Advice for metallic black paint - Dealership Installed Swirls

[brondondolon]

Advice for metallic black paint - Dealership Installed Swirls

Hows it goin? Im a new forum member and looking for some pointers.

Recently my 09 ram was serviced at a local dealership and when i got it back it seriously looked like it was washed with steel wool.

I went round and round with them and the only way to get them to fix it was to sue them...

So being as i take a ton of pride in my truck, washing it every week and waxing it every other week, and i know my way around a buffer i decided to tackle the job my self. However the results of 13 hours of work didnt meet my expectations.

At first the truck looked amazing but then once i washed it again all those scratches the dealer left in my paint were still there. Maybe i used the wrong products or didnt spend enough time idk.



Here are the steps i took and products i used:

wash (cheap autozone wash)
Clay bar (mothers clay bar)
rubbing compound with med foam pad on a circular buffer (meguires ultimate compound)
2 passes of swirl removed fine foam pad ( meguires #9 swirl remover 2.0)
glaze on a little orbital buffer with micro fiber pad (meguiars #7 show car glaze)
2 passes wax with little orbital buffer with micro fiber pad (meguiars black wax)

are there some steps i could take to shorten this process and a product recommendation for removing these clear coat scratches. its black paint so i cant be too aggressive with it because i dont want to leave ugly swirls

Thanks guys

[swanicyouth]

I would recommend Wolfgang or Optimum polishes. But, it's really in the technique. What machines do you have?

[spiralout462]

Welcome to AGO!

http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/...llips+articles
http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/...llips+articles

[brondondolon]

the buffer is a cheap harbor freight one with a 8" pad that only moves in a circular motion. it has variable speeds but i used the second lowest which id guess would be around 1200 rpm maybe less. Id love to get a new one but they are way over my budget.

[Griever]

I would use "ultimate polish" or "M205" after the "Ultimate Compound" on a Polish Pad. The UP would sub out #7 unless you wanted to hit it with that anyway just for fun. Maybe these guys can shed some light, but isnt "swirl remover" slightly less aggressive than "Ultimate Compound"? I never liked "swirl remover" on my black car. It just never did what I wanted it to do, especially when working by hand. However, M205 worked great, even by hand. I am picky about my car, one time when I lived at an apartment, the neighbor was air glazing a bath tub. Overspray shot out the window and rained down on my Tib. My car looked like the starry night sky from bumper to bumper.

Took it to a few detailers in my area, all said there was no way to get those small specks off. Well, one month later, 5 bottles of megs quick detailer and some really worn out fingernails later, I had it back to normal. No clay bars, clay towels, compounds, pads or any combo there of could get that crap off my car. Wet sanding worked, but I was like, "eff that dude". Common sense says, "dont sand a black hyundai" hahaha.

[jankerson]

Hows it goin? Im a new forum member and looking for some pointers. Recently my 09 ram was serviced at a local dealership and when i got it back it seriously looked like it was washed with steel wool. I went round and round with them and the only way to get them to fix it was to sue them... So being as i take a ton of pride in my truck, washing it every week and waxing it every other week, and i know my way around a buffer i decided to tackle the job my self. However the results of 13 hours of work didnt meet my expectations. At first the truck looked amazing but then once i washed it again all those scratches the dealer left in my paint were still there. Maybe i used the wrong products or didnt spend enough time idk.



Here are the steps i took and products i used:

wash (cheap autozone wash)
Clay bar (mothers clay bar)
rubbing compound with med foam pad on a circular buffer (meguires ultimate compound)
2 passes of swirl removed fine foam pad ( meguires #9 swirl remover 2.0)
glaze on a little orbital buffer with micro fiber pad (meguiars #7 show car glaze)
2 passes wax with little orbital buffer with micro fiber pad (meguiars black wax)

are there some steps i could take to shorten this process and a product recommendation for removing these clear coat scratches. its black paint so i cant be too aggressive with it because i dont want to leave ugly swirls

Thanks guys

I am guessing that you have a rotary from your posts....

If so you will need a more aggressive pad and compound of you want to remove those scratches..

The products that you have been using aren't aggressive enough and have fillers in them...

If it's a rotary then I would recommend Megs Burgundy pad using M105 to remove the scratches then follow up with M205 with Megs Yellow pad. However the Wool pad with M105 you be even faster then follow up with M205 and the Yellow pad.

[md.aznan]

Hows it goin? Im a new forum member and looking for some pointers. Recently my 09 ram was serviced at a local dealership and when i got it back it seriously looked like it was washed with steel wool. I went round and round with them and the only way to get them to fix it was to sue them... So being as i take a ton of pride in my truck, washing it every week and waxing it every other week, and i know my way around a buffer i decided to tackle the job my self. However the results of 13 hours of work didnt meet my expectations. At first the truck looked amazing but then once i washed it again all those scratches the dealer left in my paint were still there. Maybe i used the wrong products or didnt spend enough time idk.



Here are the steps i took and products i used:

wash (cheap autozone wash)
Clay bar (mothers clay bar)
rubbing compound with med foam pad on a circular buffer (meguires ultimate compound)
2 passes of swirl removed fine foam pad ( meguires #9 swirl remover 2.0)
glaze on a little orbital buffer with micro fiber pad (meguiars #7 show car glaze)
2 passes wax with little orbital buffer with micro fiber pad (meguiars black wax)

are there some steps i could take to shorten this process and a product recommendation for removing these clear coat scratches. its black paint so i cant be too aggressive with it because i dont want to leave ugly swirls

Thanks guys

I've had similar problem with my old beemer. The UC plus with the correct foam pad, high speed DA and some pressure, that should remove if not all, most of the swirls. Hope this helps 😁

[Mike Phillips]

First, I'm really glad you found our forum and came here for help.


Can I ask you how you found AutogeekOnline.net?

At first the truck looked amazing but then once i washed it again all those scratches the dealer left in my paint were still there.

This means one thing for sure, possibly two...

1. You didn't remove them during the correction step.

2. They're really deep.


If the swirls are really deep this is a crime against you and your truck.

Scratches are missing paint because the person doing the work used too aggressive and too caveman of products, pads and tools.

To remove the scratches you have to remove MORE paint.



Now follow me on this...


Factory clearcoat paints are thin. Typically thinner than a 3M Post-it Note.







So when a Dealership, a Bodyshop or a Detailer puts swirls into your car's paint either by how they wash it, wipe it or buff-it out they are NEEDLESSLY removing perfectly good paint because scratches are areas of paint that has been removed.



Now follow me even closer...

In order to remove the scratches you must level the paint until the top surface of the paint is level with the lowest depths of the deepest scratches.

Now you're removing MORE paint to fix a problem someone else caused to your car's already thin paint.

Paint is thin. All the factory UV protection is in the clear layer of paint. The more clear that is removed the less factory UV protection that is left to stabilize and protect the entire matrix of paint, (clear/base/primer/ecoat).

See page 2 of this article,

Beginning Clearcoat Failure



For the last 10 years I've described what's happened to you and your Ram Truck as a "Horror Story" but actually it's a crime because it's destruction of personal property.

Go around to several high end and custom body shops and get an estimate for a "good" paint job. For a truck like yours I'll guess $3000.00 will be on the LOW end.

I know you're a new member here so you probably haven't read my article on how to avoid this problem in the first place so I'll post it below for you and for everyone that will read this thread into the future.

Back to your dillema...

Here are the steps i took and products i used:

rubbing compound with med foam pad on a circular buffer (meguires ultimate compound)

From you're description it sounds like you used,

• Meguiar's Ultimate Compound
• A rotary buffer
• A foam "polishing" pad

As others have stated, you will need to get a more aggressive pad to remove more paint in order to level the top surface with the lowest depths of the scratches inflicted by the dealership.

Meguiar's Ultimate Compound is a very good compound, it's a cousin of M105 which when it was introduced raised the bar for abrasive technology. So the problem isn't the compound it's the likely you just need a more aggressive pad to work in conjunction with the compound to remove enough paint.


I always recommend doing a Test Spot to one area of a car to BE SURE you're getting the results you want, hope for and dream about before buffing out the rest of the car.

An option for situations like yours would be to chemically strip the Test Spot and then inspect in bright light to be 100% sure you've removed the swirls and scratches left by the dealership.

There's a bunch of ways/products listed in this article on how to chemically strip to inspect for accurate diagnosis.

How to Mix IPA for Inspecting Correction Results



You will still have swirls in the paint left by your rotary buffer/pad/compound but these should be uniform and not look like the swirls and scratches in a panel that you have not buffed. This is of course when doing a Test Spot to a vehicle that has not been 100% buffed out.

Since you've already buffed out 100% of this truck it's possible what you're seeing is,

1. The swirls and scratches caused by the dealership that you have not 100% removed.

2. The holograms you left in the paint from the use of the rotary buffer and the pads and products you're using.


Without being there or having really good pictures it's kind of hard to diagnose.

You could start a thread asking for the help of one of our stellar forum members that lives in your town to take a look at your truck's finish and help you troubleshoot the problem. To do this you need to,

A: Start a new thread.
B: Write a title that states what you need and where



The other thing you could do is to get a dual action polisher like a Porter Cable 7424XP/Meguiar's G110v2 or a Griot's DA Polisher and do what I call...

Change the action of the tool


That is go from a tool that only offers a single, one-direction rotating action to a tool that offers both rotating and oscillating actions.

Doing a Test Spot with a dual action polisher would not only help you to trouble shoot the problem but very likely fix the problem while removing the least amount of clearcoat paint and avoiding instilling any future holograms.


I'd recommend showing the dealership this thread and forcing them to pay for a professional detail to undo the damage they caused.


For reference...

How To Do a Test Spot


Please... anyone reading this into the future, before buffing out an entire car, especially if you're new to machine buffing or you're unsure of what you're doing or getting into, please start by doing a Test Spot and if you run into trouble, join our forum and start a thread describing the issues and we will help you.


Click here to join the largest and best online detailing discussion forum on the Internet... the friendliest too!

[jankerson]

With what Mike said.

[Griever]

Wow, I am glad I found AG, this forum is fantastic. Great post Mike.