Black Label Coating - Streaking -_-_- Follow with what now??

[Audios S6]

Thanks for sharing the above. I have not seen any kind of build-up on the outside of the nozzle, at least not as of yet. I do keep all our products in our very nice garage or warehouse where the climate is controlled. I also have a tendency to wipe the bottles down as I take pictures of them in my write-ups, so it could be I'm cleaning them without even looking at them.

I'll try to take note in the future.





Hard to say... one thing, it's kind of a sign of some real "stuff" in the bottle.


As I posted previously, I have seen some streaking and dark patches but nothing a soft wipe has not overcome. Could be our shop environment?

I have a black Tahoe tomorrow and I'm planning on coating it so I'll pay close attention to the surface at the end of the project.

Both of my issues may have been related to environment. I was pushing this stuff the the environmental limit - near freezing temps and very high humidity in a car wash bay.

Here's a pick of the build-up. It initially started squirting after doing about 1.5 mid-size cars, then I cleaned the nozzle. This amount of build up is from doing 1/2 a car at near freezing temps.

[Wes Bremec]

I really think car care companies should invest more time in there application practicality. Not all detailing companies have the luxury to work in perfect climate controlled environments. I would not mind paying more for a product that can have the same application results weather it is warm,cold, humid, whatever. While some people on this forum have the luxury of living in warm weather climates, I myself live in Ohio where we get just about every type of climate change. I do struggle with products and I have to learn how to deal with it.

[Dr_Pain]

I really think car care companies should invest more time in there application practicality. Not all detailing companies have the luxury to work in perfect climate controlled environments. I would not mind paying more for a product that can have the same application results weather it is warm,cold, humid, whatever. While some people on this forum have the luxury of living in warm weather climates, I myself live in Ohio where we get just about every type of climate change. I do struggle with products and I have to learn how to deal with it.

Not to pick on your post Wes but the utopia of "fool proof" application does not.... and will never exist. This could potentially be a market killer. They capitalize on our desire to find "the next best thing", and we capitalize (in detailing) at being able to identify those environmental subtleties which may interfere with the expected end result.

It goes without saying that car care companies would leap at R&D if the mass wanted the product (or if they had enough liabilities with their products). I am sad to say it but our desire for perfection (at all costs) puts us in a minority. The mass wants easy and cheap... regardless of the perfection. We want perfection made easy, regardless of the cost. Again something that sets us in a minority.

[Wes Bremec]

Not to pick on your post Wes but the utopia of "fool proof" application does not.... and will never exist. This could potentially be a market killer. They capitalize on our desire to find "the next best thing", and we capitalize (in detailing) at being able to identify those environmental subtleties which may interfere with the expected end result.

It goes without saying that car care companies would leap at R&D if the mass wanted the product (or if they had enough liabilities with their products). I am sad to say it but our desire for perfection (at all costs) puts us in a minority. The mass wants easy and cheap... regardless of the perfection. We want perfection made easy, regardless of the cost. Again something that sets us in a minority.

Isn't that the truth.........

[MarkD51]

From what I seem to understand about either the DP Paint Coating-Pinnacle GL Paint Coating (and probably holds true with every other make of Paint Coating also), is that like WOWA, or WOWO Sealants, there is of course a cure time involved.

Some seem to say a period of between 8-12 hours before a Coating should be subjected to washings, or wet weather.

Now, and in regards of what I briefly touched upon earlier in this thread, wouldn't such might also possibly hold true for topping such Coatings, regardless what they are, or who they are made by, including Pinnacle's own Coating Booster, and Detailer?

Certainly not looking for any proprietary make up of a list of ingredients in either of these products, but might they have water as one ingredient?

I believe I have read that although these Coatings and others have an initial cure time period, I can also seem to remember that these Coatings also have a much longer total-full cure time period.

I myself probably have never seen a need to apply something immediately after these coatings, as I have used the DP Coating, but this isn't to say that I could possibly do such in the future, and the question then is, "is this unwise, and does it go against proper application techniques with these Coatings"?

If so, then perhaps we need some futher education and enlightenment with the proper useage of such products.
Mark

[MarkD51]

Introducing Two NEW Black Label Products!

Not sure about the Coating Booster, but Nick here at AG in this thread mentions that the Pinnacle Coating Detailer is indeed Water Based.
Mark

[Dr_Pain]

Technically all products have a cure time (ie. enough time for the solvents to dissipate and/or for the chemical bonding to occur). Some have more flash time requirements than other, and some requirement longer cure time between layers (due to possibility interaction between the solvents and the LSP), and some have even longer cure times based on the chemical bonding (such as in coatings).

As far as it was explained to me (and through some limited non-scientific testing of my own), coatings require a minimum of 12 hrs away from being exposed to water, should not be washed for 1 week, and should be fully cured by 30 days (obvious environmental factors may lengthen the process). The actual protection does start day 1, however maximum resiliency of the product does require a 30 day wait period (unless you can accelerate the process using IR lamps).

Being a PBL convert, I can say that my experience with their coatings has been great. I did try the detailers (and reviewed it) and am not 100% convinced but will re-evaluate and report later. I cannot wait to try their booster. The coating was applied to my Raptor and was exposed to torrential rain shortly after the 12 hrs cure time and almost 4 weeks later, it performs like a champ.

One more thing to say about PBL coatings is that they are advertised as being able to receive a "topper" so if you desire a different look (for a car show) you have the ability to layer your favorite LSP.

[cardaddy]

Thanks for sharing the above. I have not seen any kind of build-up on the outside of the nozzle, at least not as of yet. I do keep all our products in our very nice garage or warehouse where the climate is controlled. I also have a tendency to wipe the bottles down as I take pictures of them in my write-ups, so it could be I'm cleaning them without even looking at them.

I'll try to take note in the future.





Hard to say... one thing, it's kind of a sign of some real "stuff" in the bottle.


As I posted previously, I have seen some streaking and dark patches but nothing a soft wipe has not overcome. Could be our shop environment?

I have a black Tahoe tomorrow and I'm planning on coating it so I'll pay close attention to the surface at the end of the project.

Mike I made a short (low res) video that I can e-mail you of the booster spitting / shooting a stream. I can email it to you so you can see what was happening.

The streaking/smearing went away after warming up the surface and baking a bit till the wee hours this morning.

We first tried PBL detailing spray, then ONR, (both types) even a small area with Megs QD Spray on a plush towel.

The conclusion that we came to was it seemed to have been a mixture of the PBL detailing spray AND THE. booster on the same 700gsm towel. My son had been dusting it off with the QD then picked up the booster and it put big wet spots on the towel.

It seems that the booster didn't want to flash, especially on the 2 day old coating AND it being in the low 40's (where we rolled it outside for pickup).

After spending the night inside the garage with the heater on, and the lights there was only a very small area on one front fender that we had left this morning to wipe off.

My wife was so worried about it that she called in late for work this morning! She wasn't going anywhere until she knew the car was perfect!

That's my GIRL!!!


Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using AG Online

[cardaddy]

O-Tay then.

First, I wanted to give a shout out to Nick@Autogeek (of course) for sending me another bottle of booster.

What started as a dust off session turned to mass panic, thankfully the delivery date was based on my flexibility, not the body shops. (Considering they had it for a week after it came out of paint, yet they contacted me to do it the day it WENT INTO paint.)

Obviously the 'flashing' and workability of the PBL coating has been 'dumbed down' to a level that works for a much wider group than say two other well known "pro" products. That alone however doesn't mean that it'll perform flawlessly under what we would consider "extreme" conditions of weather/heat/cold/humidity. After all, there has to be (for lack of a better phrase) "structural integrity" of sufficient strength and durability to make the product both work, but live up to at the very least a minimum standard of durability. And from what I've seen thus far it delivers especially well for the price of admission. Albeit with all the work that goes into prepping a 'less than new' vehicle for a coating I might just as well use the more expensive product.

That aside, there does seem to be a closer relationship with the "booster" and the "coating" in how they lay down. They do both obviously flash. Enough so that I bet when it's 90° in the shade, and the coating has been there for 48 hours I'm betting a second 'layer' (of sorts) could be made using the booster, INSTEAD of another layer of "coating".

I will admit that once I realized my son had picked up the booster and it had saturated the 700 gsm towel he was using, and saw it was a sort of "flashing/streaking" going on that I tried applying it directly to the paint on a panel to see if it'd be 'fixable'.
(It was at that time I also found out it was squirting rather than misting.)

We are just lucky that I had a garage to pull it back into and start cleaning it off, heating it up, and working through the "process" for another 18 hours!

I'll see about some photos for another thread. Although this one was really hard because I've been fighting with a herniated/ruptured disc now for several months. It started acting up fairly bad back in the summer at Jean-Claude's place and has been getting progressively worse since. I've been using two crutches and/or a walker to get around for a month now. Just supervising the Jag was more than I was physically up to, but we do what we have to do. I'd like to say it was the easiest $850 I ever made but considering it wasn't supposed to need ANY compounding, and how bad I was hurting just supervising.... I just dunno' on that one.

I have a seated MRI Sunday and a CT myelography Tuesday hoping they'll hurry up and cut me, cut me deep, and cut me with a freaking CHAINSAW if it'll help! Because about now, they don't make enough morphine to help this mess.

Another story on streaking:

I've seen similar "streaking" when applying a topper to a WOWO type sealant. Especially so when it is during the spring or fall and the temps are below 45°~50°. I had a friend last March where we did his wife's Lexus (dark metallic blue) and he was rushing so I could barely get M21 on the surface before he was wiping it off. I had to go back and put it on again and DARE HIM to remove it. Once it sat for 30 minutes or so he was going NUTS (again in the ever present hurry, but nowhere to go but get more coffee) although by then I agreed to let him wipe it down. I actually have photos of him with a towel in one hand and a coffee cup in the other, for HOURS he was like that!

I had told him the day before that, that if he really wanted it to "pop" that the next day we could put M26 on it. Thing is we didn't get to finishing the car the first day because it turned into a 2-stage correction, AND he kept wanting to quit. Get it clayed, he thought it was time to quit. Get it compounded, he thought it was time to quit. Get it polished, again.... time to quit.

Fast forward, Sunday morning I finished buffing it and managed to get the M21 on it. No sooner did it get wiped off and he had gone and grabbed the M26 and was spreading it on the other side of the car! I mean GOOD LORD!!!!!! The sealant (at first) had only been on a matter of SECONDS before he was wiping it off. Then it was on about 30 minutes and he started wiping. BUT putting M26 (liquid) on it made it streak to high heaven! Although..... if you know Mike like I know Mike (I've known him since high school) then you know he wasn't looking to begin with. I pulled out a 700 gsm towel and gave it a few more wipes and told him to pull it in the garage. His wife was out of town on business and didn't see it for two more days, by which time it was cured and good to go.

[Paul Mitchell]

Your friend needs decaf!