Is this paint recoverable? Is my clearcoat gone?

[dochawk]

All of the roads on paint at the cadillacforums seem to lead here . . .

I just picked up a 2001 deVille, and the paint color is apparently "crimson pearl" (I don't see a different between it and ford's "medium red", but I guess you get fancier words at cadillac prices :) )

Anyway, the paint is untracked and indented, and looks good on the sides, but the roof is a bit rough. I had thought it was just oxidation, but it's been suggested to me that the clear coat has been gorillaed off (just what is the past tense of "to gorilla"? :) )

I have attached views from the edge at the windshield and a side door. Light is playing games here; they were taken at the same time, and the apparent color is similar.

Where do I start? What do I use to start? Should I be joining the Meguires 7 cult? :)

As I understand it at the moment, I have drastically different paths depending upon whether or not my clearcoat is ruined.

And how do I figure this out on the sides?

This car has probably spent its life in the desert (came into Vegas from Utah), and will spend the rest of its life in the desert. it does have a massive Chilean Mesquite to shade it (birds do not not seem to like this variety; I think the spot came while driving), but will have little chance at a garage (the convertibles get first crack, and besides, a '72 Eldorado doesn't leave much room . . .)

thanks

hawk

[Mike Phillips]

Hi and welcome to AutogeekOnline! :welcome:


The term you're looking for is,

Clearcoat Failure


And from the picture it doesn't look as though the paint has reached the tipping point but it's close..

Here's my article on this topic.

Beginning Clearcoat Failure (http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/hot-topics-frequently-asked-questions/29197-beginning-clearcoat-failure.html)


Normally the use of #7 on clearcoat paints doesn't work like it does on single stage paints but when you have paint that is this far gone from neglect and exposure then you have nothing to lose.

I'd do the normal steps,


Wash
Clay
Polish (Might be too dangerous to use a compound)

Then do a thorough rub down using the #7 and then seal with a wax or synthetic paint sealant.

The key after all of the above will be to regularly polish and wax the horizontal surfaces.

Good luck...


:)

[AGOatemywallet]

Please take some additional photos out in the Sun.

Please rub a small area of the section in question with a light colored MF towel and a bit of polish.

If red comes off on the towel, the base color paint is no longer protected by clear coat.

[dochawk]

I've loaded a whole bunch of images, and a the start of a written page, at dochawk.org--archives--090222 (http://dochawk.org/deville/). Now if I can remember how to make the smaller images and specify the sizes of the images, I may have a page. But it lets me put links here, I think . . .

Here are some images in brighter sun:
http://dochawk.org/deville/150907/IMG_3365.jpg

http://dochawk.org/deville/150907/IMG_3366.jpg

Not sure what that line is; I think it's an artifact of the light:
http://dochawk.org/deville/150907/IMG_3368.jpg

the sides look better:
http://dochawk.org/deville/150907/IMG_3370.jpg

So after rushing off to Wally-World to find some clay bar (and finding the screw for my throttle plate for my '72 at Ace in the process!), I washed the roof and took the suggestion to rub some wax in and see how it came out.

A search of the garage found an old bottle of wax:
http://dochawk.org/deville/150907/IMG_3376.jpg


I rubbed some in with my new microfiber towels

http://dochawk.org/deville/150907/IMG_3378.jpg

and got no red at all; just a bit of black. Hurrah!
http://dochawk.org/deville/150907/IMG_3379.jpg

In fact, as I progressed, only modest amounts of black came out the whole time on my clay:

http://dochawk.org/deville/150907/IMG_3387.jpg

All in all, I think I got more black on my clay from the window gaskets than the roof itself.

I don't know if it matters, but when washing the hood, I seem to still get significant beading; this is before I did anything but try to wash:

http://dochawk.org/deville/150907/IMG_3389.jpg

http://dochawk.org/deville/150907/IMG_3391.jpg

(I seriously doubt that the car had been waxed in years).

I found more scratches and dings than I thought that it had:

http://dochawk.org/deville/150907/IMG_3401.jpg

http://dochawk.org/deville/150907/IMG_3402.jpg

This one on the trunk is really ugly:
http://dochawk.org/deville/150907/IMG_3404.jpg

http://dochawk.org/deville/150907/IMG_3405.jpg

I keep complaining, but the trunk reflects my Mesquite tree rather well . . .

Yuck:
http://dochawk.org/deville/150907/IMG_3408.jpg


So now I need to acquire some #7. But for the moment, it's off to see if I can reconnect the starter wire to the '72 . . .

thanks

hawk

[dochawk]

Two weekends ago, I took a Meguire's clay bar and the spray that came with it to the roof, trunk, and hood. I didn't end up with huge amounts of grey removed, but definitely some.

Last night, while washing the roof, I felt roughness, and applied the clay to the roof again, which finished off the bottle.

Then I applied the Maguire's 7. It definitely looks better (and I can tell that I need to get better at this!), so here it is:

http://dochawk.org/deville/150918/IMG_3436.jpg

http://dochawk.org/deville/150918/IMG_3437.jpg

http://dochawk.org/deville/150918/IMG_3438.jpg

http://dochawk.org/deville/150918/IMG_3439.jpg

So where does this leave me? More #7? Or is this past detailing and in need of paint? Or ???

thanks

hawk

[oldmodman]

The paint is past it's "looks good" by date.

The only solution if you want the finish to look like new is new paint.

I have experimented with giving a deteriorating clearcoat a light sanding and then spraying it with a rattle can of 2K clear. With acceptable results.

Just beware of the overspray. You must mask off the entire area that is not to be sprayed. And you MUST wear the correct type of breathing mask. The chemicals in the 2K type of clear can kill you, or at least damage your lungs.

[Jbirk]

I did a Dodge bumper.

Honestly, at this point, I would consider painting the bad areas (entire panels) it myself with rattle cans.

Duplicolor DOES work, but you will need clear.


You will need to clean and remove ALL wax with a prep spray. You will want to sand through the uneven paint completely with whatever grit sand paper it takes to get through it... Then sand up to 800. Finally, IF you busted through to metal, you will need to spray primer.

Shake the paint can for five (5) minutes!

When you paint, do the first coat thin to make the surface tackey, then do at least two (2) thick coats but at least one (1) more than you need for full hiding. The last coat MUST be sprayed from a greater distance to cause a fine mist to get the metal particles to stand up for paint with metal/pearl.

Let it flash off between coats.

If spraying a 1K clear, know it will NOT be solvent resistant to things like gasoline, but otherwise it will be fine. If spraying a 2K clear, you will want to park the car for about 24 hours to let it off gas in a garage... Otherwise the acrylic base may not get along well with a 2K clear.

Either way, I would shoot about 7 to 9 coats of 1K clear or around 5 of the 2K clear.

Regardless, Garage it at least 12 hours before bringing it out in the elements.

Wait at least four (4) days (a week is better) before wet sanding. Sand it first with probably 1500 until all (or almost all) orangepeal is removed. If this is too slow, try 1200 but NOT lower than 1000 no matter what.

Regardless, if you use 1000 or 1200, step it back up to 1500... then 2000, then 3000. You might want to go to 5000.

Guide coat helps.

Now, compound the new paint then polish it with something that will make a showroom shine.

Here is a bumper I did
http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/attachments/ask-expert-featuring-mike-phillips/37387d1442733106-idiot-merged-lanes-into-me-4.jpg

It is the driver-side that is painted... Oh, and HALF that bumper is repainted with my guidance and supervision... with rattle cans... though I had my buddy do ALL the hard work (the hand sanding). :dblthumb2:

DO NOT WAX/SEAL for 30 to 60 Days. If it gets colder, wait the full 60 (or if you live in a northern climate).

[Setec Astronomy]

Dochawk, where are you located? Your most recent pictures don't look that bad, I think before you paint anything it might help to have someone with some detailing experience look at it. If you post your location perhaps there is a member nearby.

[dochawk]

Dochawk, where are you located? Your most recent pictures don't look that bad, I think before you paint anything it might help to have someone with some detailing experience look at it. If you post your location perhaps there is a member nearby.

I'm in Las Vegas

[dochawk]

Here is a closeup. Finally got the light right.

I'm not sure whether this are pocks in the paint, the mist from the clay bar, soap, or the #7. I can feel that they're there, and think I broke one off with a fingernail.

http://http://dochawk.org/deville/150907/IMG_3382.jpg