waxing every week does not prevent clear coat failure? dull clearcoat = impending failure?

[pman626]

if a car sitting outside and waxed every week still gets clear coat failure, why even bother waxing at all?

If clear coat gets hazy, but can be buffed back to a shine, is it pretty much too late to save it? point of no return?

I have a 2007 dark gray car, and the roof paint has gotten hazy or dull (in the sense that reflections are not very clear). With a DA polisher, I can restore some shine, but does dull paint mean the paint has already failed?

I was hoping that I could maintain the shine by applying layers of paint sealant.
But it sounds like car paint fails regardless of the effort you put in to maintain it.

[The Guz]

Do you have any photos?

[Scoobertin]

What products did you use?

[TTQ B4U]

if a car sitting outside and waxed every week still gets clear coat failure, why even bother waxing at all?

not sure waxing it every week would be wise let alone helpful.

If clear coat gets hazy, but can be buffed back to a shine, is it pretty much too late to save it? point of no return?

Needs pics before and after but if you're back to a shine then perhaps not. Although again, one would need to see the condition including close ups.

I have a 2007 dark gray car, and the roof paint has gotten hazy or dull (in the sense that reflections are not very clear). With a DA polisher, I can restore some shine, but does dull paint mean the paint has already failed?

Honda?

I was hoping that I could maintain the shine by applying layers of paint sealant.
But it sounds like car paint fails regardless of the effort you put in to maintain it.

The debate on layering continues. I refer back to the original point though, weekly application isn't needed.

[Desertnate]

Depending on the product, I'm wondering if the weekly waxing is causing the hazing. If you are not removing the old wax first, over time it will build up and cause the surface to look cloudy and hazy. Doing it every week will accelerate the process.

Unless you're using a spray wax, I can't imagine even the softest "beauty" waxes wearing away in a week. Most should last at least a month to six weeks.

[FUNX650]

Waxing every week...Way Cool!!

It's always FUN to meet fellow Zen Waxists.
(I sometimes wax multiple times a week.)

*************************************

Impending ClearCoat (CC) failure:

Some CCs that are never cared for
(washed/clayed/sealed with an LSP)
will actually "last" ~3-4 years. (But
at that point they're not something
you'd ever want to write home about.)

On the other hand:
Some CCs are not...uhh...not as tough.


Bob

[Mike Phillips]

if a car sitting outside and waxed every week still gets clear coat failure, why even bother waxing at all?

To answer your question... why even bother waxing it at all?

So your car looks good while you own it and drive it.


To go a little deeper... my opinion, (for what it's worth), is that regular maintenance will help prevent or slow down clearcoat failure. Here's a simple little saying,

"Something is better than nothing"


Maintaining the clearcoat keeps it in good shape so it can last. Not maintaining it lets it degrade and then its certain to fail faster than if it had been cared for. My lifelong complaint about clearcoat paints is the fact that they DO fail and when they do fail you and I cannot fix them.

This is why I like single stage paint. It does NOT fail. It oxidizes but you and I can fix oxidation. Only a body shop and a painter can fix clearcoat failure.

If clear coat gets hazy, but can be buffed back to a shine, is it pretty much too late to save it? point of no return?

I'm going to be very specific with my words...

If a clearcoat gets hazy but can be buffed back to where it's CLEAR again, (that's different than making the surface shiny), AND the clarity remains past a week then from experience the clearcoat is still functional. If after buffing the clearcoat becomes clear again but in a few days to a week it returns to a cloudy, opaque appearance then that's the visual sign of beginning clearcoat failure.

See my article and the picture of beginning clearcoat failure here,


Beginning Clearcoat Failure

I have a 2007 dark gray car, and the roof paint has gotten hazy or dull (in the sense that reflections are not very clear). With a DA polisher, I can restore some shine, but does dull paint mean the paint has already failed?

To vague of a description of what you did? More important than telling us what tool you used would be to tell us what pad and product you used.

But if I go by just what you posted and do something I hate to do and that's "assume" then your description PLUS where you live and all the SUNSHINE you get in Los Angeles on all the horizontal surfaces, it sounds like beginning clearcoat failure.

I was hoping that I could maintain the shine by applying layers of paint sealant.
But it sounds like car paint fails regardless of the effort you put in to maintain it.

The idea of "layering" for MORE protection is a great idea but it simply doesn't work in reality. A better approach is to regularly wash and maintain the paint. I have an article on MOL on layering from around the year 2004 that tackled the topic of layering when it hit a crescendo in the online detailing world.


What's the deal with "Layering?"


And then also covered the topic here in 2010

Sacrificial Barrier Coating = The purpose of a wax or synthetic paint sealant



And here's why you don't want to continually use a non-cleaning wax to try to build up layers of protection on cars that are daily drivers.


Here's why you need to polish paint...



A few of my local friends have figured the paint game out. When they get a car painted the get it painted with single stage paint. Thus no chance of clearcoat failure. When the single stage paint oxidizes... they simply polish it back to perfection. I demonstrate this unique feature about single stage paint all the time in this thread,



The Secret to Removing Oxidation and Restoring a Show Car Finish to Antique Single Stage Paints

[pman626]

Depending on the product, I'm wondering if the weekly waxing is causing the hazing. If you are not removing the old wax first, over time it will build up and cause the surface to look cloudy and hazy. Doing it every week will accelerate the process.

Unless you're using a spray wax, I can't imagine even the softest "beauty" waxes wearing away in a week. Most should last at least a month to six weeks.

Oh, I don't wax my car every week. I do it every month. I'm just wondering whether weekly waxing would even offer any long term protection.

I know for sure any wax does not last more than a month in the LA sun on my smoky granite car.

It's a 2007 lexus smoky granite. The paint is nothing special, probably no better than a regular toyota.

I also claybar'd before applying wax, so the haziness is definitely the paint, not the wax.

I have been using collinite 845 the past few years.

I also used an no name orange compounding pad with meguiars ultimate polish and did some jeweling on a test spot to bring back some shine. Pics below.
I have megs ultimate compound, but I wanted to try the lightest cut first.

single stage vs base/clear

If clear coat is just "clear single stage paint", then is clear coat hazing just like oxidation?


Here are pics of the dullness I was talking about. There isn't any bubbling.

I put a tent over the car so there would be something to reflect off the paint.
This is after claybar.
Compare the reflectivity of the glass and moonroof to the paint...

(right click open image in new tab to see full size)

[Mike Phillips]

Observation...


From the pictures you posted - the paint does look dull and the reflections [to me] don't look as sharp and clear as they could.


What did you use for a compound or polish?
What tool did you use?
What pad did you use?
What speed for the tool?

Details about the process?


Without knowing what you used and did, to me it looks like a person could simply get a little more aggressive with the buffing and this would smooth the surface over and thus increase the clarity of the paint.

[Mike Phillips]

How about the sides of the vehicle?

How does the paint look on the sides?

Did you polish the sides the same way you polished the horizontal surfaces?


Horizontal surfaces take a beating from the sun and also the weather and all elements and airborne contamination. Living in California is kind of like living in South Florida - that is you live where Mother Nature naturally takes a toll on ALL things, not just your car.