an extra step after SF4000 to clear up the paint (post compounding). To be exact, I can only recall one incident when I jewel the paint with SF4500 with a black pad after the SF4000 / white hybrid combo. I could barely tell the difference afterwards.

My advice to OP.... there is no magic formula where product A with product B on STEP 1 .... follow up with C with D for STEP 2 ...then use E with F for STEP 3 = Guarantee glossy and shiny paint every time.

If such formula is found, forums such as AG will cease to exist. IMO .... the technique is more important than the product if I have to choose one over another. You have to spend a little time with the flex to realize the full potential of the machine.

The 5 inch hybrid pads with the 4" backing plate is best combo to start your learning. If your technique is not sound, you will most likely to experience the "walking effect" with the larger pad. Here is the secret.... learn how to keep the pad flat to the surface. With the smaller pad, you will have a little more leverage over the machine and this will give you a better experience. The only drawback for the 5" pad is time. It takes much longer to finish a panel than a larger pad mainly due to the smaller pad surface area.

Pressure and the size of the work area will also affect your outcome. This plus a few good liquid/pad combo (with a bit of practice) will give you the best chance of having great consistent results.

[aim4squirrels]

A pad with no cut, will not impart it's own scratches into the paint. That's what you want to use with a super fine polish like Menzerna's SF4500.

SF= super finish. FG=fast gloss, SC= super cut? Don't get too hung up on the nomenclature.

The hybrid pads are beveled inward where the Velcro attaches to the backing plate which is why the 5" hybrid pads work with the LC 4" backing plate and the stock 5.5" plate that comes with the Flex works with the larger 6.5" pads.

As far as SF4000 vs. SF4500, according to Menzerna, they should both finish out the same. If you are looking to do FG400 as the compounding step, I'd recommend SF4000 on a white pad as the follow up. It'll take out the micromarring that FG400 might leave behind. If you wanted to attempt a super fine polishing step, then SF4500 would be the next step down on a finishing pad so that only a super fine abrasive with no pad cut would be used.

Diminishing abrasives start as a larger particle and then break down smaller and smaller as you polish. So if new product mixes with used product (we call it spent product here), the new larger particles undo some of your work. That's why Mike recommend flat pads vs. ones with dimples like the CCS pads.

Super micro abrasive particles are smaller than initial DAT particles (at the same level of cut, comparing compounds to compounds, then polishes, etc.) but the particles are uniform in size and are very hard and don't break apart. The cut is the same from beginning to end of the buffing cycle.

I believe DAT has been around longer than SMAT (at least in wide spread usage), but both are good technologies. Some folks like DAT based polishes as they claim they finish out better (they perceive a better end result) but some people prefer SMAT as you can spritz it with a bit of water and keep buffing the area and still continue to correct the paint, and they get amazing results too. SMAT polishes actually work quite well with pads that have dimples as the fresh polish will only serve to allow you to buff longer and it keeps it from drying on the panel and dusting or clumping and being a bear to wipe off.

I prefer Menzerna's DAT line of products, and I absolutely love the Uber Compound that they made for Wolfgang, a local house brand here. They have longer buffing cycles (stay wet for a long time) than most products and wipe off very easily in comparison to other polishes and compounds I have tried.

[Mike@DedicatedPerfection]

Ok All these SF, SC etc are confusing so looking them up.

Don't think too much about the wording on the front half. What is important is the numbering system that follows it. The lower the number denotes a more aggressive compound. Meaning it will offer more cut. The higher the number relates to its polishing abilities. Meaning the higher it will finish.

Cant find SC300 what does the acronym refer too?

I abbreviate this one as it is actually SHCC300. Super Heavy Cut Compound 300. SC300 for short.
Menzerna Super Heavy Cut Compound (SHC 300) 8 oz.

So To begin I should look at buying both the SF4000 & SF4500?

Make sure you pick up FG400 as your compound to have on hand in case your test spot with SF4000 on white does not return the results you are looking for.

1) I thought that the finish black pad was used with a sealant. It doesn't have any abrasive but you still find prefer this pad too use with SF4500?
2)So this is a 3 part correction process, and a 1+ part protection( I can do carnauba after something like wolf gang, or is there a better follow up?)
3)What would my results be doing 2 step correction FG400 followed by SF4000, vs. adding the SF 4500?

4) So the black pad is used for the last step correction, as well as the sealant?

1. You can use the black pad either with SF4500 or your LSP.
2. It can be a three, four, or more step process depending on how you look at it. That's up to you.
3. On your every day drivers and light colored paint, stop with SF4000 on white and put down your LSP. For dark colored paint, toy car, show car etc, the paint will benefit from a third step with SF4500 on black IME.
4. Yes

No love for hydro tech pads?

I love the 3" pads for precision polishing when equipped on my PE14.

[EuroTech]

Thank you every one for your invaluable advise. I just placed a large order, no turning back now ;-) ll left is to purchase the book and start reading ( should I just stick with the flex book or would recommend the detailing book as well, Is it necessary or can I find the majority of the essentials info online?) and learning and hopefully not from too many mistakes.... I am debating on doing a write up however considering my novice experience compared to the numerous pro's on here i'm second guessing it for the first few details, maybe on my 3rd or 4th I can speak form more experince. However I if it would be of help to some one else let me know and I will track my experience with pics and thoughts on first detail.

[Mike@DedicatedPerfection]

There is always something to learn. Your best bet is to pick up both books to help you really get a good understanding. Sure there is plenty of valuable information here on the forum but with Mike's books you can grab the book for reference at any time.

Once you get going with your new found knowledge from the books put what you have learned to use and work on a few vehicles to further your knowledge and get some hands on experience.