COPO Camaro - Flex vs Rupes - Carbon Fiber Hood Extreme Makeover

**tonysteve** · 03-23-2015, 03:01 PM

Looks great. I am firm believer in technique trumps product and not every product will give you the same result in every car.

Mike I would love to hear more on how you jewel with a machine like the flex. I am assuming a light polish and a light pad but what speed do you prefer and how much arm speed and pressure you may use. And I understand paint to paint will vary drastically

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**Selectchoice** · 03-25-2015, 11:23 PM

Originally Posted by Mike.Phillips@Autogeek

The curved portions on the molded in air scoop were a little bit of a challenge for the Rupes but I used a technique I perfected on the last few cars I buffed out,

1999 Ferrari
1956 Nomad
1978 Trans Am
2000 Wicked 7 Porsche
2003 Tahoe
2013 Camaro

Can you let us in on the technique Mike?

**SMAD** · 03-26-2015, 08:11 AM

Both look great to me, I'm currently looking to upgrade polishers so I love any comparisons. Curious, which machine/product combo did you prefer? Based on feel, ease of use, etc. thanks for all you do for the industry!

Mike Phillips · 03-31-2015, 10:30 AM

Originally Posted by tonysteve

Looks great. I am firm believer in technique trumps product and not every product will give you the same result in every car.

I'm actually a believer that when it comes to polishing the the first and most important factor is the product, or more superficially the abrasive technology as it is the abrasives that are being pushed over and against the paint.

Assuming a person is using the right pad for the product and the job then the right tool and technique come into play.

My point was just to have some fun, limit my time to just the hood and show that both tools are capable machines.

Originally Posted by tonysteve

Mike I would love to hear more on how you jewel with a machine like the flex.

I am assuming a light polish and a light pad but what speed do you prefer and how much arm speed and pressure you may use.

And I understand paint to paint will vary drastically

I used the new gold 6.5" Hybrid pad with the Pinnacle Advanced Finishing Polish and I believe I started on the 4 speed setting to spread the product out, make a few thorough passes and then if I remember correctly I turned the speed down to 3 and held the tool using an underhand grasp of the underneath of the tool body with the other hand on the handle and lightly, gently moved the pad over the surface using overlapping motions.

Look at this picture.... the gold jeweling pad is under the red waxing pad.

I have more pictures of the entire process for both tools it's just a time factor to make them appear and now days there needs to be strong demand for picture time.

Mike Phillips · 06-22-2015, 12:45 PM

Originally Posted by SMAD

Curious, which machine/product combo did you prefer? Based on feel, ease of use, etc.

I really choose the best tool and/or system for the project at hand.

Originally Posted by SMAD

thanks for all you do for the industry!

Thanks for the kind words.... I just know how to detail a car, take a few pictures and type on a keyboard.

I shared this story with Dennis here,

Dennis Gage interviews Mike Phillips

And Mark Greene here,

Mike Phillips interview with Mark Greene at CarsYeah.com

**lashedup** · 07-14-2015, 05:14 PM

Originally Posted by Mike.Phillips@Autogeek

I really choose the best tool and/or system for the project at hand.

Ok, so to qualify things a bit from my end. I've gotten back into detailing again and purchased quite a few pieces of equipment including the Rupes and the Flex used above.

First, I think Mike is one of the most valuable assets on the Internet right now in terms of the amount of content, help, how-to's and more that he has contributed. Likewise, Palm Beach Motoring Group and Autogeek in this case have provided a great platform (and products) for all of us to talk about, read about and debate. Given Mike's position being probably a little delicate, my guess is that he prefers using one tool or another but is probably in a tough spot to say definitively.

Given how long Mike has been doing this I'm also guessing he's realized what many of us begin to realize after doing this for a while: in the end, very similar results can be had using a wide range of different products and tools. However where the difference seems to be is in the amount of time it takes to achieve those results. Some products produce results faster with a little less work. Some tools also produce results faster with less work.

I don't personally find the "technique" portion of the Rupes system that difficult, but moreso find that using the Rupes or the new Griots BOSS (or any decent free spinning buffer) to be very similar and achieve correction and polishing in very similar manners, with the same type of technique and in roughly similar amounts of time. As you can see in this comparison that Mike did above the results are very similar (although Mike, if you're going to show closeups of each side before, you should show closeups of each side of the hood after - just some feedback and needling.

)

The Flex 3401 having a direct drive head just seems to make the process of achieving those results go a little faster without having to think about the "process" or "technique" involved in using a floating head buffer. When I use my Rupes or Griots I find that I have to pay more attention to whether the head is spinning or not and adjust my technique accordingly to make sure it is still spinning. With the Flex 3401 I don't have to think about the head spinning and find that I concentrate more on slow arm consistent movements and pad position a little more. After a lot of use of the Rupes or Griots BOSS you get a feel for whether a given pad is spinning or not and don't think about it as much, but there are plenty of times on complex curves and such that you are reminded of it.

Now, having said that, an esoteric comparison of jeweling or final polishing between the Flex and Rupes would be interesting. My guess is that it would come down to splitting hairs at the end of the day, but there are times I don't necessarily want or need the Flex 3401 head spinning and would rather use a lighter orbital-only pass. Can I achieve the same results with both? Yes. At least good enough for nearly any detail job I do outside of some kind of crazy show car finish.

If you're starting out and can swing the price of the Flex 3401 I personally think it is the better buffer to buy because you are trying to get the most amount of work done (time is money right?) with the least amount of additional fuss or time. That direct-drive spinning head makes a difference. I also find that I use my Rupes Mini quite a bit and really like it for the smaller spots. I can get into those smaller areas and can work them nicely.

Anyway, if you made this far, thanks for listening. The regulars around here are a wealth of knowledge, patience and great tips and ideas (thanks all!). They use a wide variety of tools and achieve nearly identical results even when using different products. Sometimes I think we overthink this stuff too much at times, but it is fun to debate and the new products that comes along makes us look forward to trying something new.

Cheers,

-j