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Thread: How to fix new paint job with sanding and buffing?

  1. #1
    Director of Training Mike Phillips's Avatar
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    How to fix new paint job with sanding and buffing?

    How to fix new paint job with sanding and buffing?




    Anytime I get questions via e-mail, a PM or a FB message I prefer to invest my typing time where

    A: It's easier for me to share links, pictures and videos.

    B: More people can read and thus benefit from the information. (no just one set of eyeballs


    So I get an e-mail asking,




    Hi Mike, greetings from Puerto Rico! I tried posting in the forum but I'm not authorized yet and need answers quickly. I repainted the hood on my Volvo and have issues after the clearcoat was applied. I've read many of the posts on clearcoating but they seem to address just orange peel and dust, etc. the paint (clearcoat) is now 24 hours old and I will wait for 3 days to begin any work. So here is my problem. I used the BC/CC route and the basecoat went on and dried perfectly. I waited approx 2 hours before applying the first Clearcoat and completed three layers of clear, waitng 10 minutes between coats. The result almost gave me a heart attack when I went to the garage this morning. The clearcoat is dry to the touch but it dried with patchy areas of the dried paint and minor orange peel. As you can see from the attached photos some areas look shinny and normal whle others appear to not have enough clearcoat applied whch is puzzling. I can confirm that I applied the last two coats with complete coverage and very wet. So not sure why it dried with this splotchy, patchy finish. I used rattle cans which worked great for the base but the clear appears to be a mess. The paint is metallic. It is my hope that cutting and buffing would solve ths problem. I plan to sand starting at 1000 up to 2000 and will be doing this by hand. My questions to you are:

    1) which products should I use during the process for cutting and buffing? I plan to use your products.
    2) from your experience is that a "normal" drying problem that can be fixed by cuttng and buffing?

    Thanks for your help!

    Glenn




    So first, it's really hard for the human eyes to track from the end of once sentence to the beginning of the next sentence when a person types in one HUGE chunk of text. I don't even try. INstgead, what I do on the forum and in e-mail is I break up their huge chunks of text into smaller paragraphs and/or sentences so I can read it and others can read it too. (I do this for our forum members to because so often people type out ALL their info in one huge chunk of text)

    And just to note.... if you type in huge chunks, most people WON'T read it but instead, will simply click away...


    So here's Glen's info broken up.




    Hi Mike,

    greetings from Puerto Rico!

    I tried posting in the forum but I'm not authorized yet and need answers quickly.

    I repainted the hood on my Volvo and have issues after the clearcoat was applied. I've read many of the posts on clearcoating but they seem to address just orange peel and dust, etc. the paint (clearcoat) is now 24 hours old and I will wait for 3 days to begin any work.

    So here is my problem. I used the BC/CC route and the basecoat went on and dried perfectly. I waited approx 2 hours before applying the first Clearcoat and completed three layers of clear, waitng 10 minutes between coats. The result almost gave me a heart attack when I went to the garage this morning. The clearcoat is dry to the touch but it dried with patchy areas of the dried paint and minor orange peel. As you can see from the attached photos some areas look shinny and normal whle others appear to not have enough clearcoat applied whch is puzzling.

    I can confirm that I applied the last two coats with complete coverage and very wet. So not sure why it dried with this splotchy, patchy finish.

    I used rattle cans which worked great for the base but the clear appears to be a mess.

    The paint is metallic.


    It is my hope that cutting and buffing would solve ths problem. I plan to sand starting at 1000 up to 2000 and will be doing this by hand. My questions to you are:


    1) which products should I use during the process for cutting and buffing? I plan to use your products.

    2) from your experience is that a "normal" drying problem that can be fixed by cuttng and buffing?

    Thanks for your help!

    Glenn





    I received this e-mail over the weekend and I always check the forum for new members that have not confirmed their own account. (you do this by clicking on a link in an e-mail you get from the forum software. If you don't do it, I check and push your through the process so you can start posting)

    I checked for and approves all new accounts that had not been confirmed on Saturday and on Sunday and again this morning, (Monday morning, June 19th, 2017).

    So I'm not sure why he cannot post to the forum because there are no new accounts that are not confirmed and approved. I also checked our forum database for an account using the e-mail Glen sent me and there are NO accounts with this e-mail. So I don't know if he joined using a different e-mail than the one he contacted me with or if he's referring to our forum but trying to join and post to our Autogeek Detailing 101 Facebook page? IF he's trying to join the Facebook page and also e-mailing me, I will still answer him on the forum and the interface on Facebook is horrible for anything substantial and I don't noramally do non-substantial work.


    Back to his paint problems and his questions...


    Glen,

    First of all I'm not a painter and I'm certainly not an expert at troubleshooting problems with rattle can paint jobs. I would contact the manufacturer of the paint (in a rattle can), that you bought and describe what you're seeing and they will probably have more insight as to what happened and how to avoid the problem in the future.


    As for your sanding and buffing questions...


    [quote=Glen}

    I plan to sand starting at 1000 up to 2000 and will be doing this by hand.

    My questions to you are:


    1) which products should I use during the process for cutting and buffing? I plan to use your products.

    [/quote]


    First - I don't know if I would start sanding with #1000 grit on a rattle can paint job. #1000 grit is very aggressive and you risk removing too much paint and exposing the basecoat.

    Remember....

    1. Sanding removes paint
    2. Compounding removes paint
    3. Polishing removes a little paint



    Sooner or later you're going to sand or buff through to the basecoat.



    Second - We carry a number of really great brands for compounds and polishes. When I get asked this type of product recommendation I usually keep a person with the brand they already use and are comfortable with. IF you don't have a brand of compound and polish then here are some brands that use great abrasive technology.

    Meguiar's M100, M101 and M205

    SONAX CutMax, Perfect Finish and EX 04-06

    Jescar Compound and Polish

    Wolfgang Uber Compound and Finishing Glaze

    Menzerna FG400 and SF4000

    Optimum Polymer Technologies compound and polish

    Pinnacle Advanced Compound and Advanced Finishing Polish

    GYEON Compound and polish

    McKee's Fast Compound and Fast Polish

    There are more but any of the above will work with rotary buffers and orbital polishers and are good.




    [quote=Glen}


    2) from your experience is that a "normal" drying problem that can be fixed by cutting and buffing?

    Thanks for your help!

    Glenn

    [/quote]


    I don't paint cars with either conventicle spray guns or rattle cans. That said, the problem you describe does not sound normal. My guess is you sprayed the clear layers too soon and while hey appeared to be dry in-between applications there were solvents and/or other carrying agents that were not fully cured, hardened, evaporated, outgassed etc., and the trapping of these substances reacted with the basecoat and/or subsequent layers of clear paint and the results are what you see.

    As for being able to fix the paint via the sanding and buffing process?

    You won't know until you try. If you have enough material laid down then it's possible you can sand and buff till the surface is flat and then restore the gloss and clarity.


    If it were me, I would test by sanding lightly with #2000 and then compound and polishing and see if you can make a small section look good. If you can make a small section look good then you can probably duplicate this process and make the entire paint job look good.




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  2. #2
    Director of Training Mike Phillips's Avatar
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    Re: How to fix new paint job with sanding and buffing?

    Continued....



    Here are the pictures you sent me... the originals were 4032 x 3024 pixels wide and will never properly display on a forum so I took the time and the liberty to resize your pictures to 800 pixels wide and upload them to our free gallery here on AGO.


    The surface looks textured, as in there was a chemical reaction between the layers of paint and when this chemical reaction took place the multiple layers of paint dissolved into one another.








    The below is a section cropped out of the above picture and you can clearly see smooth areas surrounded by mottled areas. My guess is there was a chemical reaction due to the prevousl applications of paint not fully dried before subsequent applications of paint were sprayed.





    I'll stick to what I already wrote about doing some testing. At this point you don't have a lot of options anyways...


    Please keep us posted as to your results and/or success.



    Mike Phillips
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  3. #3
    Director of Training Mike Phillips's Avatar
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    Re: How to fix new paint job with sanding and buffing?

    Continued....


    Here's the TinyUrl link I just sent Glen

    http://tinyurl.com/yc6l3hr9



    For the reasons I outlined in post #8 of this thread,

    https://www.autogeekonline.net/forum...ml#post1502512



    And if this helps... here's the link to join the AGO forum


    Click here to join the AGO forum



    Mike Phillips
    Host - Competition Ready on Velocity Channel
    Director of Training Autogeek & Marine 31
    IDA Board Member
    CD-SV, RT
    Competition Ready Facebook Page
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    Click on a book to get your own copy.



  4. #4
    Director of Training Mike Phillips's Avatar
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    Re: How to fix new paint job with sanding and buffing?

    Heard back from Glen via e-mail....





    Just read the deatils of your response at the link provided.

    I am very very impressed by your knowledge and Professionalism.

    Thank you for the editorial comments which I will adhere to for future postings. I believe you are correct in your asessment and I will follow tour advice at each stage in this repair.

    Will post before and after photos ASAP.

    Thanks again!




    Looking forward to the before and after pictures. Just to note, in order to post them you must be a member of the forum.



    Good luck with your project...


    Mike Phillips
    Host - Competition Ready on Velocity Channel
    Director of Training Autogeek & Marine 31
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