What would you all suggest with regards to working this spot out of my hood? How aggressive will I need to be?
Attachment 69732
Printable View
What would you all suggest with regards to working this spot out of my hood? How aggressive will I need to be?
Attachment 69732
What, if anything, have you tried ? That doesn't look like it would be much of a problem to remove so start out with something light like an AIO such as Blackfire One Step.
I’ve tried a DA with Pinnacle’s Advance Swirl Remover, but it wasn’t really working out.
Quote:
Originally Posted by NS4W
Here's the picture. Looks like a stain of some sort that has penetrated INTO the clear layer of paint to some level?
https://www.autogeekonline.net/forum...img-1773-2-jpg
Instead of simply answering your question, because this type of topic comes up a LOT. I wrote an brand new article.
Topical Defects vs Sub-Surface Defects - Living life on the edge of the razor blade
Here's a saying I've said for years and below I show you how it applies to doing paint correction.
When I was younger I used to live my life on the edge of the razor blade. Now that I'm older I tend to live my life on the blade of the butter knife. -Mike Phillips
Topical Defects vs Sub-Surface Defects
Here's the deal, all paint defects can be placed into one of these two categories.
1: Topical Defects
- Surface stains
- Oxidation
- Road Film or Traffic Film
- Surface impurities
- Type I Water Spots
- Type I Bird Dropping - Topical Stain Etching
- Old wax, sealant or coating
- Paint Transfer
2: Sub-Surface Defects
- Swirls
- Scratches
- Micro-marring from abrasives
- Micro-marring from pad - also called Pad Haze
- Hologram scratches
- RIDS - Random Isolated Deeper Scratches
- Type II Water Spots - Imprint Rings
- Type II Water Spots - Crater Etchings
- Type II Water Spots - Sub-surface water stains - usually only single stage paint
- Type II Bird Dropping - Fractured/Wrinkled Etching
- Sanding marks or sanding scratches
- Tracers
- Pigtails
- Scuffing
It's normally fairly easy to remove Topical Defects starting with simple remedies such as washing the car, wiping the car, using a non-abrasive paint cleaner or using any compound, polish or cleaner/wax.
Removing Sub-Surface defects always means removing some measure of paint to LEVEL the highest portions of the paint surface with the lowest depth of the paint defect. This means always using product that contain abrasives and/or sandpaper.
The LIMIT as to what can and what cannot be safely removed is determined by the paint thickness. Factory clearcoats are an average of 2 mills thin. A Post-it Note is approximately 3 mils thin. This means the clear layer of paint you have to work with or abrade is thinner than a Post-it Note. So before tackling any sub-surface defects, hold a Post-it Note between your thumb and index finder and this will ingrain in your brain just how thin this protective layer of paint is on your car.
Other considerations
UV Protection
All the UV protection for the entire matrix of paint, that is the e-coat, primer, basecoat and the clearcoat top layer is in the clearcoat top layer. The more paint you remove the less UV protection will be left to protect the entire matrix of paint over the service life of the car.
Burn-Through - Buff-through - Strike-Through
These are terms used to describe removing too much of the clearcoat top layer that you expose the basecoat or color coat layer of paint. IF you expose the clearcoat top layer the ONLY way to fix the damage is to,
Re-paint the affected area
This normally means you'll have a "blend line" on the panel. That is a definitive section where there is the original clearcoat and a "line" where the edge of the new layer of clearcoat ends after spraying only a section of the panel. A blend repair costs less than re-painting an entire panel and will normally be the option your car insurance covers. On light colored cars the "line" between original layer of paint and the new layer of clear paint will be difficult to see. On medium and dark colors it will be more noticeable and "no" you cannot buff away the blend line as this means you're buffing away the paint job and you will then expose the new basecoat sprayed under the new clearcoat to make the damaged area visually disappear.
Re-paint the panel
This means the entire panel, from edge to edge will be re-painted and thus there will be no blend line. This is the preferred method by car owners to have damage repaired but it will cost more and often times your insurance will not cover it.
Best Practice
Whenever you have a defect you want to try to remove, the best practice is,
Use the least aggressive approach to get the job done
If the least aggressive approach is not working to your satisfaction, then increase the level of aggressiveness in the procedure until you've reached your comfort level for removing paint from the surface.
My normal best practice will be to compound the area with either a foam cutting pad or a wool or microfiber pad for the normal 8 to 12 Section Passes and then stop. Sometimes this will remove the defect but a lot of times all it will do is improve the defect or defects making it or them more difficult to see. This is the safe approach.
Living life on the edge of the razor blade
If you're feeling gutsy - you can try to compound the area with the deeper defects you want to remove to see if they can be removed without going through the clearcoat. Here's how I do this,
Start by doing up to 8 to 12 Section Passes over the effected area. Stop and inspect.
If the defects are removed, move onto polishing and sealing the paint.
If the defects are not removed and you want to try more sections passes, then repeat the section pass motion only shrink the size of the area you're buffing down to about a 12" by 12" area and make approximately 4-5 section passes then stop and inspect. Repeat until you're happy.
If at any point you turn your tool over and see the color of the basecoat on the face of your buffing pad, well then here's my quote for that situation,
Words cannot describe the heart-sinking feeling that overwhelms you when you discover you've burned through the paint -Mike Phillips
Living life on the blade of the butter knife
My advice is for most people and most cars, (with the factory thin paint), go ahead and buff the area with a compound and cutting pad for approximately 8 to 12 section passes and then STOP. Whatever you get is what you get. Learn to live with the defect or defects and move on in life. In most cases you will have at a minimum improved the defect or defects to the point that they won't bother you as much and a lot of time you'll be the only person that knows where they are.
Throwing the dice
If you're felling lucky! And if the defects REALLY bugs you then here's what you do. Take your car to a couple of high quality body shops with stellar reputations among the hard-core car guys in your home town, this would be the body shops or (technically called Collision Shops), that others take their restoration projects too for a custom paint job. For example, this is where Jim took his 1965 Chevelle to get painted after he spent 6 years restoring the car.
Ask them how much money it will cost to repaint the entire panel where the defects are located?
If you're comfortable with this price and willing to pay it IF you buff through the clearcoat, then go for it. Buff and buff and buff until the defect is removed. Then in a worst-case scenario you do buff through the clearcoat, then you've already internally accepted the bad news and budgeted for a professional re-paint.
Hope this helps you to figure out how to proceed with the paint defects in your car's paint.
:)
Can't thank you enough Mike! That was beyond helpful! I'll try to buff the area with a compound and cutting pad as suggested and see how it goes :xyxthumbs:
Quote:
Originally Posted by NS4W
Please update us with your results.
:)
Will do!
So Mike, what clue did you see that allowed you to visually determine from the pic that it was sub-surface and not topical ? Or did you also take in to account his previous attemp at correction which failed ?