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  1. #1
    Mike Phillips
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    Is there a benefit to machine applying a wax or sealant versus applying by hand?

    Is there a benefit to machine applying a wax or sealant versus applying by hand?



    Anytime I get questions via e-mail, a PM or a FB message I prefer to invest my typing time where

    A: It's easier for me to share links, pictures and videos.

    B: More people can read and thus benefit from the information. (no just one set of eyeballs)



    So I get an e-mail asking,



    My question is regarding the application of both paint sealants and wax.

    Is there a benefit behind the use of a random orbital, such as the Porter Cable 7424 that I like to use vs. that of hand application?

    I’ve struggled with this as I find the machine blending it in so fine that there is very little residue to wipe away where as there is considerably more after applying by hand.

    Also, do you have any thoughts adding wax (such as Wolfgang Fuzion or Pinnacle) on top of a coat of sealant?

    Thanks,

    Mark




    Hi Mark,

    Thank you for the questions, let me take a stab at sharing my experience and I'm sure our forum members will share the


    Quote Originally Posted by Mark

    Is there a benefit behind the use of a random orbital, such as the Porter Cable 7424 that I like to use vs. that of hand application?
    Here's what I think are the benefits to machine application of a Carnauba wax or synthetic paint sealant by machine using simple orbital poishers, (8mm orbital polishers is what I would consider a simple or entry level oribal polisher)



    1: Machine waxing is safer for the paint than working by hand.

    The human hand tends to apply pressure irregularly depending upon the applicator. When using a simple wax pad you will tend to have pressure points caused by your fingertips and these pressure points can actually mar the paint depending upon the paint softness or hardness.


    Pressure points shown on a simple foam wax applicator pad




    When machine waxing or sealing, the entire face of the foam waxing pad is in contact with the paint and assuming you're holding the pad flat to the surface as you should be then you have uniform pressure over the entire face of the pad.

    Pad is flat with equal pressure when machine waxing with simple orbital polisher







    2: Machine waxing does a better job of spreading out and laying down a thin, uniform layer of wax

    When machine waxing with an orbital polisher like a Griot's Garage 6" DA Orbital Polisher or a Porter Cable 7424XP orbital polisher you select a speed setting that just maintains pad rotation while moving the polisher over the paint. Pad rotation helps the pad to glide better while lack of pad rotation will cause the pad to drag over the paint. You want the pad to glide over the paint.


    With the pad both oscillating and rotating and with 100% of the face of the pad in contact with the paint and having equal pressure, the machine will do a better job of spreading out a flat, uniform layer of wax or sealant. The human hand on the other hand, (no pun intended), will tend to lay down thicker layers and thinner layers in a random fashion.


    With the Porter Cable 7424XP this would be the 5.0 speed setting but not the 6.0 speed setting. There's a subtle difference there but you don't want or need maximum speed to spread out a non-cleaning wax. (You do want maximum speed when applying a cleaner/wax to neglected paint to remove swirls, scratches, water spots and oxidation)


    With the Griot's Garage 6' DA Orbital Polisher you only need the 2-3 setting to maintain pad rotation when moving the polisher over the paint. (The Griot's Garage 6" DA Orbital Polisher has a LOT more useable power than the Porter Cable)



    3: Machine waxing is faster than waxing by hand

    Could just be me but once you have the technique down for a technique I call Kissing the finish, you can machine wax a car about as fast as you can walk around a car and you can't say this for hand waxing.




    4: Machine waxing can amp up the gloss and shine

    The simple act of running an oscillating pad with a smooth creamy substance and soft foam pad over car paint has a polishing effect even if the wax or sealant is non-abrasive. It may be subtle but when the practice is considered in extremes then my experience shows machine applying a wax or sealant is more likely to amp up the gloss and shine versus dull down the paint. Hand waxing, if not done carefully and with some level of skill can and could dull the paint down a tick or two depending upon the person, their skill and experience level and the paint system being waxed.




    Quote Originally Posted by Mark

    I’ve struggled with this as I find the machine blending it in so fine that there is very little residue to wipe away where as there is considerably more after applying by hand.


    I don't know what you're using? You didn't tell me if you're using a finishing wax or a cleaner/wax?


    The difference is,

    A finishing wax or show car wax - is for paint in brand new or excellent conation. The paint passes the Baggie Test and there are now swirls and scratches. Thus it does not need any cleaning or abrading, just pure protection.


    A cleaner/wax also called an AIO - contains chemical cleaners and most often contains both chemical cleaners and abrasive technology of some sort. (there are good cleaner/waxes and bad cleaner/waxes it all depends on the abrasive technology used in the product).



    A cleaner wax is for doing three things in one step.

    1: Clean or abrade the paint - this means it remove below surface paint defects like swirls, scratches, water spots and oxidation

    2: Polishes the paint to maximize gloss and clarity.

    3: Leaves some form and some level of protection behind.



    A cleaner/wax is for paint in neglected condition, not paint in excellent condition.

    So when choosing a wax or sealant you first must evaluate the paint and determine the condition of the paint. By the way, I cover ALL of this in my my how-to book, The Complete Guide to a Show Car Shine under the chapter, Visual and Physical Inspection, which goes from page 30 to page 40 as like my answers on this forum, my how-to books are VERY in-depth and complete.



    The reason you're not leaving a film of wax on the paint when machine applying it could be caused by a number of things,

    1: You're buffing too long. This is bad technique called buffing to a dry buff and I cover this in the above how-to book aslo.

    2: You're not using enough product.

    3: You're using a thick foam pad and it's absorbing a lot of the product thus wasting it.

    4: Maybe it's the product?



    Quote Originally Posted by Mark

    Also, do you have any thoughts adding wax (such as Wolfgang Fusion or Pinnacle) on top of a coat of sealant?

    I have an article on HOW to properly do what's called topping but I don't practice it myself. I wrote the article to show people the correct way to do (if they're going to do it), and the reasoning behind the practice.

    Me?

    I do a GREAT job of applying a single product or LSP (Last Step Product), and then stick a fork in the project and call it done.

    I then, actively maintain my cars by washing and re-waxing as needed or BEFORE needed because I like how a fresh coat of wax looks on my vehicles INSTEAD of trying to get a year or 6 months or fill-in-the-blank that others do by not taking on the duty of PMs or Preventive Maintenance.



    Kind of like an oil change.

    We all change the oil in our car's motor BEFORE the oils is completely spent and no longer lubrication so we don't blow up our engine.

    In the same analogy, we should re-wax our cars BEFORE all the last coat of wax has completely worn off and our paint suffers attack and deterioration.


    A re-paint is incredibly expensive. Regularly applying a coat of wax, even an expensive wax compared to a re-paint is incredibly cheap.


    Hope the above helps and I hope you don't mind I took your questions from Facebook messaging and e-mail to the forum because it's IMPOSSIBLE To format information like you see above on Facebook.

    And it's really hard to format a reply in e-mail and hope or assume all the pictures, links and videos will be correctly sent over the Internet and received by the dozens of different e-mail software and devices in the world.


    And lastly, I can't invest the time to type out a detailed answer like you see above for one set of eyeballs.

    You are 100% completely encouraged to join our forum and talk with me right here as this is where I answer questions, not on Facebook and not in an e-mail.



  2. #2
    Mike Phillips
    Guest

    Re: Is there a benefit to machine applying a wax or sealant versus applying by hand?


  3. #3

  4. #4
    Mike Phillips
    Guest

    Re: Is there a benefit to machine applying a wax or sealant versus applying by hand?

    And to make it easy for Mark or anyone to join this forum,


    Click here to join the AGO forum


    This forum is the most powerful detailing tool you can have in your tool chest.




  5. #5
    Super Member Joe@NextLevelDetail's Avatar
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    Re: Is there a benefit to machine applying a wax or sealant versus applying by hand?

    Excellent post.


    4: Machine waxing can amp up the gloss and shine

    The simple act of running an oscillating pad with a smooth creamy substance and soft foam pad over car paint has a polishing effect even if the wax or sealant is non-abrasive. It may be subtle but when the practice is considered in extremes then my experience shows machine applying a wax or sealant is more likely to amp up the gloss and shine versus dull down the paint. Hand waxing, if not done carefully and with some level of skill can and could dull the paint down a tick or two depending upon the person, their skill and experience level and the paint system being waxed.
    This was a great read. I could not agree with you more.

  6. #6
    Junior Member soobaroo's Avatar
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    Re: Is there a benefit to machine applying a wax or sealant versus applying by hand?

    Mike, is putting a coat of pinnacle liquid wax over WGDGPS a bad idea? I see it is recommended that the paint is polished and free of wax or sealants but topping sealants with wax seems to be popular. I'm confused.

  7. #7
    Mike Phillips
    Guest

    Re: Is there a benefit to machine applying a wax or sealant versus applying by hand?

    Quote Originally Posted by soobaroo View Post

    Mike, is putting a coat of pinnacle liquid wax over WGDGPS a bad idea?

    I see it is recommended that the paint is polished and free of wax or sealants but topping sealants with wax seems to be popular.

    I'm confused.

    Read my article on topping, I think it will help...


    Topping - Definition - How to Top also called Topping



    Here's an excerpt from the article...


    Topping - Definition

    The practice of applying a different type of wax or paint sealant over a first application of a wax or paint sealant to either create a thicker and more durable layer of protection or to create a deep, wet-look shine and normally both.

    The normal practice is to apply a synthetic paint sealant first to lay down a long lasting layer of protection and then follow this with an application of a Carnauba Wax to add yet another layer, (of wax), to protect the layer of synthetic paint sealant and to also give the paint the warmth, depth and richness of color that Carnauba waxes are famous for creating in the show car circuit.

    Topping requires that the second product not have any type of cleaning agents, be they chemical cleaners, abrasives or even harsh solvents as these types of ingredients will act to remove the first layer of sealant, which would defect the purpose of topping.




  8. #8
    Super Member Kamakaz1961's Avatar
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    Re: Is there a benefit to machine applying a wax or sealant versus applying by hand?

    Thank you Mike for this thread. I only machine wax/sealant because of what you stated in your post!
    CJ
    2013 Mustang GT w/Track Pack 6-Speed Manual
    Save the Manual!

  9. #9
    Junior Member soobaroo's Avatar
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    Re: Is there a benefit to machine applying a wax or sealant versus applying by hand?

    Thanks Mike. That makes perfect sense. So Pinnacle liquid wax should be a good choice as a topper. Got it.

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