Confused! Ghost spots and Bird Poop Reappeared Any suggestions?

[Kamakaz1961]

This is a long post but it needs explanation so you can understand. Of the many years of detailing I have never experienced this and wanted to know if anyone might have experienced what I am about to state. Sorry, no pics, however, an explanation should suffice.

Last week (July 4th) I had to re-do my buddies Black 2007 Shelby GT as his X thought she was doing a good thing by hiring guys to wash the car, not once but at least 2 to 3 times without his knowledge. Additionally, the car was in the driveway collecting 2 major bird bombs and water spots from his sprinkler system. All baking in the sun.

Lo and behold it was messed up. On top of that the bird poop etched in his hood (not severe enough to wet sand but to compound/polish). Additionally, swirls galore all over the car!!!

So I did the normal wash/clay compound/polish and wax (no time for sealant will apply another coat of wax the following week).

I compounded the car with Menzerna FG400 w/Orange Hybrid Pad and used Menzerna SF4500 w/White Hybrid Pad. I used my Flex 3401 Speed setting 5 for both procedures. Used a Gold Hybrid Pad for the wax speed setting 2. These were all 6.5" Pads.

The car came out beautiful as usual. He even took pics and posted the pics on his Facebook account. This was July 4th weekend. No pics as this was just a normal re-do for me.

Last night (7/11) I was going to put on the 2nd coat of wax and to my SHOCK...The Hood looked like it was never done!! All the Bird etchings and water spots re-appeared!! The swirls were gone but the spots and bird etching was like I never did anything!!

So I redid the hood with compound/polish (same procedure). I called my buddy this morning to see if the etching and water spots re-appeared.

He indicated that it was perfect like it was the last time I detailed his ride.

In all my years of detailing I have never experienced this. Has this happened to anyone?

Additionally, I am hoping this was just a rare anomaly.

I hope I solved this problem with a complete re-do on my buddies hood. I am concerned I might have missed a procedure.

This time I double and triple checked my work and so far the results are the same as the 1st time.

So I am confused and if anyone has any suggestions to prevent something like this would be helpful.

My procedure: Wash, Nanoskin, compound/polish, ISP wipe down and wax.

Next week I will apply the 2nd coat of wax and will double check my work. I am sure the ride will (hopefully) be fine and I exercised all the bird etching/water spot demons from re-appearing again.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

[Ricorocks]

Hi Kamakaz,

I used to live in Anaheim, near Angel Stadium, & dated a gal from Tustin. I have found memories of that area.

I had a bird bomb on 2014 Audi A8, six months ago, I spend quite sometime, with my DA Meg. 205. When I put the wax on, I could not see the defect. Some amount of time passed, & it's back. Last month, I detailed again, & used a more aggressive polish, CG's V-36. Many passes, buf, wipe buf again. I looked from every angle possible, shined lights on it. Could not see it then glaze > sealant > wax. Now occasionally, if everything is perfect, I can still see a tiny little bit of it, my wife says, I'm nuts, as try as she will, she can't see it. That's good enough for me.

My theory is the poop does not all sink into the paint at the same level, some parts sink deeper than other parts of the poop defect. So we remove, just some with attack, leaving some poop behind, but the product, perhaps fills in, making almost impossible to see, then wearing away of product, causes some of the poop stain to become visible again.

I wonder if a blacklight flashlight might, contrast enough so as to see what we missed or being obscured by product ???? Also were looking at this paint so much during, detail that it becomes difficult to see. Like your used to it. Works that way for smell. Smell receptors, become overwhelmed & we don't notice, what a new nose instantly picks up. Anyway I always call my wife, honey what did I miss. This is my theory, so be gentle, if I'm way offbase & wrong.

Take Care
Rico

[tguil]

I had the same thing happen on a black Ford Expedition...only water marks and leaf imprints. Did all that same stuff you did...several times. My insurance company agreed to fix it. First a body shop tried carefully wet sanding. compounding, and polishing. They said it looked great. However the next day the mess was back. They ended up stripping the hood and repainting it. We never did determine the cause.

[Rsurfer]

For the marring to reappear...it means you never got rid of them in the first place. Something was hiding the defects and you could not see it. IPA may not be strong enough to clean the paint. Try using mineral spirits to get any oils off the paint before lsp.

[Ricorocks]

M205 not enough, V36 just right on this:

[Kamakaz1961]

Rsurfer & Ricorocks I believe you are both correct. I probably did not get rid of it the 1st time (Rsurfer) and the poop probably settled deeper than I compounded as you stated Rico. Additionally, his garage has poor lighting so I bought flood lights for his garage. Although much improved; it still does not match the lighting in my garage.

This time I made sure I covered all bases. The compounding was done carefully and I had plenty of lighting to make sure all the water spots and bird etching was gone. I made a couple of more passes than usual just to make sure I removed the imperfections. The hood was glass smooth. For polishing I did the same careful steps and a couple more extra passes to cover all bases. Then waxed.

I will check next week when I re-apply a 2nd coat of wax. I called my bud to check the hood and he indicated it looks great. So, hopefully, I will not have this problem next week and I am hopeful I exorcised all the DEMONS!! I will let you guys know next week as IMO that will give it plenty of time to re-appear if I messed up.

Tguil sorry for your situation...maybe the stuff on your ride were nuclear.

Rico, way cool you lived in my neck of the woods!! I talked to my buddies X. I let her know that even though she meant well; I advised her to leave his ride alone and I would take care of it or her daughter would. I taught her (12yrs old) how to rinseless wash the car in the garage with the 2B, 2GG, Wash mitt and several MF towels, drying towels and products I bought for them.

She will get $20 per wash and even though she might not be at my level of technique I can guarantee you she is more competent than the guys my buddies X hired. So overall a win win....I spend money on flood lights and AGO stuff for his daughter....well, she is my God daughter so this was well worth spending for the stuff. The good thing...the X is cooking me a BBQ steak dinner!

Have a good one guys!!

[fly07sti]

Hey CJ, curious as to what concentration IPA you used or panel wipe? Whenever I'm using Menz products, I always do 2 wipedowns with either eraser or d114 (panel wipe 1:15 + 10% IPA)

[Kamakaz1961]

Hey CJ, curious as to what concentration IPA you used or panel wipe? Whenever I'm using Menz products, I always do 2 wipedowns with either eraser or d114 (panel wipe 1:15 + 10% IPA)

I used Menzerna's Top Inspection the 1st time. This time I double checked everything and spent extra time on the defects along with wipe downs for prep for wax (Menzerna Top Inspection again). I did not have my pre wax cleaner with me both times (DOH)!

So far (knock on wood), I seemed to have fixed the problem the 2nd go around.

[fly07sti]

I used Menzerna's Top Inspection the 1st time. This time I double checked everything and spent extra time on the defects along with wipe downs for prep for wax (Menzerna Top Inspection again). I did not have my pre wax cleaner with me both times (DOH)!

So far (knock on wood), I seemed to have fixed the problem the 2nd go around.

Right on!

[Ricorocks]

CJ this explains why & how defects, can disappear then comeback. I wonder if a QD, would accomplish the same?

Polish > wipe > QD or this product for inspection.

Sorry get excited, post > then read your post. I see your aware & have used this product. :doh::doh::doh:http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/images/smilies/doh.gif

[LSNAutoDetailing]

Does Pinnacle make a version of Eraser?
I too have some hard water spots to tackle on a black car. Was parked near a water sprinkler

[Kamakaz1961]

Update on the re-do. My buddy checked this morning and ALL is well!! The 2nd time I did spend more time correcting the hood and (so far) no re-appearance of the water spots and bird poop. It has been about 4 days and it is fine.

A lesson learned for me. If this happens again; I will be able to prevent this.