Crystal Serum Light/EXO not suitable for outdoor use?

[DouginDenver]

Crazy thread title, I know. I have lived in the same house for 30 years and parked my cars the same way for just as long, including this car for two years before I coated it with CSL and EXO in the spring. Due to a tiny garage at a 100+ year old house, one car is outside and parked in way that one side gets hit lightly with water from the sprinkler system. It's always been that way. I have never once had an issue with hard water spotting. Never even crossed my mind. Since the ceramic coat was applied it is ridiculous. I'm not talking about spots only a detailer would notice. Passing dogs probably notice. It seems I have no choice but to polish it and go back to wax. Is this a known issue with ceramic coats - that they make spotting worse? I'm guessing it's because the extra beading concentrates the minerals?

[Bruno Soares]

Yes, every coating will be that way. The crazy amount of beads they create is recipe for water spotting, especially from sprinklers.

[The Guz]

Sprinklers are going to be a problem on most forms of protection. But yes coatings have a higher potential to spot.

[DouginDenver]

Thanks. I guess I wish I had known that in advance, but I probably would have tried it anyway. Oh well, it's pretty intolerable as is so I guess it's coming off.

[Mike Phillips]

My only comment on this water beading turning to water spotting "issue" caused by super hydrophobic coatings is that I think whether or not the PAINT actually gets a spot or a etching or an imprint ring comes down to two things,

1: The coating - more specifically - what it is or what it is made out of. (Just a guess as not all coatings are the same)

2: What's in the water.



For number #1 above - without doing testing of multiple coatings exposed to the same water source, in this example a sprinkler spraying water from a known source onto car paint, there's no way to know which coatings actually stop or prevent "what's in the water" from etching through the coating and then damaging the paint.


For number #2 above, well this issue comes up so often - I finally wrote an article about it. I don't share this article as much as articles like Clearcoats are thin - but I do find myself sharing it a lot.


Here's the link to this article,

What's in the water?



Besides that - the world LOVES water beading so everyone makes products that bead water. As you have found out - water beading CAN - doesn't mean ALWAYS - but CAN lead to water spotting.

I have not had any problems with water spotting on my two coated cars but this may only mean there's nothing in the water that lands on the paint and then dries. For the most part it's always rain water, never sprinkler water.

BLACKFIRE BLACK Edition is supposed to both bead water and also make water sheet off the car but I have not used this on any of my personal cars so I have not been able to observe this over time.

[DouginDenver]

Rain water is not the problem. The half of my car that faces away from the sprinklers is still perfect. But I agree it must be something about the coating itself because if my water is hard enough to cause spots this bad then I would surely have had some spots on just waxed or even unwaxed paint in the prior 30 years. But nothing. On my hood and trunk, where much larger, elongated "beads" can form, it looks like I have wiped off a 100 bird droppings that etched the paint.

[Mike Phillips]

Rain water is not the problem. The half of my car that faces away from the sprinklers is still perfect.

But I agree it must be something about the coating itself because if my water is hard enough to cause spots this bad then I would surely have had some spots on just waxed or even unwaxed paint in the prior 30 years. But nothing.

Un-waxed paint - the water lays flat - no concentrated water beading - no water spotting.


My guess is you'll see this same issue with most coatings that create a hydrophobic surface. Still have to wonder,


What's in the sprinkler water?

[DouginDenver]

Un-waxed paint - the water lays flat - no concentrated water beading - no water spotting.


My guess is you'll see this same issue with most coatings that create a hydrophobic surface. Still have to wonder,


What's in the sprinkler water?

I think the water here in Denver is a bit hard, but if by "coatings that create a hydrophobic surface" you are also including wax, I don't think so. The water has not changed in the last 6 months, and I have had no spotting issues in 30 years. But if you mean other brands of ceramic coats, I agree. No way I will waste my time and money trying another. Lesson learned.

[Mike Phillips]

I think the water here in Denver is a bit hard,

And in simple terms, when people say

Hard water

What they mean is the water has dissolved minerals and other elements in it. The water itself is not "hard".

but if by "coatings that create a hydrophobic surface" you are also including wax, I don't think so.

One thing about me is I pick and choose each and every word I type specifically and with purpose. So "nope" I never mean wax when I say coatings. Heck I wrote the below article in 2011, before most people even knew what coatings were/are.

3-Categories: Waxes, Paint Sealants and Coatings

The water has not changed in the last 6 months, and I have had no spotting issues in 30 years. But if you mean other brands of ceramic coats, I agree. No way I will waste my time and money trying another. Lesson learned.

Copy that.

I'll stick to the detailed answer I shared in my first post.


Maybe go back to what you were using and had good luck with? You know, the old,

If it aint' broke, don't fix it


Or like my wife says about me,

If it aint' broke - fix it until it is

[Desertnate]

I've experienced some pretty miserable water spotting from sprinklers regardless of what LSP is on the car.

The difference in the damage and easy of removal is how long the spots are on the car. If I catch it the same day, often a QD or waterless wash will get it off. Any time after than, I might have to polish them out. I purposely position my cars to keep spray from the sprinklers to a minimum.