More forced-rotation DA options...

[roguegeek]

In a previous post, I was choosing what polisher to move up to from a PC and landed on the 3401 for several reasons you can read in the original post.

http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/auto-detailing-tools-accessories/91203-upgrading-porter-cable-7424xp.html

That got me thinking and asking the question: Why aren't there more options out there for forced-rotation DAs? If you want one, really, the only game in town is Flex. Newer solutions have come out from Rupes, Meguiar's, and Torq, but they're all free-rotation. Seems like there's a viable hole in these manufacturer's product line. No? Wouldn't we be interested in forced-rotation DAs from other companies? It just seems strange that there aren't already.

[davey g-force]

I thought about that before.

I'm surprised Rupes or PC don't make one..

[VISITOR]

with the larger throw DA coming out years ago (Rupes), i had wondered why Flex wouldn't come out with one and a forced rotation at that. they may have tooled around with the thought, but maybe it wasn't necessary in their findings because the 3401 is a beast in it's own right...

[Firehouse Mike]

I asked a store rep at Griots Garage in Tacoma a few weeks ago about a new forced DA from Griots. The answer he gave me was very, well.........let's say open to the possibility. There is a special event at Griot's in a few days for a big new product announcement. Maybe a new FR DA polisher??

Mike:buffing:

[DBAILEY]

I own the Makita BO4060, which gives you the option of switching between forced rotation and normal mode. I purchased over the FLEX a long time ago because it had the ability to be switched to normal mode. Very powerful machine in either mode. The price has sky rocketed in last few years.

[HUMP DIESEL]

The only thing that needs to happen is for FLEX to make a mini version of the 3401 and its finished!

HUMP

[Mike Phillips]

I witnessed first hand the extra steps Flex takes to build a super high quality tool.

I also documented it with pictures. (Did this for Rupes too when I toured their facility last year).


Knowing the kind of punishment the Flex 3401 has to endure, anyone coming out with a copy of the Flex 3401 will have to build in the same type of quality in order to compete.


Germany Flex Plant Tour Pictures (http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/off-topic/41718-germany-flex-plant-tour-pictures.html)


Here's my write-up for the Rupes tour... I believe at that time I was the only person they've ever let take pictures of their manufacturing process.

Top Secret Pictures – How Rupes Bigfoot Polishers are made! (http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/ask-expert-featuring-mike-phillips/82066-top-secret-pictures-how-rupes-bigfoot-polishers-made.html)


Rupes built a gear-driven dual action polisher at one time, I took a picture of it and even held it in my hand.

Rupes Bigfoot Orbital Polishers Virtual Museum Tour - Milan, Italy (http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/ask-expert-featuring-mike-phillips/82061-rupes-bigfoot-orbital-polishers-virtual-museum-tour-milan-italy.html)


In the above write-up I showed a picture and asked....


Would anyone like to guess what type of tool this is?



No one ever took a shot at guessing.



:dunno:

[ryandamartini]

I remember Todd @ Rupes said during class that the forced rotation DA model was their original design but they moved on to the large throw DA.

Also, there is only so much space in the market to manufacture and sell well built, expensive, purpose built car buffers. Car detailing is a very small piece of the overall tool industry. Rupes and FLEX have cornered the market. The other buffers are Chinese made tools that lets face it... are not built like Rupes or FLEX.

[Setec Astronomy]

Rupes built a gear-driven dual action polisher at one time, I took a picture of it and even held it in my hand.

Rupes Bigfoot Orbital Polishers Virtual Museum Tour - Milan, Italy (http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/ask-expert-featuring-mike-phillips/82061-rupes-bigfoot-orbital-polishers-virtual-museum-tour-milan-italy.html)

In the above write-up I showed a picture and asked....

Would anyone like to guess what type of tool this is?

No one ever took a shot at guessing.

I guess you slipped that one past us, Mike! Was that just a prototype or was it actually produced? Did they give you any insight as to why they didn't continue with it?


I remember Todd @ Rupes said during class that the forced rotation DA model was their original design but they moved on to the large throw DA.

Also, there is only so much space in the market to manufacture and sell well built, expensive, purpose built car buffers. Car detailing is a very small piece of the overall tool industry. Rupes and FLEX have cornered the market. The other buffers are Chinese made tools that lets face it... are not built like Rupes or FLEX.

I guess that's the answer, they either felt their (long throw) approach was better, or wanted to differentiate themselves from the forced rotation approach, or both.

[roguegeek]

I witnessed first hand the extra steps Flex takes to build a super high quality tool.

Knowing the kind of punishment the Flex 3401 has to endure, anyone coming out with a copy of the Flex 3401 will have to build in the same type of quality in order to compete.

So it sounds like it's just a level of complexity and quality that no one, including Rupes, wants to step up to yet.

[roguegeek]

I own the Makita BO4060, which gives you the option of switching between forced rotation and normal mode. I purchased over the FLEX a long time ago because it had the ability to be switched to normal mode. Very powerful machine in either mode. The price has sky rocketed in last few years.

That switches between a free-rotation DA and a rotary. Still pretty cool, but not a forced-rotation DA.

[Mike Phillips]

Here's something I posted about the Makita BO6040 about 3 years ago...





I've used both and the Flex 3401 is easier to work with as it's purposefully designed to be a "paint polisher".

The Makita BO6040 is a wood sander. The difference is when sanding with it the tool doesn't require a lot of muscle to control. When polishing paint with it, you will use a lot more muscle energy to control it as compared to the Flex 3401.

Why?

Because of the design shape.

If you look at the two tools, the Flex 3401 is longer with a forward bale handle and the rear grip at the back of the tool. The length of the tool body is not an accident, the length of the tool puts your hands far enough apart at both extreme ends to give you leverage over the tool, this makes it easier to hold and control for HOURS as you work through the,

Correct step
Polishing step
Machine waxing step
Some people might even do a second polishing step.

Point being, buffing out an entire car with a neglected finish from start to finish is going to take you anywhere from 4 to 8 hours behind the polisher.

The design engineers at Flex purposefully designed the Flex 3401 to be an ergonomically correct, powerful paint polishing tool that will remove defects without at the same time instilling holograms or burning high points. (Assuming you use the tool correctly and with quality pads and good abrasive technology).

The design engineers at Makita purposefully designed the Makita BO6040 to be an ergonomically correct, powerful wood sander. Can it be used to polish paint? Yes. And it does do a good job in the way that the Flex 3401 does a good job by offering a forced, dual action orbiting pattern for the buffing pad.

If I had to pick one and go buff out an entire car I would easily grab the Flex 3401 over the Makita BO6040.

Plus, down the road you can get different backing plates for the Flex and I'm a big fan of the 4" backing plate with 5" Hybrid pads.


Hope that helps...

Shared this same above information with a guy on the phone yesterday asking pretty much the same questions and all he wants a polisher for is his own vehicles. He wants to buy one polisher that he can trust to get the job done and now have buyers remorse a few months down the road.






And here's a couple of articles I wrote on the Makita BO6040 with lots of pictures for those of you curious....


Makita BO6040 Removing Sanding Marks (http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/wet-sanding-cutting-buffing/50546-makita-bo6040-removing-sanding-marks.html)


http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/data/1457/MakitaBO6040Test001.jpg





How To use Nanoskin Autoscrub Pads on Makita BO6040 (http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/how-articles/56316-how-use-nanoskin-autoscrub-pads-makita-bo6040.html)


http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/data/1581/MakitaBO6040Autoscrub001.jpg



And I think I have a how-to article on how to use the Makita BO6040 to remove swirls and scratches but a quick Google search didn't turn it up like the above two articles.

:dunno:

[cardaddy]

The only thing that needs to happen is for FLEX to make a mini version of the 3401 and its finished!

HUMP

Nuff said!:dblthumb2: