Your reason for being pro or anti fillers...discuss

[Busy mind]

There's a few instances where I'm against fillers.

-If you're trying to pass off "paint correction" by using them to mask your incomplete set of skills.
-Lack of durability with fillers, and can affect LSP(until recently).

The Pro side of thinking.

-Reduces amount of paint being removed. This may actually be a favor for those who want shine but continue to neglect their vehicle with proper washing methods.
-Adds to the visual enhancement for the 98% who are content with "shiny".

What are your thoughts?

[builthatch]

like anything, i think a product that fills has its place.

if the person you are dealing with is ok with a temporary solution that looks way better than it actually is, fine. this could be due to ignorance, cost, simplicity...whatever.

if the car has minimal clear left or it's just generally a risky proposition for one reason or another, fine.

but, the above is referring to what we normally call "glazes" or products that have glaze features. what Essence is being sold as appears to be a semi-permanent solution to the age old temporary issues of products with fillers. however, it's also my impression that Essence is filling at a much higher resolution than what people typically use a traditional glaze for, thus, Essence, if the marketing behind it is accurate, is more of a technology leap than what we are all used to when referring to filling. what i mean is...the filling is simply making it look better than it might look with polishing alone. that is neat. and because it is being purported to "merge" with their coating products, we are now talking about a pretty heavy system to make a filling product semi-permanent.

that said, i have no use for this sort of product and thus, don't use it. i don't use glazes or things like Essence, Artificial Clear, etc.

[AGOatemywallet]

What about Chemical Guys EZ Glaze under a Sealant

I used it with Wolfgang Deep Gloss Paint Sealant with great success

It seemed to fill and deepen the finish and did not negatively affect the longevity of the sealant


Used Essence with CQuartz UK this weekend....WOW!

[FUNX650]

I can't overlook the fact that many LSPs
are both renowned...and infamous...
for having "filling characteristics".


Bob

[TuxedoTaurus]

On a daily driver I'm all for fillers that are not removed by normal washing. The objective is have a great looking finish with minute to defect free appearance while preserving the clear coat.

If it is a garage queen or show car then I don't want fillers, or orange peel in that case. I want a pure flawless finish.

When detailing for money it is all about honesty with the customer, and what they are comfortable with.

[ski2]

Doesn't Prima Amigo also have durable polymer fillers??

[Mike Phillips]

Do lubricating oils fall under the definition of fillers?

If so... how would you tell them apart?

When abrading scratch-sensitive paint and the goal is to make the paint look good, how good would the paint look if you remove the lubrication oils out of compounds and polishes?


I've seen so many discussions on the topic of fillers and the one thing I always see that's missing is people forget the big picture and that the entire reason any of us are compounding and polishing paint is to make it look good.

Then people get all hung up on fillers and forget that the polishing oils while they are in the formula to buffer the abrading action so the abrasives don't simply SCOUR the paint as a secondary effect they will tend to fill.

If you remove the polishing oils you've removed an ingredient that fills, (isn't that what all the anti-filler people want?) but now you've lost the lubricating aspect and how are you going to abrade paint and make it look good without some type of lubricant?

Circle back to the big picture - making paint look good.


You guys can discuss fillers as much as you want as for me it's never been a consideration because at the end of the day I'm going to,

1. Wash
2. Compound
3. Polish
4. Wax

And if I did everything right the paint is going to look amazing regardless if I even knew if the products I used contained fillers or didn't contain fillers.

To me it just seems like such a non-issue with a finite number of quality products to choose from.

I talk a lot on this forum about abrasive technology and how some products have GREAT abrasive technology and some don't.

If you use products with great abrasive technology then regardless of whether they contain fillers or not the paint is going to look great.

If you use products with mediocre abrasive technology then you tend to get mediocre results and most of you have seen what I'm talking about when using orbital polishers it's called DA Haze or micro-marring or tick marks. That is the abrasives are leaving their own scratch in the paint and again... regardless of whether their are fillers in the formula or not.

Stick with reputable brands and use good technique with the appropriate pad and tool and that really is the best any of us can do.

[Mike Phillips]

Doesn't Prima Amigo also have durable polymer fillers??

Remember, polymer is used on detailing forums as a catch-all word.

A polymer is simply a repeating chain of monomers.

Pinch the skin on your arm between your thumb and your index finger and you're pinching polymers.


Carnauba wax is a polymer.

[Desertnate]

Like many, I feel they have their place. Probably moreso for personal fleets than customer vehicles.

Personally, I use them in the Fall simply to spruce up up the appearance as I do the winter prep on my vehicles. The vehicles will get abused in the winter and any correction will only last a short period of time, so it's not worth the time. In the Spring, I'll do a true correction vs hiding defects.

[Busy mind]

I've been reading a lot of the forums and following others detailing pages, and that's what triggered the questions. It seemed from the majority of reading that people were against glazes and such artificial enhancements were an abomination.
To me it seems that if you're caring for long term customers, you're going to want to use the least aggressive approach while trying to get the best results. Sometimes this may require a glaze but for whatever reason others are so hard set against this, it almost makes me feel guilty to consider using glazes.

Interesting to see some other views on this.