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  1. #21
    Super Member Bruno Soares's Avatar
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    Re: buy new, used, or lease a car?

    Quote Originally Posted by Desertnate View Post
    Is that in the current market? The only car I've ever leased was my GTI. I picked up a MK6 in 2013 and leased it for 12K miles/42 months with really competitive rates. When the lease was over it was worth MORE than the residual! Dealer wasn't happy about that when I bought the car at the end of the lease.
    Any time I got a quote to lease and a quote to finance, the lease was a lot more. Dealer said VW has no incentive leasing them so the dealer ends up selling the car to a bank who then leases it to you. Perhaps that varies with location too.

    I should mention whenever I financed the car I had a decent downpayment and made the financed part not that big, I guess if you went in with almost no downpayment the monthly payment when financed would be pretty high, maybe making the lease look good.

    When I got my GTI I traded in my Santa Fe and financed just over $11k in 36 months - monthly payments were $324. Leasing the same car with a few grand down would have been about $499 per month.
    Bruno Soares


  2. #22
    Super Member dcjredline's Avatar
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    Re: buy new, used, or lease a car?

    Quote Originally Posted by Coatingsarecrack View Post
    4,000 a year in most peoples cases is is alot less than payments. On average figure $20 +/- a few bucks per $1,000 financed.

    That’s around $600 a month $7,200 a year for a 30k car.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    EXACTLY, I see this BS excuse all the time on the financial FB pages Im on. For some reason paying $100 a month on repairs makes people go into ORBIT but they will pay $600+ a month for a car payment and claim they are "saving money over repairs" lol There is no way on this green earth you can beat a decent used car with no payments if you have payments.

    That being said, for the last 12 years I have bought ~10 years old and near 100k miles. The first one 2002 Bonneville $2250 with 120k on it lasted me almost 4 years and up to 198k I only got rid of it cause I found another, that was a 2004 Saturn Ion I bought 7 years ago for $3000 with 84k on it. I still have it and it has cost me less than $2k over that 7 years and it now has 163k miles on it. My other current car I bought 2 years ago a 2008 Grand Prix for $1250 and 135k miles on it. Still going strong and only spent maybe $1000 on it since. Ill put any of those 3 used cars against ANY payment ANY day.
    "Dirt likes detergent so much better than the surface that it's attached to, it'll leave that surface to go hang out with the soap"...aim4squirrels

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  4. #23
    Super Member Desertnate's Avatar
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    Re: buy new, used, or lease a car?

    Quote Originally Posted by dcjredline View Post
    EXACTLY, I see this BS excuse all the time on the financial FB pages Im on. For some reason paying $100 a month on repairs makes people go into ORBIT but they will pay $600+ a month for a car payment and claim they are "saving money over repairs" lol There is no way on this green earth you can beat a decent used car with no payments if you have payments.
    I wonder if the repairs vs payments is more psychological than anything else, and it might be the frequency of repair too?

    If I had to take a vehicle in to a shop for out of cycle repairs (i.e. can't wait for the next oil change etc ) more than 2~3 times a year, I'd seriously consider a different vehicle. Taking a vehicle in every month or two is really disruptive for life/work. Once a year-ish isn't a big deal.

    Confidence in not being stranded factors in heavily too. If the repairs aren't frequent, but when they do happen, it means your consistently get towed, that's a red line for most people. It is for me. No way I'm getting stuck 100 miles from the nearest competent mechanic and waiting hours for a tow. I've had older cars where I held my breath for 7~8 hours at a time praying I'd get to the destination without breaking down. Then repeated the process trying to get home. Not fun. Sometimes the extra payments are worth it for the peace of mind.
    Drop by to see the latest at The Car Geek Blog

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  6. #24
    Regular Member Black Bowtie's Avatar
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    Re: buy new, used, or lease a car?

    I usually purchase a used vehicle several years old, but this spring when I was ready, due to the shortage of new vehicles the price on used was high. So with the rebate, military discount and getting a great deal off of MSRP, I ordered a new 21 Silverado RST for about the same price that I could purchase a 3 year old truck.

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  8. #25
    Super Member opie's Avatar
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    Re: buy new, used, or lease a car?

    Never bought new yet. I bought my 07 silverado classic in 2012 for 16k with 84000 mi on it. Just turned 124,000mi. Dont drive it much, and no winter driving. Thats why i have a work car lol.

    Bought a 07 buick lacrosse cxl off an old couple a month ago. Paid a little more than i wanted but was lookin all year and needed one soon, and this one was legit rust free everywhere and super clean inside and out. Which in Pa is hard to find at times. $6800 with 79,000mi. On average i get 5 years outta a work car. I drive 15-20k a year for work depending on job site location. No point in buying new for that.

    I refuse to buy another truck until i have a garage. Need to protect my investment as i tend to keep them for many years

    Sent from my SM-G973U using Tapatalk

  9. #26
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    Re: buy new, used, or lease a car?

    I really depends for me.

    I think the only thing I haven't done is buy from a private party...unless you count the 'purchase' of my 1986 Dodge Diplomat from an old neighbor which I essentially traded for some snowboard boots.

    I've leased 2 vehicles. I dropped one off and walked away, the other I purchased at end of 2yr lease and kept it for another 5 years (it had less than 10k miles after 2 years). In the end, it would have been cheaper to buy, but I enjoyed the lower payments at the beginning.

    My 2014 Explorer was the only vehicle I purchased new (aside from the lease) and I still have that going on 7.5 years. I like the fact that I picked all the options I wanted and also that I know the history. My wife is driving it now as her daily driver.

    My 2016 Golf R was used (6yrs old and 20k miles). The previous owner did all maintenance at the dealer, including wiper blades, so I got the full printout. I wasn't ready for another $40k+ vehicle, so I got into this for under $30k, 'barely broken in' and certified. If I sold it, could get about $5k more now than I paid due to the stupid used car market. I'd seriously consider it if I had a replacement vehicle because honestly, it's almost too nice for me (especially with 2x kids). If my wife found a different vehicle, I'd be content with driving the Explorer for a few more years.

  10. #27
    Super Member TTQ B4U's Avatar
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    Re: buy new, used, or lease a car?

    First, I'll apologize for such a long post: My perspective is from that of both a consumer, as I am, and from someone who grew up in a family that owned dealerships and one that offered me the experiences of working in nearly every aspect of those businesses. From a lot attndant and detailer in my teens to a sales and finance office manager as I aged and worked my way through college and for a short time after.

    They key to comparing the two is to NOT get caught up on comparing new and used. Trying to compare old vehicles with high miles to a NEW vehicle and tossing in cost of repairs, etc. is to discuss things that aren't even in the same realm.

    I'll start by saying leasing is a lot of things and to some will offer benefits that are by-products of the program. To really understand what it's about, one also needs to understand what it's NOT.

    The benefits in a nut shell are about money, equity and reserving it for things that are NOT depreciating assets. If you're just out for a lower payment or buying up a few levels in vehicle from a purchase then you're benefiting from a by-product but not using it for it's intended purpose. Leasing isn't about being the cheapest or most cost effective way to drive. It's not about avoiding maintenance, although again, there is somewhat of a by-product benefit here for some.

    The intent of leasing is to recognize a vehicle is nothing more than a depreciating asset that gets you from one point to another with a cost associated with it that can be recognized over time. How you recognize it is up to you and isn't limited. I can buy a car and recognize the cost today of a cash buy, say $35k for a used CUV/SUV add in tax, fees, etc. and have a number. Say $37,600 all-in that day and enjoy my car. It does however come at a cost because that $37k is now equity tied up in my driveway in a depreciating asset vs in my investments making money for me. The key in finance is to keep it in the latter while recognizing we as people still need to drive from A to B.

    It's important to note and a point that is often over looked in these discussion is that the drive from A to B involves more than just getting between those two points thus why comparing a NEW lease to say a 3-5yr old vehicle isn't the best. Sure, both can be nice, but leasing is for buyers who want NEW and enjoy the best years and miles of a vehicle in terms of cleanliness and freshness. Not everyone wants hand me downs with 36k, miles on them no matter how nice they are. There's a value in having NEW. to having blemish free cars, ones not requiring brakes right away or rolling on it's second set of tires or lacking some of the latest features and styling cues. Recognize that value comes at a price. So for the sake of argument, let's not cloud the issue with the cheapest or most cost effective way to drive or discuss those who are willing to take a vehicle with age and miles on it. Again, that's an apples to oranges conversation. Both are good but not everyone will interchange the two.

    So what it boils down to BESIDES the above is making the decision that's best for YOU as the buyer and IMO understanding the benefits both ways. My recommended approach is that of a finance guy. I've owned and leased all kinds of vehicles ranging from $9k to $90k. I'm flexible and I select the vehicle for the moment and intended purpose at that point in my life. We hear lots of talk about BUDGET. Everyone has one no matter how rich or poor. I'll use my own personal example as it's REAL and fitting for most peoples budgets. I'll stop for now and cover that shortly.
    2019 Pearl White Accord 2.0T Touring (mine)
    2023
    Snowflake Pearl White CX-30 Turbo Premium Plus(wife)
    2010 Urban Platinum Metallic CRV EX-L & 2014 Mica Black Metallic Toyota Corolla S (kids)

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  12. #28
    Super Member TTQ B4U's Avatar
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    Re: buy new, used, or lease a car?

    So where to begin. Again, budget. The wife and I in Spring 2018 sought out a vehicle and put a budget of $650mo on it. Slice that however you want, it's about a $32k vehicle and we were flexible to maybe $35k if we paid cash or financed it. Now back to the cost of money thing.....paying cash back then, not the best move. We can afford $650 so if that's the case, why would we pull $35k out of investments making more than the roughly $3,300 in interest over the cost of the loan. That's the key. Shoppers need to have a budge and understand the cost of money over time. If you're $35k is invested wisely, it should be pulling in far more than that interest over the course of 5yrs. Reality is $35k at 6% over 5 years with no additional equity added, just the interest earned rolled over will net you nearly $17k by the 60th month. That's exactly what the banks do when they take your money so if you have a small amount of money, USE IT and let it work FOR YOU not for the bank. THAT is the idea behind leasing and here's how it works in action.

    The above is a finance or cash situation. Makes sense and is fine for those that don't understand money but equate no car payments to being successful. It also works for those that perhaps don't have a savings and have no choice but to borrow money. The key for those people STILL centers around the cost of money. If you lease or finance, both are LOANS and both are other people lending you money to acquire a vehicle. So what do you do with that money? Time to change up how you buy a car and think about it through the lens of money working for you. You already KNOW it's going to COST you to drive from A to B so how expensive that cost is remains your budget. That budget centers around your needs and wants. We wanted a NICE car but it didn't need to be. However, we did want a loaded and very nice car either way.

    The old argument around leasing is that it's just lost money you never get back, blah, blah. Not true. In the case of a loan, that lost money is in the interest you're paying but also the loss of money working for you which as noted prior is actually MORE, like 2-5x more than just the interest. So how do you approach things? Scale back and save. By that I mean this. If we buy a $32k CUV that's 3yrs old with low miles we were looking down the road at 60mos of payments. At the end we'd have an 8yr old likely 96k-120k mile used car. A quick used car search for that same model at that point in time with those years and miles on it showed it would likely only bring $13-15k on the used market. Nonetheless, equity that the guy leasing doesn't have right? WRONG. Not nit-picking here but over those 5yrs as the vehicle ages, there's maintenance and repair costs. Tires and Brakes alone chip away at that net-equity. You can't ignore it. Thus for the sake of argument, I'm going to target the lower end, $13k as the net-goal to hit in this scenario.

    Keep in mind too, that we're only leasing for no more than 36mos (more on that later) thus we'll be in TWO NEW Cars over the course of this endeavor. Pretty cool considering at the 3yr mark the guy who financed, is then in a 5yr old car about to put brakes and another set of tires on it given the mileage he likely has.

    Done correctly, we then looked at the $13-15k as our new goal. After-all, 60 months later we want that $13-15k equity too. So how do we get it if we're leasing? THIS is where 99.9% of buyers fail and lose out. The answer is simple. SAVE and INVEST it. Doing so is easy. To get a nest egg that is equal to the guy who financed and now OWNS the car means I have to save $13k in 60 months or roughly $180-215 mo. and divert that money into investment account. If you can't see how that's better than sinking it into a depreciating asset (the vehicle) sitting in your driveway or garage exposed to all kinds of RISKS, then you really need to see a financial advisor.

    So what that means for us is we now switched from buying a 32k used vehicle to looking at and being flexible on vehicle choice to find the a CUV that can offer us all we want for the difference of our budget $650mo less the $180 to $215mo or $435-450mo payment. Just reverse engineer the money with a basic investment calculator. It's easy.

    So what we did was we found a 2018 Lincoln MK-C Reserve FULLY loaded at $51k that with no money down (NEVER put money down as a cap-cost reduction on a lease) offered us a NEW far nicer vehicle for a 36mo lease payment of only $453.28 per month. The rest is history as you all saw me posted up shots it over that time. I ended up turning it in and walked away and the true story is we picked up her Mazda CX-5 and had that nest egg of money left to either use to pay for it or to fund other things. It's not rocket science, it's called understanding cost of money and that LEASING is about having MORE OPTIONS and maintaining YOUR EQUITY aka Cash/Investment/Money in YOUR Pocket not that of the banks.

    That is how it's done. You can drive a nicer vehicle, stay within your budget AND have equity at the end. The guy who purchased and paid off his car......great, he has a title in hand for a depreciating asset that he was upside down on for roughly the first 3.5yrs and now has that equity tied up in his garage. I on the other hand had my $180 mo in equity from day one working for me in an investment that was at little to no risk and readily accessible to me recognized as appreciating asset. See the difference?

    Hope my long winded post isn't too confusing. Happy to help where I can if there are questions.

    buy new, used, or lease a car?-investment-jpg
    2019 Pearl White Accord 2.0T Touring (mine)
    2023
    Snowflake Pearl White CX-30 Turbo Premium Plus(wife)
    2010 Urban Platinum Metallic CRV EX-L & 2014 Mica Black Metallic Toyota Corolla S (kids)

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