Polisher types?

**BooGTS** · 04-20-2012, 11:34 PM

Good Morning All,

I've been buffing, polishing and waxing for a long time now using either hand, an older craftsman unit, or even a pad on a drill (Dewalt drill is cordless).

Well, I've always had a lack of pad options. I want a pad for each compound and to have a lot of options. I've gone to like Adams website and even here seems to focus around two models, a small noisy PC and an overly expensive model from a brand I've never heard from. I almost pulled the trigger on the new DeWalt DWP849X as its quality wouldn't be in question, reviews said it was quiet, and it would match my other power tools - that last thing isn't a big deal though. Still, I'm not sure if the pads that fit the PC don't fit that for some reason, or what the deal is.

I'm looking to buy something pretty quick with some pads, but don't want to make the wrong move just because I don't know enough. Will bomb around here, but figured I'd make a post. Thanks!

**Tundra_10** · 04-21-2012, 12:13 AM

BooGTS,

First, I would like to welcome you to AG. Its a wonderful site and if you cannot find the information here, you either did not ask the question or do not know how to use the search function.

To help you with your quest for information, I will do my best to tell you what I can on the subject, others will join in as well to add on.

The PC 7424XP is a very popular model because it has been around, has a good track record, does a good job at paint correction and is competitively priced.

The other you are talking about, I can only imagine is the Flex due to your description of being expensive. The Flex is a german-made product that is made with high quality and a lot of attention to detail (no pun intended). There are cheaper options, however if you want the very best, you will not be disappointed with it. It has a parting gift no other DA has, it has forced rotation which means it will not stop spinning when applying force. The others have a "floating head" design that will infact stop if too much force is applied. This feature allows the Flex faster correction ability.

Both of those units are what are called dual action (DA) polishers. Not only do they rotate they also make micro circles as well. This sort of action makes these devices easier to use and control for novice detailers and also helps even seasoned detailers with jobs that require less correction or finishing touches of a correction that would be much harder to achieve with a standard rotary polisher.

The DeWalt you mentioned is a popular choice and a good option for a rotary polisher, if you have never used a machine (other then the products you described) I would stick with a DA unit.

As far as pad size, that is just a matter of getting the correct backing plate. There are certain pads that are made only for rotaries and certain ones that work better on DA's but other then that, size wise, you are only limited to the backing plates that you buy for your tools.

Do some research on the PC, Griots, and Flex. I promise you you cannot go wrong with any one of them.

There is actually a third option as well, it is by Griots Garage some prefer it over the Flex or the PC, all 3 are good machines though.

**BobbyG** · 04-21-2012, 05:55 AM

To Autogeek Online!

Tundra_10 has given you some great information!

Here's a couple of articles to go along with that he's said regarding polishers.

New to Machine Polishing?

How to choose the right polisher for your detailing project

Video: How to pick the right polisher

Dual Action Polishers

Video: How-To do a "Section Pass" when Machine Polishing with a DA Polisher

Spend some time sifting through some of the great articles....

Articles by Mike Phillips

Here's some great information that will help you if you need it.

I prefer to put my own package together.

A couple of over the counter products that work extremely well

Foam Pads

To simplify pad usage, I've given a generic usage of pads and products.

Compounding

Compounds or aggressive products are generally used on firmer pads, Yellow, Orange, and Green.

Polishing

The White and Gray pads are generally used with polishes.

Sealants & Waxes

Blue and Red foam pads work nicely for applying sealants and waxes.
These are a very good choice of pads for the Porter Cable style dual action polisher..

**BillE** · 04-21-2012, 07:16 AM

What both Bobby and Tundra says is fantastic advice...so I'll just say...

Welcome to AGO!

Bill

**Danube** · 04-21-2012, 08:53 AM

**Old Tiger** · 04-21-2012, 10:24 AM

Originally Posted by BooGTS

Good Morning All,

I've been buffing, polishing and waxing for a long time now using either hand, an older craftsman unit, or even a pad on a drill (Dewalt drill is cordless).

Well, I've always had a lack of pad options. I want a pad for each compound and to have a lot of options. I've gone to like Adams website and even here seems to focus around two models, a small noisy PC and an overly expensive model from a brand I've never heard from. I almost pulled the trigger on the new DeWalt DWP849X as its quality wouldn't be in question, reviews said it was quiet, and it would match my other power tools - that last thing isn't a big deal though. Still, I'm not sure if the pads that fit the PC don't fit that for some reason, or what the deal is.

I'm looking to buy something pretty quick with some pads, but don't want to make the wrong move just because I don't know enough. Will bomb around here, but figured I'd make a post. Thanks!

I have the 849X. I have a few BPs. My favorite is the 6" Megs Solo. a 5" is a little small for that beast IME. A Griots is somewhere between a PC and a Flex from a power comparison. With MF pads it is impressive for correction.

**SON1C** · 04-21-2012, 12:53 PM

GG

**BooGTS** · 04-23-2012, 01:15 AM

Well, I've done alot of reading, and a few hours watching of mike's great videos. Now of course, I want the Flex, but the price is just a little much for an amateur hobbyist such as myself. I think the GG is at the top of the list despite some quality concerns. So long as the head doesn't fly off like what happened to that poor PC owner on a GT500, I can deal with waiting for a replacement so long as they are still in biz and continue to have the customer service people claim. (This is the model with the lifetime warranty correct?)

Now, I have another question assuming I get the GG - pads. I'm going to be doing a variety of things, from a full wash, clay, compound, polish, wax on a 7 year old car that likely has never been waxed and has scratches to a cleanup on my Jeep that I did last year - just swirl remover to wax likely and likely a few family cars (gotta take care of mom...). What is a good assortment of pads/brands/place to buy? I sadly just used two pads before and washed between products, so this whole pad thing is new territory. I heard alot of names of pads and colors and types, but links would be awesome.

They have a 3" unit as well - I saw mikes vid where he used it on a large white truck quite nicely, but would a non-pro really get the benefit from having this extra tool (in addition to the 6") and pads?

Thanks for the help thus far!!!

Mike Phillips · 04-23-2012, 06:26 AM

Originally Posted by BooGTS

Now, I have another question assuming I get the GG - pads.

I just wrote an article for this topic, if you go to my article list, which you can find by looking at my Signature Line in any of my posts, (over 24,000 posts as of last week so it's pretty easy to find), then look under the below heading...

Buffing Pads - Wool Pads & Foam Pads PLUS Backing Plates

And you'll find this article...

NEW - 5 inch Backing Plates on Meguiar's, Griot's and Porter Cable DA Polishers

As for the 3" Griot's Mini Polisher. Many people will tell you it's too underpowered to do any correction and really is unless you use expert technique and have patience.

Heck I removed #2000 grit sanding marks using only a medium cut polish in this thread so it obviously can be used to abrade paint. Some like it some don't, you need to try it to find out... I really like it for a Dampsander when I have a thin panel to sand or want to reduce the area I'm sanding to a small footprint.

Another option is to get 3" or 4" pads and the right backing plate for your DA Polisher but keep in mind that when you put such a small pad on a large tool the tool becomes tippy when working on horizontal surfaces. No real issues when working on vertical panels because you'll be more in focused control of the tool body.

Check this out...

Griot's Garage 3" Mini Polisher - Extreme Demo - Warning!

Warning! Please don't try this on your own car.

I've had a number of people ask me about the power offered by the new Generation II Griot's Garage 3" Mini Polisher and so after scratching my head and trying to think of some kind of demonstration I could do and then share the pictures from I came up with the below Extreme Demo.

Please understand, it's only common sense that this 3" Mini Polisher is not made for or intended to be used to remove sanding marks out of clear coat paints. In a best "worst case" scenario, you would finish out with #3000 or #4000 grit paper. I chose #2000 to make it extreme.

This 3" polisher definitely has more power than the first generation offered by Griot's Garage but it's not for removing sanding marks, it's for removing light surface defects with an emphasis on the word LIGHT. It can also be used for applying wax or paint sealant to small or thin panels or for things like Motorcycles.

Note: There are more aggressive products you can use and it's possible to make a more aggressive 3" pad but in my life I've noticed when working with small pads like this there's a tendency for increased potential for haze and micro-marring when getting small. It is important to keep the surface slippery for this kind of defect removal.

And for what it's worth... I've been doing this for a few years and sometimes a little experience in the craft of polishing paint can go a long ways...

Without further ado...
The polisher on the left is the first generation, the polisher on the right is the new Generation II Griot's Garage 3" Mini Polisher. I chose the Wolfgang Twins because they are both very wet products and you need hyper-lubricity to help aid in pad rotation when removing below surface defects, or in other words to remove a little paint.

Meguiar's #2000 Nikken Finishing Papers were used to give me an extreme test section and I used the Griot's Garage foam polishing and waxing pads for sanding mark removal and final polishing.

Not pictured is the Detailers Pride Max Wax which I applied after polishing

One section of the test hood was thoroughly wet-sanded using Nikken #2000 Finishing Papers

If you look closely you can see a few very light tracers, in the REAL World, anytime you're doing sanding you would remove the sanding marks using a rotary buffer and/or a DA Polisher if you have the knowledge and skill to use these two types of tools for this type of work. You would not use nor expect these kinds of dramatic results from the tool I used but I'll let the results speak for themselves.

After results

Nikken reflection shot

Flipped horizontally...

In this shot I'm actually focusing on the sanding marks between the wall poster and the reflection of the wall poster.

In this shot I'm focusing on the reflected image...

In this shot you can see the subtle distinction between the seam in the poster in the reflected image.

And a self-portraight...

Question: Does the new Griot's Garage 3" Mini Polisher have more power?

Answer: You betcha!

Should it be the only polisher in your detailing arsenal? No not at all. It's a nice complimentary tool for thin panels, small components, motorcycle detailing and anything else you can find a use for it.

Products shown
Griot's Garage 3" Mini Polisher
3-Pack of 3" Polishing Pads - You want lots of these, 2-3 packs
3" Waxing Pads
Wolfgang Total Swirl Remover 3.0
Wolfgang Finishing Glaze
Nikken Finishing Papers
Meguiar's E-7200 Backing Pad

Not shown
Detailer's Pride Max Wax
Cobra Supreme 530 Microfiber Towel 6 Pack

I use to live life on the edge of the razor blade... now I live life on the blade of the butter knife - Mike Phillips

Had to throw that last quote in there, I made it up years ago and after doing this extreme demo it seemed fitting...

Mike Phillips · 04-23-2012, 06:34 AM

Originally Posted by BooGTS

Good Morning All,

I almost pulled the trigger on the new DeWalt DWP849X as its quality wouldn't be in question, reviews said it was quiet, and it would match my other power tools - that last thing isn't a big deal though.

You still want to have a DA Polisher in your arsenal for all kinds of reasons. Check this article out, also in my article list...

Hologram Free with a Rotary Buffer

Originally Posted by BooGTS

Still, I'm not sure if the pads that fit the PC don't fit that for some reason, or what the deal is.

If you get a 5" flexible backing plate you can use your 5.5" pads on either a DA or a rotary buffer. This last Saturday I taught I new forum member how to use all the tools we offer here at Autogeek including using a 5" flexible backing plate with the same 5.5" pads we were previously using on the DA Polisher.

Check it out...

Pictures from Autogeek's Saturday Detail Clinic - April 21st

Teaching Kevin how to use a Brinkmann Swirl Finder Light to inspect the paint

In the next three shots you can see the swirls, scratches and stains...

In this shot, the whitish stuff is some type of stain from road grime that did not wipe off and would also not wash off...

Here's Kevin using the Meguiar's G110v2 dual action polisher, he also used the Porter Cable 7424XP and the Griot's Garage Random Orbital Polisher.
(All the same "type" of tools)

At all my classes you get to try out all the tools, here' Kevin trying out the Cyclo Polisher...

Here's Kevin testing out the Flex 3401 Forced Rotation Dual Action Polisher

Kevin using a 5" flexible backing plate with 5.5" Hydro-Tech pads on a Flex Rotary Buffer

Here's some after shots... the hood on this car went from a swirled-out mess to a show car finish by a guy who has never machine polished in his life!

You're off to a great start... that is doing research on the best detailing discussion forum around...