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  1. #21
    Member Jeff at Gyeon's Avatar
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    Re: Still have some questions on Geyon Product Comparisons

    Quote Originally Posted by RLove View Post
    I bought the Syncro kit for brand new Honda Ridgeline. Unfortunately the Mohs just barely had enough in the bottle for one coat - very disappointed knowing that it really needs two coats, (and I applied it carefully sus[ecting what ended up being reality...the instructions said to put on a thick coat and I knew that wasn't going to happen) I moved forward and applied the Skin, knowing that the even tinier bottle wouldn't cover everything. I guess this company thinks that everyone drives small cars. I wish they would've offered at least two sizes since i feel cheated after spending $200 and not getting the full effect. We'll see what Ive got when I start driving it again. But again, very disappointed.
    Unfortunately, as others have mentioned here you've vastly over used the product in a single layer. 50 ml of MOHS is plenty to get around a car in two coats. The same with SKIN, there is plenty in the bottle for a single layer. Very sorry this was your initial experience as SYNCRO is awesome!

  2. #22
    Senior Member TTQ B4U's Avatar
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    Re: Still have some questions on Geyon Product Comparisons

    Quote Originally Posted by RLove View Post
    I bought the Syncro kit for brand new Honda Ridgeline. Unfortunately the Mohs just barely had enough in the bottle for one coat - very disappointed knowing that it really needs two coats, (and I applied it carefully sus[ecting what ended up being reality...the instructions said to put on a thick coat and I knew that wasn't going to happen) I moved forward and applied the Skin, knowing that the even tinier bottle wouldn't cover everything. I guess this company thinks that everyone drives small cars. I wish they would've offered at least two sizes since i feel cheated after spending $200 and not getting the full effect. We'll see what Ive got when I start driving it again. But again, very disappointed.
    Something isn't right here. 50ml of Mohs can do several vehicles and SUV's. a newer Ridgeline is actually more of a medium size vehicle too. Should have had enough of both products for a complete application.

    Which applicator and suede wrap did you use to apply it? One solid line of product down the middle of the applicator is more than enough to begin. Once primed like that a few drops across it will suffice as you continue the application.

    We're all here to help as you learn the process. Feel free to share more details.

  3. #23
    Senior Member WillSports3's Avatar
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    Re: Still have some questions on Geyon Product Comparisons

    Echoing what others have said, 30ml of liquid coating is enough for two cots around any personal vehicle. Maybe application process or something here.
    2016 Mazda 3 Sports GT
    2015 Lexus IS250 F Sport

  4. #24
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    Re: Still have some questions on Geyon Product Comparisons

    If these are true coatings, wouldn't it stand to reason that a thicker application would result in a thicker layer?

  5. #25
    Senior Member BSoares's Avatar
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    Re: Still have some questions on Geyon Product Comparisons

    Quote Originally Posted by DUBL0WS6 View Post
    If these are true coatings, wouldn't it stand to reason that a thicker application would result in a thicker layer?
    Only so much area that it can stick to. If you cover a piece of paper in glue then pour a bottle of sprinkles on it. Move the paper around all you want but once the glue is all covered the sprinkles that didn’t stick at first will just fall off. There’s no more surface to bond to. Some coatings will reject themselves on a second layer. Others are made to bond to a different coating applied first but doesn’t mean more and more layers give more protection.
    Bruno Soares


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  7. #26
    Senior Member PaulMys's Avatar
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    Re: Still have some questions on Geyon Product Comparisons

    Quote Originally Posted by BSoares View Post
    Only so much area that it can stick to. If you cover a piece of paper in glue then pour a bottle of sprinkles on it. Move the paper around all you want but once the glue is all covered the sprinkles that didn’t stick at first will just fall off. There’s no more surface to bond to. Some coatings will reject themselves on a second layer. Others are made to bond to a different coating applied first but doesn’t mean more and more layers give more protection.
    Damn. This is an excellent analogy, Bruno.
    It is no coincidence that man's best friend cannot talk.

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  9. #27
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    Re: Still have some questions on Geyon Product Comparisons

    Quote Originally Posted by BSoares View Post
    Only so much area that it can stick to. If you cover a piece of paper in glue then pour a bottle of sprinkles on it. Move the paper around all you want but once the glue is all covered the sprinkles that didn’t stick at first will just fall off. There’s no more surface to bond to. Some coatings will reject themselves on a second layer. Others are made to bond to a different coating applied first but doesn’t mean more and more layers give more protection.
    I understand that there is only so much clearcoat surface area but not sure I totally agree. What's the purpose of a topper if the product doesn't stick to the base coating(assuming similar chemistry)? I understand that eventually you start to remove or disturb a layer due to the solvents. But in the glue analogy, the glue or polymers stick to themselves.

  10. #28
    Senior Member WillSports3's Avatar
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    Re: Still have some questions on Geyon Product Comparisons

    A thicker layer of coating is meaningless to 99 percent of the population. What is truly the point of a thicker layer of coating?
    It comes down to coating density. I'm gonna use CQuartz UK as an example. It has multiple siloxane forms in the blend, and they chain together in the resin itself. That means that usually Cquartz UK bonds at a 1.5 micron level because the layer was resin was designed to hold its siloxane blend. Now, you let it cure, then put on your second layer. You might get to an even 2 micron level. Why? Because when you try to apply the second layer, the resin layer itself (responsible for the thickness) won't create a second layer on top. Instead, it'll just deposit the siloxane layer ontop of the resin that's already there. There's still bonding agents so it'll still drop into the resin. But the rest of the resin won't be there, because you wiped it off. Why? Because that layer of resin has no clearcoat to set onto. A coating surface is not the same as clearcoat. The clearcoat will cause a chemical reaction, the coating surface will not. So what happens when you do a third layer? Nothing really. You might be at 2.1 micron or 2.2. There's only so much siloxane components that layer of resin can hold.

    When you take Gyeon Mohs and you put on one layer, there's a certain amount of protection agent in the resin. When you do the second layer, it'll add more protection agent in the resin. When you do the third layer, same thing. But if you try to do a fourth layer, the resin itself has no more room for more protection agent. When coating products talk about layerability, this is what's actually happening. You're making the one layer of resin on your paint more concentrated with protective agents.

    When products are not layerable, it generally means that the coating already has the maximum density of protection agents the resin can hold. You can go ahead and add as many layers as you want, it just won't do anything. Whatever you put on in the second layer will be on your towel afterwards after the wipe off.

    The thickness and layerability of coatings is a very minute factor in their effectiveness.

    Using the worst version of layerability, Ceramic Pro. It's individual applications are super easy to apply, and yet you need like 4 layers. You basically apply to an entire panel and then wipe off. Then you do your other 3 layers to add enough Siloxane components into the resin that it becomes actually durable.

    Optimum Pro+ (whatever the two layer one is called)
    You have to add the second layer in during a specific time frame because the top layer is inducing a specific chemical reaction with the bottom layer because their coatings are SiC based. Once you're past that window, the bottom layer has cured and will not accept a chemical reaction. The way that coating works is one layer goes in, then second layer goes in. The two layers then combine to create a chemical reaction to form a different base element than what was put on.

    Again, coating thickness only matters to 1 percent of those who use coatings and only if they understand what the point of it is.
    2016 Mazda 3 Sports GT
    2015 Lexus IS250 F Sport

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  12. #29
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    Re: Still have some questions on Geyon Product Comparisons

    That's the first time I've seen it explained that way and some products may work that way due to solvents. I guess it also depends on how a product crosslinks. I know some products claim to stack on top of each other to a certain degree.

  13. #30
    Senior Member WillSports3's Avatar
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    Re: Still have some questions on Geyon Product Comparisons

    It always depends on the product. You gotta remember a lot of the hydrophobic layer coatings are not really SiO2 coatings. Usually they're a different Silicone based coating focused on hydrophobic properties and slickness more than anything else.
    2016 Mazda 3 Sports GT
    2015 Lexus IS250 F Sport

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