Gyeon Mohs really sucks (photo)

[aquarian]

Have used Cquartz UK about 3 years ago on this particular car and I thought it was time to try something different. Well, first try it wasn’t successful as the surface area became cloudy/hazy right after I applied the second coat. Please see my other thread about this issue. Then, the second time around, after reposhied the area with Essence, I applied Mohs again and immediately wiped off within 1min. And guess what, the gloss from Essence is almost gone and all of a sudden I am seeing tons and tons of lint coming out from my Gyeon microfiber towel. See photo.




It seems Mohs is creating a lot of static on the surface and for some reason this brand new, only washed once, microfiber towel decided to give up? This is ridiculous. You can see from the photo that the individual fibers on the towel are all sticking up like crazy. I then decided to coat the coated area with Cquartz UK again and with wiping everything is still as glossy as it should. I am not seeing tons of lintimg when wiping Cquartz compares to Mohs.

Has anyone experienced the same?

[The Guz]

Could be incompatibility with Essence. Did you wipe down with some sort of prep wipe after essence? A low nap towel tends to work better when leveling out coatings.

[ntwillie1]

I hope this is an application/process issue because I just spent good money on Mohs and was planning on using it this week. Good luck.

[kevincwelch]

I don't think it is incompatibility with Essence - at least it wasn't in my experience. This is most likely from incorrect application of Mohs with temperature/humidity being a factor I bet. I found that Mohs has been fairly easy to apply across the board, but one has to pay attention to the flashing. All coatings will flash at different times depending upon the temperature and humidity, as well as thickness of the application. With Mohs especially, I'd start in a very small section and directly observe the flashing. A thin application is essential. During my first use -- and towards the end of applying it -- I got careless and did half the hood at once. Instantly regretted it since it flashed and I was unable to soft buff the area. Had to polish the hood and reapply.

Questions:
1. What was the temperature outside?
2. What was the temperature of your paint?
3. What was the humidity?
4. What size sections did you establish? (I now do no more than 2x2 or at most 3x3.)
5. Did you use short nap MF? (It looks like you were buffing when the coating was tacky -- possibly pulling fibers. If you're using Gyeon MF towels, I believe those are designed for wiping polish and doing the "final wipe" before coatings.)
6. Did you have a MF system such that you used one for initial buffing/spreading and another one for final buff?
7. How old was the bottle of Mohs?
8. Were you holding the bottle in your hand or in your pocket while applying and buffing? Heating, even body temp, can be bad.

It's also possible that you just had a bad bottle/batch. But, given my so many uses of Mohs as well as having seen results from many others who have used Mohs, it's more likely to be an application error.

[aquarian]

Thanks so much for your detailed reply. A few days ago I posted in a different thread on my first Moh's problem https://www.autogeekonline.net/forum...s-problem.html

The car has been sitting in the garage for more than 2 weeks so I believe whatever the temp is in the garage, should be the temp of the car. I was only working on the rear bumper area only about 2x3 (the rear black section of an R8 V10)

You may be right, I believe the fibers were getting pulled from static coated surface. The bottle is brand new and I wasn't holding the bottle while I was applying the coating. As I mentioned in a different thread, the temp is relatively low (Oct weather in Seattle) and the humidity not too high.

Cquartz UK in my opinion is a much much user friendly coating to use. I am sure it was more of a user error but I cannot think of a procedure that I did wrong (perhaps using the wrong towel to wipe?). The Gyeon towel has short and long nap and that still created the crazy amount of linting while wiping (with the cloudiness/haziness after wiping).

I know you are trying to find out if the temp of the liquid is too high therefore it started flashing right away and causing difficulty wiping off, but being in the 50's in my garage I can't image working in the middle of summer in Florida with Mohs.....

I don't think it is incompatibility with Essence - at least it wasn't in my experience. This is most likely from incorrect application of Mohs with temperature/humidity being a factor I bet. I found that Mohs has been fairly easy to apply across the board, but one has to pay attention to the flashing. All coatings will flash at different times depending upon the temperature and humidity, as well as thickness of the application. With Mohs especially, I'd start in a very small section and directly observe the flashing. A thin application is essential. During my first use -- and towards the end of applying it -- I got careless and did half the hood at once. Instantly regretted it since it flashed and I was unable to soft buff the area. Had to polish the hood and reapply.

Questions:
1. What was the temperature outside?
2. What was the temperature of your paint?
3. What was the humidity?
4. What size sections did you establish? (I now do no more than 2x2 or at most 3x3.)
5. Did you use short nap MF? (It looks like you were buffing when the coating was tacky -- possibly pulling fibers. If you're using Gyeon MF towels, I believe those are designed for wiping polish and doing the "final wipe" before coatings.)
6. Did you have a MF system such that you used one for initial buffing/spreading and another one for final buff?
7. How old was the bottle of Mohs?
8. Were you holding the bottle in your hand or in your pocket while applying and buffing? Heating, even body temp, can be bad.

It's also possible that you just had a bad bottle/batch. But, given my so many uses of Mohs as well as having seen results from many others who have used Mohs, it's more likely to be an application error.

[kevincwelch]

I can't imagine applying the product in Florida either. Too hot for me. However, I have applied Mohs when it has been very humid and relatively hot ( 90s).

The other thing I forgot to mention was that after applying and doing your buffing, you really need to look at the surface from multiple angles with multiple light sources. I have found high spots and areas that I didn't buff adequately when looking from different angles and even when using a different type of light source, especially sunlight. I think this is one of the things that makes applying Coatings relatively difficult when compared to waxes or sealants. There are just so many opportunities to leave high spots that cannot be corrected.

My suggestion is that you try again. Polish an area of your car that is relatively in conspicuous, and make sure you have fully prepped the surface with some kind of IPA or even better, something like Gtechnic Panel Wipe. Apply a very thin layer (a few dots) on the microfiber applicator, and spread very evenly in a cross hatch pattern over a two by two section. Buff with one short nap microfiber towel and then do a final buff with another short nap microfiber towel. Observe the section from multiple different angles with multiple light sources and quickly buff the highspots. Then let it sit for several hours and check your work.

(Sent via my mobile device...)

[zmcgovern45]

I have not used MOHS personally (yet), but it is always a bit bothersome when someone claims a product is garbage after trying to use it once. No 2 products are the same, so they should not be treated the same. There are so many variables that will effect how a particular product behaves in a given environment that it should be known that you will need to do some trial and error to lock down the application process, especially if you are working in warmer or cooler climates than what is "optimal".

Perhaps the low temperature is the root of the issue... many other coatings tend to be most user friendly around the 70-80F mark without high humidity. Lower temps and higher temps can lead to all sorts of hurdles that the user must adapt and determine how to get over them.

With low temps, the coating is likely not setting up nearly as quickly as it would in the "optimum temp range", for this reason it is not typically recommended to coat a vehicle when temps are say sub-55F (except CQuartz UK was actually designed for cooler temperatures though... hence the "UK" affiliation where they tend to have cooler climates).

I would recommend starting over and doing some proper testing. It seems the recommended wipe off window ranges from 30 seconds to 2 minutes, however in cooler temperatures it would not surprise me if you might be able to push that beyond 2 minutes. A gyeon rep would be able to help you out with that information.

[Cruzscarwash]

Did u let essence cure?? I thought you had to wait at least an HR before you applied any coating over cure?

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[aquarian]

Thanks for your reply. Can you explain the increase in static after the coating is being wiped off? Have you experienced something similar with other coatings?

I agree with you that the temp may be the root of the problem, but it also means that Mohs is definitely not as user friendly compared to CquartzUK. With lower temp the coating should ideally flash slower, therefore making wiping easier. But it wasn't the case with me. Also with Cquartz UK, after wiping the coating off the surface feels noticeably slicker compared to Mohs, which feels like bare paint after coating. Not sure if it has anything to do with being more static.

I have not used MOHS personally (yet), but it is always a bit bothersome when someone claims a product is garbage after trying to use it once. No 2 products are the same, so they should not be treated the same. There are so many variables that will effect how a particular product behaves in a given environment that it should be known that you will need to do some trial and error to lock down the application process, especially if you are working in warmer or cooler climates than what is "optimal".

Perhaps the low temperature is the root of the issue... many other coatings tend to be most user friendly around the 70-80F mark without high humidity. Lower temps and higher temps can lead to all sorts of hurdles that the user must adapt and determine how to get over them.

With low temps, the coating is likely not setting up nearly as quickly as it would in the "optimum temp range", for this reason it is not typically recommended to coat a vehicle when temps are say sub-55F (except CQuartz UK was actually designed for cooler temperatures though... hence the "UK" affiliation where they tend to have cooler climates).

I would recommend starting over and doing some proper testing. It seems the recommended wipe off window ranges from 30 seconds to 2 minutes, however in cooler temperatures it would not surprise me if you might be able to push that beyond 2 minutes. A gyeon rep would be able to help you out with that information.

[aquarian]

Yup, because of my schedule I couldn't apply the coating right after Essence was used to polish the previously failed attempt of Mohs. It was about 3 hours in between.....

Did u let essence cure?? I thought you had to wait at least an HR before you applied any coating over cure?

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