Paint correction on BMW 535i Alpine White with XMT swirl remover

[b16drag]

Been lurking on this forum for a while and have learned quite bit so thank you to everyone! In any case, I am having some trouble with the BMW Alpine White paint.

Car is a 2014 BMW 535i Alpine White which has light swirls throughout and some waterspots. I pressure washed it and then handwashed it with Meguiar's Gold Class. It was then decontaminated with Iron X, and clayed with Mother's and Meguiar's Clay.

I'm using GG6 DA with 6" backing plate, Lake Country CCS pads, and the Pinnacle XMT swirl remover system. I started off on a test spot with the LC Orange cutting pad, XMT #2, and setting of 5 on the GG6 DA. I used medium pressure and yes I made sure the backing plate was spinning. After the first round, it looked like it didn't even touch the scratches or swirls, except added finer swirls. I then changed to the XMT #4, and the results were even worse but I figured it was going to improve as I go back down to the finer XMT polishing solutions. I went over it with XMT #2 and an green polishing pad with setting of 4, and swirls did improve but still not good enough yet. I then changed to XMT #1 and a black pad with setting of 3, but there are still very fine swirls (see image).

I tried switching to red pad with Meguiar's Ultimate Poish. It was slightly better but still not perfect.

I've used the XMT swirl remover and LC CCS pads on a few cars in the past, and found them to be excellent.

So my questions are: Am I just screwing up on this BMW alpine White? Are there better polishing compound I should be looking at such as menzerna or Meguiar's 105/205? Is worth changing to the 5" backing plate and appropriate sized pads?

Any help would be appreciated! I'm pretty much at my wits at this point.:buffing:

[David Hayward]

I've had great luck on BMW finishes using Wolfgang uber compound paired with lake country orange foam pads. You can probably stick with the xmt products you have but I have no experience with those to offer advice.

Most important things for getting more correction with your gg6, as you already mentioned, pad rotation. Keep an eye on that and make sure the machine isn't bogging down.

Thinner pads will also help this machine correct a little more and just run better. Lake country, meguiars, and griots all have thin pads available.
http://www.autogeek.net/lake-country-thinpro-5-inch.html

After that also going to the smaller pad size will help. The smaller contact area will increase the machines ability to cut.

[David Hayward]

I do see on the xmt swirl remover product page a recommendation to try the #4 with a white pad and only orange in an extreme case.

[David Hayward]

One last thing I dug this up on YouTube going through correction with the xmt line.

http://youtu.be/C3ewVplzVww

[mwoolfso]

I have XMT 1-3 and in general their product line would need a stronger pad to make a difference on hard paint systems. You will need a stronger product line or more aggressive pads. Wolfgang is a good alternative to XMT.

[tenblade2001]

I have an Alpine White BMW and had a good experience with OPT hyperpolish with LC hybrid pads (Cyan where more correction needed and tangerine where less was needed). I used a 7424XP with SMACK technique.

While its difficult to see the defects, the clarity improved significantly (so it follows that the defects were corrected)
http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/picture.php?albumid=901&pictureid=5019

After

http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/picture.php?albumid=901&pictureid=5020

Here's my thread with the process
http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/show-n-shine/97005-2012-e92-alpine-white-m3-optimum-hyperpolish-pns-bsd.html

Here's Mike's thread on the SMACK technique
http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/auto-detailing-101/77155-my-technique-concerning-3401-menzerna-products-hybrid-pads.html

[irvsmith]

I would definitely try the 5" backing plate and maybe an all in one - HD SPEED has been doing great for me.


Been lurking on this forum for a while and have learned quite bit so thank you to everyone! In any case, I am having some trouble with the BMW Alpine White paint.

Car is a 2014 BMW 535i Alpine White which has light swirls throughout and some waterspots. I pressure washed it and then handwashed it with Meguiar's Gold Class. It was then decontaminated with Iron X, and clayed with Mother's and Meguiar's Clay.

I'm using GG6 DA with 6" backing plate, Lake Country CCS pads, and the Pinnacle XMT swirl remover system. I started off on a test spot with the LC Orange cutting pad, XMT #2, and setting of 5 on the GG6 DA. I used medium pressure and yes I made sure the backing plate was spinning. After the first round, it looked like it didn't even touch the scratches or swirls, except added finer swirls. I then changed to the XMT #4, and the results were even worse but I figured it was going to improve as I go back down to the finer XMT polishing solutions. I went over it with XMT #2 and an green polishing pad with setting of 4, and swirls did improve but still not good enough yet. I then changed to XMT #1 and a black pad with setting of 3, but there are still very fine swirls (see image).

I tried switching to red pad with Meguiar's Ultimate Poish. It was slightly better but still not perfect.

I've used the XMT swirl remover and LC CCS pads on a few cars in the past, and found them to be excellent.

So my questions are: Am I just screwing up on this BMW alpine White? Are there better polishing compound I should be looking at such as menzerna or Meguiar's 105/205? Is worth changing to the 5" backing plate and appropriate sized pads?

Any help would be appreciated! I'm pretty much at my wits at this point.:buffing:

[zmcgovern45]

In my experiences with Alpine White, it has always been quite easy to work with.

In this video, I do a quick spot on the trunk using a 5.5" LC Orange Light Cutting pad with Menzerna PF2500. You can see the paint was NOT in good condition, yet the medium polish and pad were able to remove almost all of the defects while finishing to a nice, high gloss.

Paint Correction BMW 335i - Rupes LHR21ES - Menzerna PF2500 - YouTube


Things to keep in mind are pad size does effect cut, so you may want to use a smaller pad (5.5" vs. 6.5"). Unless the vehicle you're working on is considerably different than the alpine white vehicles I have worked on, any medium - fine polish should yield great results with an orange pad. You may try Optimum Hyper Polish, Griot's Correcting Creme, M205, PF2500, etc.

Hope that helps.

[tenblade2001]

@Zmgovern45
great video! thanks for the heads up on PF2500. Question...does it dust much?

[zmcgovern45]

@Zmgovern45
great video! thanks for the heads up on PF2500. Question...does it dust much?

No, it is quite oily (as are all menzerna products) and tends to work forever with little to no dusting... I haven't ever purchased any more of it after I ran out of my small bottle as it wasn't anything revolutionary to me. I tend to lean towards Optimum Hyper Polish or HD Adapt when I need something with more cut than a fine polish, but better finish than a heavy compound.

[b16drag]

I have an Alpine White BMW and had a good experience with OPT hyperpolish with LC hybrid pads (Cyan where more correction needed and tangerine where less was needed). I used a 7424XP with SMACK technique.

While its difficult to see the defects, the clarity improved significantly (so it follows that the defects were corrected)
http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/picture.php?albumid=901&pictureid=5019

After

http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/picture.php?albumid=901&pictureid=5020

Here's my thread with the process
http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/show-n-shine/97005-2012-e92-alpine-white-m3-optimum-hyperpolish-pns-bsd.html

Here's Mike's thread on the SMACK technique
http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/auto-detailing-101/77155-my-technique-concerning-3401-menzerna-products-hybrid-pads.html

Thanks for referencing the SMACK technique. That does bring a good point and I'll have to try that later today to see if it helps.


I do see on the xmt swirl remover product page a recommendation to try the #4 with a white pad and only orange in an extreme case.

Tired the XMT #4 with a brand new orange cutting pad and good lord that didn't help much at all! :(


I have XMT 1-3 and in general their product line would need a stronger pad to make a difference on hard paint systems. You will need a stronger product line or more aggressive pads. Wolfgang is a good alternative to XMT.

Will have to try out the wolfgang among some of the ones mentioned such as the HD SPEED.


I would definitely try the 5" backing plate and maybe an all in one - HD SPEED has been doing great for me.

Thanks!


In my experiences with Alpine White, it has always been quite easy to work with.

In this video, I do a quick spot on the trunk using a 5.5" LC Orange Light Cutting pad with Menzerna PF2500. You can see the paint was NOT in good condition, yet the medium polish and pad were able to remove almost all of the defects while finishing to a nice, high gloss.
Paint Correction BMW 335i - Rupes LHR21ES - Menzerna PF2500 - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mzWOFJH2ZEA)

Nice video! Thanks!

Things to keep in mind are pad size does effect cut, so you may want to use a smaller pad (5.5" vs. 6.5"). Unless the vehicle you're working on is considerably different than the alpine white vehicles I have worked on, any medium - fine polish should yield great results with an orange pad. You may try Optimum Hyper Polish, Griot's Correcting Creme, M205, PF2500, etc.

Hope that helps.

Looks like I'll be ordering a new backing plate with new pads... :(


Well thanks for the help guys. Just trying to wrap my head around this because it didn't make sense to me!

[b16drag]

Finally had the opportunity to try using the LC black pad with XMT #1 and the SMACK technique. I found it to be significantly better to the naked eye with regards to ultra fine swirls. However, it is still not as clear and perfect as what I have come to expect regarding stage before LSP.

Currently awaiting my new order with low profile 5.5" pads, 5" backing plate, and Wolfgang products and the OPT Hyperpolish... Let's see what will happen.

Again thanks for all the advice!

[lawrenceSA]

I may be way off the mark here but I seem to recall there being 3 versions of Alpine White.

Literally

Apline White I, II and III.

And I seem to recall I and II being single stage and III being clear coated.

Maybe you are just struggling with really hard paint - single stage white is particularly hard.

It may be worth locating the paint code / description on the car and checking into it:dunno:

[b16drag]

Thanks for bringing that up but I think this one is alpine white 3.

Been looking around and researching and I think it's the ceramiclear coat that's screwing with me. Maybe the XMT isn't finishing as clean as I would prefer. Waiting on Wolfgang and the OPT Hyperpolish to arrive... Fingers cross!

[b16drag]

So got my shipment from autogeek today, and wanted follow up on this post.

Changed out the backing plate for a 5" LC backing plate. I tested the same spots using a LC white thin pad with the Wolfgang Finishing Glaze... BAM! :dblthumb2:

Got the result I was hoping for -- see pic below. I think my original issue was likely due to using XMT on the BMW ceramicoat. The Wolfgang doesn't wipe off as easily but heck, the results are totally worth it!

I did try the Optimum Hyperpolish with the white pad. It also works well and was much easier to wipe off. However, I just felt that the Wolfgang was slightly better when it comes to polishing those very light swirls... But this could be dependent on user (it was my first time and honestly didn't spend too much time with it).

Thanks for all of the help guys! Im the MAN