SONAX Fallout Remover - How to chemically decontaminate paint before restoring a show car finish by Mike Phillips

[Mike Phillips]

Mike, I noticed the Sonax Fallout Remover looks just like the IronX stuff in that it turns a purple color when sprayed on.

What is the difference between the Sonax product and the IronX product?

Thanks,

Shawn

Hi Shawn,

Good questions as most iron removers are pretty much the same in what they remove.

SONAX named this

Fallout Remover

Which is a little different than iron remover. From the store page for the product, (link is included in my write-up), the copy states,

SONAX Fallout Cleaner is a concentrated paint decontamination spray that removes stubborn iron deposits, industrial fallout and lime deposits, leaving your paint smooth and glossy.

So besides iron contamination this formula reads to be a little more wide spectrum as it also removes industrial fallout, (usually we use clay for this), and lime deposits (from water both city and well water).


After washing and chemically decontaminating the paint I then clayed it and took pictures of the clay to show what was coming off the paint. The pictures show you can't just rely on one forum of decontamination. If a car's paint is neglected enough to have one type of contamination chances are incredibly good that it's going to have both and even ALL types of contamination.

Wait till you see the results of a 2-step compounding and polishing process to this 60 year old paint. The owner picks it up today and he's going to be blown away!

[GSKR]

Hey mike I detailed those rims like a year ago.mike is a very nice gentlemen.

[GSKR]

Hey mike I detailed those rims like a year ago.mike is a very nice gentlemen.

I put those wheels on my FB page.But before I polished them.

[Mike Phillips]

Hey mike I detailed those rims like a year ago.

mike is a very nice gentlemen.

Mike is truly a great guy. I first met Mike back in 2012 when he brought the 1936 Ford Roadster to one of our Thursday Night classes were we did a Show Car Makeover.

Here's the link to that write-up

1936 Ford Roadster - Show Car Makeover






A LOT of cool cars have gone through Autogeek's Show Car Garage since I came to work here back in 2009 and two of them have been Mike's.


He'll be by today and I'm going to make a video with him and he's going to share how the stationwagon body came about because Oldsmobile didn't build these wagons an outside company did.


And for those that don't know who Mike Stowe is, he's the founder of Classic Instruments, a company that makes custom replacement instruments for muscle cars, classics and streetrods. Everyone in the car hobby knows Mike.

[Sharpie]

This is probably a stupid question but why use a Sonax fallout decontaminator or IronX type product when you are going to compound? Doesn't the compound process remove contaminates? If it can remove scratches within the paint why wouldn't the contaminates also be lifted off? I understand using a clay bar before the correction process but not the chemical means. Has anyone tried spraying an IronX product after compounding to see if contaminates are still there? Seems like it may be an extra step that may not be necessary. I just don't get how a compound can remove a microscopic amount of clear coat/paint but not industrial fallout.

[TMQ]

I'm just guessing here but this is what I'm thinking about.
A couple of things comes to mind.

1. Getting iron particles in pads---may not get all iron particles cleaned out 100% via wash
2. Iron particles may be in deeper than the amount of clear you will take off via buffing/polishing.
3. And lastly, scratching paint while buffing. Iron particles will act like sandpaper.

Tom

[Eldorado2k]

3. And lastly, scratching paint while buffing. Iron particles will act like sandpaper.

I believe this is the claim to its fame.^ At least I think it is...

[Sharpie]

I'm just guessing here but this is what I'm thinking about.
A couple of things comes to mind.

1. Getting iron particles in pads---may not get all iron particles cleaned out 100% via wash
2. Iron particles may be in deeper than the amount of clear you will take off via buffing/polishing.
3. And lastly, scratching paint while buffing. Iron particles will act like sandpaper.

Tom

1. Iron particles will not come out from claying? Why does the bag test after claying feel smooth?
2. Particles deeper that compound will take out? How could one not feel or see that?

Not trying to sound like a tool, just curious

[TMQ]

I see you have a 16 bottle there. How much was left after treating the Olds?

I just used McKee's iron remover on a Lexus GS350 the other day and to just to get it "damp" all over the car I used almost all of the 16 oz bottle. Is this right?

Tom

[Mike Phillips]

This is probably a stupid question but why use a Sonax fallout decontaminator or IronX type product when you are going to compound?

Doesn't the compound process remove contaminates? If it can remove scratches within the paint why wouldn't the contaminates also be lifted off? I understand using a clay bar before the correction process but not the chemical means. Has anyone tried spraying an IronX product after compounding to see if contaminates are still there? Seems like it may be an extra step that may not be necessary. I just don't get how a compound can remove a microscopic amount of clear coat/paint but not industrial fallout.

Good question...

I agree that compounding, especially heavy or aggressive compounding will remove the top layer of paint and thus remove any topical contamination.

I didn't invent these types of products but I'll take a stab at answering your questions with my knowledge of the paint polishing process. At the end of the day what I've always said about the chemical decontamination step is that it is an optional step... you don't have to do it. It's completely up to you and how you view your cars and your work practice.


The idea that has been presented by the industry is that it is safer for the paint to remove any form of iron particle via a chemical method than to risk removing any iron contamination via a mechanical method as some iron particles may be large enough that IF removed via a mechanical means, for example via detailing clay or a Nanoskin towel that the removed particle would then put scratches into the paint surface as the clay or towel is being rubbed over the paint surface.

Back when I worked for Meguiar's and started and then ran the Thursday Night Open Garage Classes, (I originally started them on Wednesday nights), a person brought in their car with Rail Dust Contamination. Now note this would be between 2006 and mid-2009 as I document here. This was WAY before the popular iron removers were ever invented and introduced. So we didn't have that option at Meguiar's to chemically decontaminate the car. Instead we used what we had back then and that was detailing clay. As we clayed the car, the clay removed the iron contaminants and as the clay was rubbed against the paint it put scratches into the paint. It's possible I may have taken pictures of the car and explained what happened in this forum group but off-hand I don't remember as I've taken and shared thousands of pictures over the years and it's hard to remember each and every car I've worked on at both Meguiar's and now Autogeek or in my life.


So I have one real world experience where I can appreciate the value of chemically dissolving iron contaminants instead of mechanically removing them.


Another idea accepted by some is that it's safer for the paint to chemically dissolve iron contamination off the car before claying/mechanically decontaminating AND compounding because if you don't remove the iron contaminants before compounding then as the compound abrasives begin abrading and removing paint IF the iron contaminants are of any particle size and they get trapped between the pad and the paint then as you're machine compounding (or even hand compounding if you know how to do it the right way), it's possible for these particles to put scratches into the paint.

I have not seen this specific issue in my life but I do remember one time when I did a full blown multiple-step show car makevover to a black 7 series BMW and at one point during the poishing process with a rotary buffer, a Meguiar's W1000 foam polishing pad and Meguiar's M09 Hi Tech Swirl Free Polish, (the best pad and polish available on the market around the year 1988 or 1989), that I discovered the IMPORTANCE of cleaning your pad often because ONE TINY abrasive particle was trapped between my pad and the paint and after perfecting the paint with a compound I proceeded to instill ARC SCRATCHES throughout the entire finish and had to re-polish the entire car. That was a pain.

The other idea behind chemically decontaminating the paint is that some people are NOT going to perform a compounding step that would remove any topical or lodged iron contamination but they want the peace of mind knowing there is no iron contamination before they do any polishing and sealing or perhaps using a one-step cleaner/wax.


One of my new favorite saysing goes like this,

There's a million ways to skin a cat

(Sorry PETA people, but it's just a saying, I don't personally skin cats and I don't know anyone that does)


There's probably a dozen companies that now have these types of products on the market and anyone truly interested in finding out why are more then welcome and even encouraged to contact the representatives at these companies and ask them this same question that Sharpie has asked here on this forum. And if you do... please come back here and share the answer.

Me?

I'm a how-to guy. I do my best to show people both how to do something and why they're doing it. So I hope my answers above help in the latter part of the last sentence.


Iron removers are kind of like foam guns and the impact a foamed car has is like the impact a picture of paint bleeding has and it's powerful.


I posted the pictures of this car with the SONAX Fallout Remover to my Facebook page and in less than 24 hours it had over 10,000 people reached and 21 shares. That's a lot. Many of my posts on my FB page hit 4000, 5000, 6000 people reached but this post took off like a rocket.

Here's a screen shot.





Guess it's kind of like water beading. Anyone that understands car paint knows that water beading is a bad thing but it's what people want.


Hope that helps...