Single Stage Black Paint on Vintage Race Car.

[Geflackt]

Single Stage Black Paint on Vintage Race Car.

As a new poster here, I'd first like to thank everyone for all of the tips and tricks, and AGO for supplying great products. They've been very helpful on CC paints (modern British, German, and Italian sports cars) and now on single stage.


I'm currently in the process of polishing, then protecting, the older single stage paint on my 1935 MG race special. It's going to Simeone's museum for a short weekend display in April, so I'm taking the time to really clean up the paint along with everywhere else on the car. It has several racing seasons on this round of detailing, but I try to keep it as clean as possible.

Here it is in current form, with engine panels and interior removed for detailing and other work:





The paint is a single stage black from the mid-to-late 1970's, covering over aluminum panels. I'm not sure of the thickness, but the paint seems very hard. There are plenty of marks and cracks throughout, but this is patina I'd like to keep. What I want to correct and polish are scratches that have occurred through the years. Besides general scratching, I'm also seeing what could be shrinkage - it's like I can see the sanding marks under the paint if I have just the right light.

Sanding and blemishes visible at edge of light and lower:





Although there was no oxidation, I did go the #7 route as outlined by Mike Phillips. This did bring up some of the shine, mostly to the level I've had the last few years (usually before I put it in a local show). But I still wanted to attack the many fine scratches. The #7 did help some areas around the cockpit that had gotten dull.

Scratches that were on most of the car, seen here on a side panel:




Next step was to try some M100. I initially tried this using a yellow pad, but it really wasn't doing anything. Forgot I had a Griots fast finishing microfiber pad, so I tried that with M100. I'm using both 3" and 6" Griots polishers. Now it started making a difference! I did several passes in areas that really needed attention. There is still a way to go, especially on the panels containing louvers over the engine area, but the main area along the rear of the car looks so much better already. This car just has an infinite amount of sections to detail, aside from the black paint, there are details from a polished aluminum front end, to exposed brake and suspension areas.

Left side after a round of #7 and a few rounds of M100:




After a round of #7 and a few rounds of M100:




The other end of the side panel shown above, this time after a few rounds of M100:



Stone chips in leading edge of rear fender. Leave alone and just polish?



But I'm not quite sure where to stop with the M100 or the next few steps. I need to finish out the M100 step in the next few days. But after that, I was looking to use some of the products I already have - M205 and Menzerna SF3800 for polishing, then Souveran wax as a final. I've had decent success using the M205 and SF3800 on a red single stage paint, but the MG black paint I'd like to look as "liquid" as possible.

1) M205, SF3800, then wax? Pad type?
2) M205, #7, then wax? Pad type?
3) Other? I'm also open to trying products I don't have although I'm running out of weekends/nights.


I'll be racing again starting in June and I realize I'll pick up chips, but would at least like to have the car looking good at the start of the event, plus have some protection for the paint.

[Mike Phillips]

Single Stage Black Paint on Vintage Race Car.

As a new poster here, I'd first like to thank everyone for all of the tips and tricks, and AGO for supplying great products. They've been very helpful on CC paints (modern British, German, and Italian sports cars) and now on single stage.

Thank you for joining the forum and sharing this project. Incredible looking car. Maybe you can share a picture that shows the entire car?

[Mike Phillips]

But I'm not quite sure where to stop with the M100 or the next few steps. I need to finish out the M100 step in the next few days. But after that, I was looking to use some of the products I already have - M205 and Menzerna SF3800 for polishing, then Souveran wax as a final. I've had decent success using the M205 and SF3800 on a red single stage paint, but the MG black paint I'd like to look as "liquid" as possible.

1) M205, SF3800, then wax? Pad type?
2) M205, #7, then wax? Pad type?
3) Other? I'm also open to trying products I don't have although I'm running out of weekends/nights.


I'll be racing again starting in June and I realize I'll pick up chips, but would at least like to have the car looking good at the start of the event, plus have some protection for the paint.

Both the M205 and the SF3800 are top notch fine cut polishes. I'd try both of them with a foam polishing pad and inspect the results. Should look good. Normally - single stage black paint is soft, as in the softest paint there is to work on and that's because the pigment is Carbon Black and the pigment itself is soft so it makes the resin, (paint), soft. The opposite happens to resin when you use a pigment that is hard like white pigment, which is Titanium Dioxide Powder.


But there's always exceptions to the rule. That black paint could be Imron, which is an epoxy paint that is incredibly durable and that would also make it a tick or two harder than a single stage lacquer or enamel paint.


If you want to get something that I find works great on everything and makes buffing fast and easy, get some BLACKFIRE One Step. This is a one-step cleaner/wax and I use it to clean up and polish paint after heavy compounding instead of a polish. It works like a polish in that it removes any haze left by an aggressive compound or fiber pads and it also maximizes gloss and clarity like a polish. Because it has some form of protection in it - it also leaves the paint protected. You can also top it with the Pinnacle Souveran. Best of all it wipes off super easy when you let it dry, unlike most compounds and polishes.

Here's my original review for this product - no mock-up by this guy, always the real deal.


Review: BLACKFIRE One-Step Cleaner/Wax by Mike Phillips

[Mike Phillips]

I took the liberty to upload your pictures to your free gallery here at AGO so they could be "inserted" and then seen full size.


Here it is in current form, with engine panels and interior removed for detailing and other work:





The paint is a single stage black from the mid-to-late 1970's, covering over aluminum panels. I'm not sure of the thickness, but the paint seems very hard. There are plenty of marks and cracks throughout, but this is patina I'd like to keep. What I want to correct and polish are scratches that have occurred through the years. Besides general scratching, I'm also seeing what could be shrinkage - it's like I can see the sanding marks under the paint if I have just the right light.

Sanding and blemishes visible at edge of light and lower:





Although there was no oxidation, I did go the #7 route as outlined by Mike Phillips. This did bring up some of the shine, mostly to the level I've had the last few years (usually before I put it in a local show). But I still wanted to attack the many fine scratches. The #7 did help some areas around the cockpit that had gotten dull.

Scratches that were on most of the car, seen here on a side panel:




Next step was to try some M100. I initially tried this using a yellow pad, but it really wasn't doing anything. Forgot I had a Griots fast finishing microfiber pad, so I tried that with M100. I'm using both 3" and 6" Griots polishers. Now it started making a difference! I did several passes in areas that really needed attention. There is still a way to go, especially on the panels containing louvers over the engine area, but the main area along the rear of the car looks so much better already. This car just has an infinite amount of sections to detail, aside from the black paint, there are details from a polished aluminum front end, to exposed brake and suspension areas.

Left side after a round of #7 and a few rounds of M100:




After a round of #7 and a few rounds of M100:




The other end of the side panel shown above, this time after a few rounds of M100:



Stone chips in leading edge of rear fender. Leave alone and just polish?

[Mike Phillips]

Stone chips in leading edge of rear fender. Leave alone and just polish?

If you want to showcase the real-world wear-n-tear a REAL race car gets then polish over it and call it good.


If you want to fill in the rock chips and make it look better then

First - do al the compounding and polishing work.

Second - use the "Shoe Polish Technique" with Dr. Color Chip.


Watch this video





The best thing about the Dr. Color Chip system is if you don't like how your work turns out then simply remove the paint using the Sealact solvent and try again. Its a bubba-proof system that enables you to practice until perfect - or until your happy.

[Geflackt]

Thank you for joining the forum and sharing this project. Incredible looking car. Maybe you can share a picture that shows the entire car?

Thanks for the note about the pic gallery. Let's try this a different way:

Natural habitat last Fall:


From a few years ago with other MG's in our pre-war class:


Was used in an ad by Savannah for tourism, and that's my friend in an Alfa Monza:

[Mike Phillips]

Did a Google search, found one with a front like yours

[SWETM]

Wow what an awesome race car and still driven is very cool.

Now for recommendation I would follow Mike Phillips on this. He is the master of classic paints. And much more of cause LOL

Thanks for joining the forum and for shareing your car!

/ Tony

[Geflackt]

Both the M205 and the SF3800 are top notch fine cut polishes. I'd try both of them with a foam polishing pad and inspect the results. Should look good. Normally - single stage black paint is soft, as in the softest paint there is to work on and that's because the pigment is Carbon Black and the pigment itself is soft so it makes the resin, (paint), soft. The opposite happens to resin when you use a pigment that is hard like white pigment, which is Titanium Dioxide Powder.

But there's always exceptions to the rule. That black paint could be Imron, which is an epoxy paint that is incredibly durable and that would also make it a tick or two harder than a single stage lacquer or enamel paint.

If you want to get something that I find works great on everything and makes buffing fast and easy, get some BLACKFIRE One Step. This is a one-step cleaner/wax and I use it to clean up and polish paint after heavy compounding instead of a polish. It works like a polish in that it removes any haze left by an aggressive compound or fiber pads and it also maximizes gloss and clarity like a polish. Because it has some form of protection in it - it also leaves the paint protected. You can also top it with the Pinnacle Souveran. Best of all it wipes off super easy when you let it dry, unlike most compounds and polishes.

I'm actually surprised at how hard this paint is, but it does chip fairly easily(as seen by the fender chips, but there are plenty of others!). It's held up well for the amount of use the car gets. I don't think it's had any paint work except possibly the fenders and I had one of the fenders painted about 8 or 9 years ago. And I've never done this level of detail to the car in all the 10+ years I've had it, including as prep for several concours.

The Blackfire sounds interesting. The M100 has been surprising but a good bit of work. To skip through to Blackfire might be the ticket, or to use it at the end or beginning of a season.

I was leaning towards leaving the stone chips, but your note about a light touch up is what I need - I'd just like to take the focus away from that damage/patina.

Also, the sanding marks and blemishes I noted are only really visible unless you're looking for them. Most people looking at this car probably wouldn't even notice. I'm not sure much can be done about it and I'm reluctant to hit it with anything really aggressive.

[Geflackt]

Did a Google search, found one with a front like yours

Exactly - that's my car at the Red Mill show in NJ. Usually at the beginning of June. Great British show and an awesome setting!