Having Trouble w/ Ultimate Compound Scratch & Swirl Removal (Sorry for long read!)

Hey all, short time lurker, first time poster; I hope this post is in the right place, and isn't too redundant with anecdotal issues. I've done plenty of searching on this forum as well as others trying to find a pretty close example to my issue, but haven't found an exact answer.

I've just gotten into the detailing hobby after getting a car that I really care to keep looking nice. This is my first time around working with a multiple step detail process. I made sure to do plenty of research beforehand, and I've done my best to follow good techniques with every step of the process covered so far.

So, dodging the rainy weather on my daily driver '08 A3, I've washed with my new PW/foam lance + two bucket combo (too much fun), clayed for what I assume is the first time in the car's life at 95k miles (purchased from the previous owner at 87k), and just made it to the cutting and polishing steps in the last few days. The paint isn't in terrible condition, but has a fair amount of swirling and scratches/chips that you might expect from an 8 year old daily driver that doesn't always get to sit in a garage, and probably didn't get extensive care from the original owner.

I have a few questions, but one major issue: I've been using Meguiar's Ultimate Compound on every panel of the car over the last couple days with a PC 7424XP, doing my best to follow all the technique and general tips & tricks that are out there. The hood, which I worked first, turned out pretty damn well; there are very few scratches and swirls left visible, with only minor chips and dents that I can't attend to with this process remaining. The top back panel (behind the dual sunroof panels, connecting to the lip/spoiler/whatever it would be categorized as) of the car turned out pretty satisfactory also, compared to its original condition, while not being perfectly up to my standards and perhaps garnering further attention when I can get the rest of the car to a satisfactory condition. I mention this because it seems to be a pattern: I have much better luck working the horizontal areas than any of the vertical ones, which cover a much larger surface area of the car overall.

Although I understand I probably won't be able to get everything out, the door panels just aren't cooperating the way the hood and top were. I've worked most of these areas two or three times over, with relatively little change. The UC has restored a bit of clarity and color depth to the paint, but the scratches themselves are very stubborn, especially near more uneven areas and crevices. I have a small bottle of Swirlx that I originally spot tested with on the hood that didn't seem to be quite up to the task, that I've thought about using on these problem areas, but I wasn't sure that it would make any difference if the more aggressive compound isn't touching them up very well either. In any case, I've gone over the vast majority of the car with the UC at least twice, and my 15oz bottle is ~75% empty, so if I need to go over these areas again with a tweaked technique and the same product I'll need another bottle, if that gives you an idea of how much I've been using. I originally started on the hood with my second heaviest Chemical Guys cutting pad, and eventually moved to my heaviest after seeing how troublesome the door panels are, with little to no change in result. Pic links attached to better explain the specifics of the problem areas within the door panels. Forgive my sloppy MS Paint work done with my laptop's trackpad in advance, lol.

http://i.imgur.com/AXL56ub.jpg Areas outlined in red are the only ones not worked yet; the smaller trim areas most likely have to be worked by hand, including the one on the door panel separated by tape, though that area is only separated because of some accentuating paint lines that UC started taking off on the passenger side of the car, which I worked before the driver's side.

http://i.imgur.com/VDHBfva.jpg In this image, the areas outlined in red have the heaviest and most stubborn scratching. Green is moderately stubborn and of lesser concern, and brown is the aforementioned area that will likely have to be worked by hand (which I'm dreading), with moderate swirling throughout.

http://i.imgur.com/eLqABnZ.jpg Closeup of most concerning problem area, marked in red from the second image.

http://i.imgur.com/YERd9Op.jpg Another closeup of problem area marked in red in second image.

http://i.imgur.com/JYh4OQy.jpg Closeup of area marked in brown in second image.

http://i.imgur.com/7KN2IbE.jpg Example of how well the hood turned out compared to rest of the car.

http://i.imgur.com/q9uPFnz.jpg Example of clear bra on hood, for which I had a question about polishing and swirl removal.

So,after all this heavy background information, here are my main questions:

Should I stick with the UC/cutting pads I'm using, and try to go over these areas again until they're satisfactory, or try a more aggressive product/pad combo? Are there any techniques or tricks I can use to help remedy those more problematic, uneven areas, like my most concerning one (marked in red) with the current products? I've been spreading the previously dabbed-on UC in over small sections at a speed of ~2 with the PC, before buffing slowly and with plenty of pressure at ~4.5-6 (depending on risk of splatter on given area) with 50% overlapping section passes, keeping in mind that the UC shouldn't be buffed long enough to get dry and powdery. Compound is then buffed off with microfiber, and inspected. Most of these areas have been treated twice already.

Would it be unwise to use either UC or SwirlX on the hood's clear bra before polishing, or should I just go straight to polish in the hopes that it will remove the swirls? I will be using Meguiar's Ultimate Polish. Keep in mind that the clear bra was installed by the previous owner at an unknown date, so I'm not entirely sure whether the majority of the scratches are in the clear bra, or under it. Aside from a few bubbles and small peeling areas scattered on the edges, it's in otherwise great shape, no discoloration or anything that stands out as being in poor shape.

I used UC on my headlights (which are in fair, but not perfect condition as clarity and spotting goes) once over, with little resulting change, but I have a small bottle of PlastX from a headlight restoration kit that I could use on them, with the hopes that the 7424 would make the job simple and more effective compared to the wet sanding and buffing by hand that the kit provided, with a poor effort to outcome ratio. Should I continue trying to use the UC, or would PlastX be a better choice?

I'm hoping to get this all to a point of satisfaction ASAP so I can get the polish and sealant/wax(?) done and get my car back into commission, but I also don't want to have to use cutting compound again anytime soon, so I'm willing to take the time and effort to get it right the first time. I wanna get my baby looking just as good as the 3.2L 24v VR6 under the hood sounds, lol :xyxthumbs:

Would appreciate all advice from everyone here, most of whom are likely a bit more experienced than myself Feed back please. Sorry for the super long post! Thanks in advance!

looks to me you need to maybe step down and do a mild polish....m205 or something similar. That looks to my eye, quickly, like marring from the compound that will go away when using a less aggressive polish. Try ultimate polish as a follow up.

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Should I stick with the UC/cutting pads I'm using, and try to go over these areas again until they're satisfactory, or try a more aggressive product/pad combo? Are there any techniques or tricks I can use to help remedy those more problematic, uneven areas, like my most concerning one (marked in red) with the current products? I've been spreading the previously dabbed-on UC in over small sections at a speed of ~2 with the PC, before buffing slowly and with plenty of pressure at ~4.5-6 (depending on risk of splatter on given area) with 50% overlapping section passes, keeping in mind that the UC shouldn't be buffed long enough to get dry and powdery. Compound is then buffed off with microfiber, and inspected. Most of these areas have been treated twice already.

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Try a more aggressive product and pad combination. The paint that Audi uses tends to be a little on the harder side and will require more aggressive paint correction methods to get the results you're looking for. I really like M100 on Meguiar's microfiber cutting disc for leveling defects. Usually from there you can step down to something like Ultimate Polish to remove any haze left over from the compounding step. Multiple passes (10-12) may be required with the equipment you are using if you are looking for a +95% defect free finish.

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Would it be unwise to use either UC or SwirlX on the hood's clear bra before polishing, or should I just go straight to polish in the hopes that it will remove the swirls? I will be using Meguiar's Ultimate Polish. Keep in mind that the clear bra was installed by the previous owner at an unknown date, so I'm not entirely sure whether the majority of the scratches are in the clear bra, or under it. Aside from a few bubbles and small peeling areas scattered on the edges, it's in otherwise great shape, no discoloration or anything that stands out as being in poor shape.

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Always test the least aggressive method. Removing defects on a clear bra is possible but extremely time consuming depending on the severity of damage present. The main thing to remember is to run the polisher at a lower speed. Excessive heat can compromise the film's adhesive and cause it to distort or lift.

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I used UC on my headlights (which are in fair, but not perfect condition as clarity and spotting goes) once over, with little resulting change, but I have a small bottle of PlastX from a headlight restoration kit that I could use on them, with the hopes that the 7424 would make the job simple and more effective compared to the wet sanding and buffing by hand that the kit provided, with a poor effort to outcome ratio. Should I continue trying to use the UC, or would PlastX be a better choice?

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It would be hard to give advice for the headlights without seeing pics. Most likely the OEM applied UV coating is failing. There is a finite useful lifespan of the factory applied UV coating, it naturally turns yellow over time as it does its job protecting the plastic lenses. In order to perform a proper repair the remaining UV coating needs to be sanded away. Some headlight repair kits contain a new UV coating that can be applied directly after sanding the old coating off. More traditionally you would sand off the failed coating, polish the lens with successively finer grit compounds and polishes until optimal clarity is achieved, and then apply a new sealant or coating to protect the lens from UV damage.

BTW, welcome to the forum!

I'll give you my input based on experience with the same products you're using and combined as an Audi owner. I'll ask a number of question in order to help provide further feedback once you reply.

First, what color Chem Guys pad are you using? What size too? You should be changing them out after every 2 panels or so.

With Megs UC you can get great results with an orange pad. The defects you're showing won't require anything more and IMO should be fine with Ultimate Polish and an orange pad. That said, you're using a 7424xp which I'm assuming you've marked the backing plate of to insure it's spinning properly? I ask as you mentioned the uneven areas and the fact that you're having issues is likely related to pad rotation or lack of.

How much product are you loading the pad with for each 2x2 or 2x3 area? I ask because you mention splatter and the fact that you have used 3/4 bottle on a car you've only done twice. Both are indicative of too much product being used. Only put 4 or 5 dime size drops on the pad and avoid overloading it. Depending on the pad, it could be weighted down and again, having trouble rotating.

In terms of the brown areas which are the tops of the doors and fenders, why are you not going to use the buffer? Those areas are very easy to buff out with the 7424xp?

Clear bra wise, do not buff it. Not sure if you're stating you have swirls on it but overall, it is not meant to be buffed with compounds. Use polishes very lightly and then mainly glazes and LSP's aren't a problem.

In terms of Swirl-X it's a far less aggressive product but I'd still stick with Ultimate Polish on a white pad for the bra and only hit it lightly. The scratches are likely on the bra as anything under it was masked by the adhesive and bra itself.

Headlight wise, would love to see a pic. Stick with Ultimate Compound and an orange pad. Move to Ultimate Polish and an Orange pad for them as a second step. Again, monitor pad spin.

Hope the above helps. Looking forward to providing more insight.

I agree with using too much product. As stated up above how often are you changing out the pads? Are you cleaning the pads on the fly? How many pads do you have? Did you mark your backing plate to make sure it is spinning?

I would not jump to M100 as suggested up above just yet, considering you are just getting your feet wet.

One thing I didn't see mentioned is what speed is your PC set at? In your case, it should be no lower than a 5 and most likely bringing it up to 6 will be beneficial. Don't use so much pressure that the pads doesn't SPIN, the spinning is what does the correcting, the RA "jiggle" is what helps prevent holograms and isn't as effective at correcting more severe defects.

I agree with trying UP next and using a high speed W/light pressure with the PC. My Camaro has harder paint and this works for me. Just remember though, like you even said (sort of) there are some defects that just aren't worth the risk of taking out, the odds of real paint damage (burning) is too high sometimes.

I owned VW and Audis for years and years now. I don't even bother wasting any time when I need to correct I only use microfiber cutting pads. Then always finish with a white pad of some sort(usually Rupes).

I used a PC in the past with microfiber cutting pads and it does the job just fine. But it takes a long long time.

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Originally Posted by idriveblackcars

I owned VW and Audis for years and years now. I don't even bother wasting any time when I need to correct I only use microfiber cutting pads. Then always finish with a white pad of some sort(usually Rupes).

I used a PC in the past with microfiber cutting pads and it does the job just fine. But it takes a long long time.

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i sent you a PM the other day. Get it?

Hey all,

So, having reflected on all the input here, I went on to cover the sections of the car that I hadn't touched. I switched back to the orange pad that I originally used on the hood, as opposed to the yellow heavy cutting pad, after having noticed a bit of extra chipping in already brittle areas. All my pads are 5.5". Although I had already marked my backing plate to better discern whether or not I was spinning as opposed to vibrating, I paid more attention to this on the remaining areas to optimize the amount of time spent spinning, and used minimal pressure compared to what I had in the beginning, moving as slowly as I could with the DA. I also reduced the amount of compound used to the recommended ~5 dime-sized drops (had previously been working with a smiley face), worked somewhat smaller areas, and seemed to have less issues with the compound drying as I went, allowing me more passes. Those areas all turned out really clean compared to the door panels.

For those who asked, I've been dabbing the compound from my pad to the paint across the area I planned to work, spreading evenly at a speed of about 2, and doing the actual buffing at 5 or 6.

After I finished the remaining areas, I noticed an excess of compound on the rubber trim and stuck in various cracks and crevices that I couldn't reach. Figuring I would need to get more compound to try to work the door panels once more, I peeled off all the tape, filled a spray bottle with a 50/50 iso/water mix, and it being 11PM, drove the car down to the local DIY pressure washer car wash, and sprayed the affected areas with the iso mix before rinsing. As it stands, I won't be able to wash and dry the car properly until the weather turns dry again on Friday, so things are on hold until then.

I have been cleaning my pads as I go and at the end of every session, but on these last areas I paid more attention to making sure the pad was in good working condition. I would switch to another pad, but I only have the one set; I'm thinking of picking up a few extra pads (for both cutting and polishing) when I get the compound to make the process a little smoother and less problematic as far as pad cleanliness goes.

Still not sure what I'll end up doing for the clear bra, but given everyone's responses, I'll probably just use the polish at low speeds instead of trying any cutting.

http://i.imgur.com/8oaGGsA.jpg

Headlight pics for reference, hope that gives a good idea of their condition. It's pretty easy to notice all the scratching on them from having used the headlight restoration kit, which did combat some of the fogging, at the cost of obvious scratching.

Thanks again everyone!

Wet Sand the headlights and polish them back. If they are still hazy it's lkely on the inside. If so you can bake them in the oven, break them apart, clean them and then seal them up.