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  1. #11
    Super Member WillSports3's Avatar
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    Re: Wolfgang SiO2 spray sealant

    When it comes to cost for any siloxane based spray coatings, I definitely believe that Wolfgang SiO2 spray is better for the money than Mother CMX or Meguiar's Ceramic. Mothers CMX and Meguiar's ceramic at their cheap prices lack a strong bonding agent in the, hence the price. Bonding agent is the most expensive part of any "ceramic" product. Especially since most likely PDMS is used in Wolfgang, CMX, and Meguiar's. PDMS without a strong bonding agent=meaningless. The bond is as strong as soapy water on your car. I can take a 10 percent SiO2 spray product and have it last longer than Cancoat even though Cancoat is a higher concentration of SiO2. It just might cost three or four times as much as Cancoat.

    Wolfgang doesn't have their SDSs online but I'm guessing it's a mix of their own polymers, with hydrophobic siloxane compound, PDMS, most likely some kind of strong petroleum distillate solvent (other wise the spray head would just harden after one use), and a methyl based bonding agent. Possible some alcohol or another kind of solvent like it to keep the mixture thin.

    I say this with all due respect, but don't kid yourself. The cost-benefit ratio of some of the OTC protection products and boutique protection products is that for the OTC products, they can sell it at a quarter of the cost and make profit based on it because none of the ingredients are that expensive. The R&D perhaps, but the actual ingredient cost is much lower. However compared to say the boutique products, cost is a factor of course but the chemical ingredients and blends are much more convoluted and costs quite a bit more.

    Boutique products are more performance driven than cost driven. OTC products are more cost driven. Performance only has to be an acceptable level to keep the cost down. Noone is gonna pay 35 dollars for a spray wax bottle at autozone when you have a 20 dollar or sub 20 dollar spray waxes there beside it.
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  2. #12
    Super Member acuRAS82's Avatar
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    Re: Wolfgang SiO2 spray sealant

    I’m guessing packsfan post was before everyone realized CMX can’t hang. I won’t judge on Megs HCW since I haven’t used it and read mixed reviews. I can only speak that Pinnacle and BF SiO2 spray sealants blow CMX out of the water. Particularly Pinnacle, which is more substantial and I would expect to be most similar to WG with different polymers to match each brand’s calling card.

  3. #13
    Super Member WillSports3's Avatar
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    Re: Wolfgang SiO2 spray sealant

    To be honest, if Mothers CMX contained more silane components to encourage PDMS bonding, it might drive the cost up to around 25 to 26 a bottle, but it would stand a better chance of hanging around.

    Meguiar's HCW is more hybrid wax than hybrid ceramic anything. Maybe some siloxane components in it, but uses ethoxylated alcohol so using siloxane would be a wierd choice as it creates a hydrophilic surfactant instead of a hydrophobic one, usually. Ethoxylated alcohol is used as an emulsion agent to mix oil and water based products. Maybe just a more economical beading agent? The requirement to use on a wet surface might be because of the surfactant choices and solvent choices that requires water to activate? Who knows.

    Cost to cost, comparing Wolfgang SiO2 spray to Mothers CMX or Meguiar's HCW is comparing different products. You're comparing a product with a denser SiO2 base with two products that are as ceramic as pam cooking spray. No, I don't mean that as an insult, cooking spray uses PDMS in other forms to prevent foaming and make the product hydrophobic.

    Actually, great example there of hydrophobicness. PAM Cooking spray. When the spray is on your pan, it's hydrophobic. Wash it off with soap, and it's gone. No bonding agent. Not that there should be, it's cooking spray.
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  4. #14
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    Re: Wolfgang SiO2 spray sealant

    Quote Originally Posted by WillSports3 View Post
    To be honest, if Mothers CMX contained more silane components to encourage PDMS bonding, it might drive the cost up to around 25 to 26 a bottle, but it would stand a better chance of hanging around.

    Meguiar's HCW is more hybrid wax than hybrid ceramic anything. Maybe some siloxane components in it, but uses ethoxylated alcohol so using siloxane would be a wierd choice as it creates a hydrophilic surfactant instead of a hydrophobic one, usually. Ethoxylated alcohol is used as an emulsion agent to mix oil and water based products. Maybe just a more economical beading agent? The requirement to use on a wet surface might be because of the surfactant choices and solvent choices that requires water to activate? Who knows.

    Cost to cost, comparing Wolfgang SiO2 spray to Mothers CMX or Meguiar's HCW is comparing different products. You're comparing a product with a denser SiO2 base with two products that are as ceramic as pam cooking spray. No, I don't mean that as an insult, cooking spray uses PDMS in other forms to prevent foaming and make the product hydrophobic.

    Actually, great example there of hydrophobicness. PAM Cooking spray. When the spray is on your pan, it's hydrophobic. Wash it off with soap, and it's gone. No bonding agent. Not that there should be, it's cooking spray.
    This comment is pretty accurate considering that Meguiars uses trade secret oils to attach their waxes to the paint surface.

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