Need some advice for a newb

[troutfisher]

Hey, guys so i'm a complete newb to all of this. I have been doing lots of reading and research trying to learn as much as i can. Here is my situation.

I have a red 2009 Toyota Corolla. I used to park under a pine tree while at work and needless to say the paint looks like crap after doing this over the years. There are pea size up to penny sized splotches from the sap all over the hood / trunk / roof. You can't get them off, it's like they are etched into the paint or something. I'll try and upload pics later today or tomorrow.

My question to guys are what do i need to do to fix this. Please keep in mind i am a complete newb and need products that are newb friendly :)

I have been looking at this set to get me started. Griot’s Garage Random Orbital Wolfgang Duo (http://www.autogeek.net/griots-garage-wolfgang-kit.html) My question to this is is WG newb friendly and can i really do anything to damage my paint / car anymore? What other product should i try if WG is not the right fit?

Thanks is advance.

[Angus]

Welcome!

Before you dive in, what sort of $ budget are you working with? The Griot's kit is a great idea, but it sounds like you'll need to do a good amount of decontamination before you even start working with a machine.

You've come to the right place. You're ride will be good as new soon enough :)

[Angus]

This "Go With The Flow" graphic helped me when I first discovered AutoGeek:

http://lib.store.yahoo.net/lib/autogeek/flowchart.jpg

Auto Detailing Facts, auto detailing Tips, How to detailing Guides, how to polish, how to wax, DIY detailing, do it yourself guides (http://www.autogeek.net/detailingtips.html)

[troutfisher]

well i don't really have a budget in mind but i don't want to spend money on a flex either :cool:.

I should also mention i have ordered a clay mitt and some chemical guys extreme wash and wax for lube to go over the car before i do anything. Would this be a good step? Obviously i'll give it a good thorough wash or two before i even use the clay mitt.

[Mike Phillips]

My question to this is is WG newb friendly and can i really do anything to damage my paint / car anymore?




With the Griot's Garage dual action polisher, the right pads and Wolfgang compounds and/or polishes you can not only fix just about anything you can also create a show car finish your friends, neighbors, co-works and family will not only drool over but ask you when you can do their car next.


The Wolfgang Four (http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/ask-expert-featuring-mike-phillips/74198-wolfgang-four.html)


Here are four products that will take care of about 99.9% of any exterior paint correction product you'll ever have in your garage.


The Wolfgang Four
http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/data/722/The_Wolfgang_Four.jpg


Forum member RFulmer (http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/auto-detailing-tools-accessories/73908-need-help-rupes-flex-6.html#post1003767) coined this term, (due credit where credit is due), and since there's been a lot of questions about what each product is, what they do, the order of aggressiveness and when you use one over the other, here's some info...





Uber Compound

Aggressive Compound - More aggressive than Wolfgang Total Swirl Remover and Wolfgang Finishing Glaze.
For use with any type of polisher/buffer and can be used by hand.
Body Shop Safe = Can be used in a fresh paint. environment (body shop) and can be used on fresh paint, (paint just sprayed and less than 30 days old).
Safe for Ceramiclear paints.
Cafe for all clear coat paints.
Safe for all single stage paints.
For some people on some cars it can be used as a compound/polish after which the paint can be sealed with a wax or synthetic paint sealant.



Total Swirl Remover

Medium Cut Polish - Less aggressive than Uber Compound and more aggressive than Wolfgang Finishing Glaze.
For use with any type of polisher/buffer and can be used by hand.
Body Shop Safe = Can be used in a fresh paint. environment (body shop) and can be used on fresh paint, (paint just sprayed and less than 30 days old).
Safe for Ceramiclear paints.
Cafe for all clear coat paints.
Safe for all single stage paints.
Should be tested before using Uber Compound to see if it will remove defects to our satisfaction in keeping with the practice of using the least aggressive product to get the job done.



Finishing Glaze

Fine Cut Polish - Much less aggressive than Wolfgang Total Swirl Remover and of course dramatically less aggressive than Wolfgang Uber Compound.
For use with any type of polisher/buffer and can be used by hand.
Body Shop Safe = Can be used in a fresh paint. environment (body shop) and can be used on fresh paint, (paint just sprayed and less than 30 days old).
Safe for Ceramiclear paints.
Cafe for all clear coat paints.
Safe for all single stage paints.
Should be tested before using Wolfgang Total Swirl Remover to see if it will remove defects to our satisfaction in keeping with the practice of using the least aggressive product to get the job done.
Great "Maintenance Polish" for use removing shallow swirls that show up over time from normal wear-n-tear on daily drivers and after a person has already performed a multi-step procedure to remove serious paint defects.



Deep Gloss Paint Sealant 3.0

German engineered synthetic paint sealant.
Non-cleaning, pure synthetic - Paint must be in excellent condition as in brand new or previously polished to like new condition before use.
Can be applied by hand or any type of dual action polisher wit foam pads.
This product "seals" the paint in the say way a car wax or paint coating will seal the paint. It is water insoluble and as such like all synthetic paint sealants, car waxes and paint coatings is not body shop safe.
Requires 30 to 45 minutes of drying time before removal.
Oxygen activated. After buffing off the excess sealant the remaining protection ingredients should be allowed to cure and fully set-up for an approximate 12 hour window of time before the vehicle is put back into service where it will be exposed to water.

Synergistic Chemical Compatibility
Each product is chemically compatible and chemically beneficial when used as a system approach to take a diamond in the rough and turn it into a glistening gemstone. Using the entire line in the correct order or just a few of the product in the correct order is an example of working forward in the paint polishing process.


All Inclusive System-Approach
This group of four products with just about any tool, any pad and even by hand will produce not only show car results but do it consistently across a VERY wide spectrum of paint systems including,

Hard paints, soft paints and everything in-between.
Factory OEM paints and aftermarket repaints at your local body shop or custom paint shop.
Single stage and basecoat clearcoat.
Which products do you need?
Which product you'll need depend upon the condition of the paint on the car. Click to my list of paint condition categories and read through the descriptions for the different categories. Then after washing and drying your car, inspect the paint both with your sense of touch, (The Baggie Test), and visually with your eyes in bright light for swirls and scratches.

Then determine which category your car's paint fall into. Here are some general guidelines but the best way to determine which exact product you'll need to remove the defects and restore the finish on your car to your expectations can only be determined by doing a Test Spot


How To Do a Test Spot (http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/how-articles/50162-how-do-test-spot.html)


Test Spot results showing the before and after difference...

http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/data/1422/FlexVideo005.jpg






On Autogeek.net

Wolfgang Uber Compound 3.0 (http://www.autogeek.net/wg-5601.html)

Total Swirl Remover (http://www.autogeek.net/wolfgang-total-swirl-remover-car-polish-3-0.html)

Finishing Glaze (http://www.autogeek.net/wolfgang-finishing-glaze-finishing-polish-3-0.html)

Deep Gloss Paint Sealant 3.0 (http://www.autogeek.net/wg5500.html)


:xyxthumbs:

[Mike Phillips]

Also... read this...


And if you don't have a 5" backing plate and 5.5" pads get them...

5 inch Backing Plates on Meguiar's, Griot's and Porter Cable DA Polishers (http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/auto-detailing-tools-accessories/48668-5-inch-backing-plates-meguiar-s-griot-s-porter-cable-da-polishers.html)



:)

[Mike Phillips]

And also read through this...

The title states the info is for working on brand new cars but the reality is the info works for any car.

How To Detail Your Brand New Car by Mike Phillips (http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/how-articles/54451-how-detail-your-brand-new-car-mike-phillips.html)



Even an old Ford truck...


http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/data/1290/54Ford50.jpg


:)

[David Hayward]

Mike, in your opinion is it bad to run 6 inch pads on the griots garage polisher? I use the megs mf pads and Lake country flat and css pads on mine and haven't had much trouble keeping them spinning. Just wondered if I'm better off with smaller.

[Angus]

well i don't really have a budget in mind but i don't want to spend money on a flex either :cool:.

I should also mention i have ordered a clay mitt and some chemical guys extreme wash and wax for lube to go over the car before i do anything. Would this be a good step? Obviously i'll give it a good thorough wash or two before i even use the clay mitt.

Mike Phillips is the man to learn from!

I hear you on the FLEX. I'd love to have one, but for occasional use the GG6 is perfect. Make sure you get plenty of pads for each step.

In addition to picking up the Wolfgang 4, I'd suggest getting Chemical Guys Citrus Wash Red soap to strip as much grime off your car as possible:

Chemical Guys Citrus Wash Red (http://www.autogeek.net/chemical-guys-citrus-wash-red.html)

You may also consider following up with Iron-X for a full decontamination:

Iron X Iron Remover, CQuartz IronX, Paint Cleaner, paint decontamination (http://www.autogeek.net/carpro-iron-x-cleaner.html)

And then using Optimum No Rinse mixed up as a clay lube instead of chemical guys extreme wash and wax (save that as a maintenance wash).

Optimum No Rinse Wash & Shine: clay lubricant, optimum rinseless wash, no rinse car wash, optimum detailing products (http://www.autogeek.net/optimum-no-rinse.html)

ONR is an excellent product with various uses which will help maximize your budget.

Good luck! Let us know how it goes!!

[troutfisher]

Mike and Angus - Thank you both for taking time to answer and help me out. Sounds like WG is newb friendly and i'll probably end up going with the Griots / WG combo pack.

Angus - After doing some more reading i saw the Iron X and already had it added to my cart :) Went ahead and picked up some Tarminator too.

I'll take before and after pics and hope all goes well. During the process if i need anything i'll be sure to ask.

Thanks again for all this knowledge.

One more question.... I assume you can use all this on plastic like the front / rear bumbers right?

[Angus]

Mike and Angus - Thank you both for taking time to answer and help me out. Sounds like WG is newb friendly and i'll probably end up going with the Griots / WG combo pack.

Awesome! Happy to hear it.


Angus - After doing some more reading i saw the Iron X and already had it added to my cart :) Went ahead and picked up some Tarminator too.

Great stuff - however just be ready for the smell... it's putrid.


I'll take before and after pics and hope all goes well. During the process if i need anything i'll be sure to ask.

Thanks again for all this knowledge.

:dblthumb2:


One more question.... I assume you can use all this on plastic like the front / rear bumbers right?

If you mean Iron-X and Tarminator - yes it can be used on bumpers as long as you do not let it dry.

[troutfisher]

ok guys so i'm to the buffing part of my cleanup. Here are some pics (best is could get). The sap is actually etched into the paint. What should i do? I've used Wolfgang SR and UC with orange flat pad and neither touch the spots. There are literally 1,000's of these spots but they are really hard to capture with the camera i have. anything that looks dull or wrong in the picture are the etched sap spots. what else could i try / use? what's your personal experiences getting etched sap off?

http://i1356.photobucket.com/albums/q728/davemfan/DSCF4286_zps41473162.jpg

http://i1356.photobucket.com/albums/q728/davemfan/DSCF4296_zps3bebf8e9.jpg

http://i1356.photobucket.com/albums/q728/davemfan/DSCF4297_zpsb0c173e9.jpg

[Mike Phillips]

Mike, in your opinion is it bad to run 6 inch pads on the Griot's garage polisher? I use the megs MF pads and Lake country flat and css pads on mine and haven't had much trouble keeping them spinning.



The Griot's dual action polisher has the most power of any Porter Cable type polisher I've ever used. I eve referred to it as a safe version of a rotary buffer in a Road Show Class in Texas when they were first introduced.

They do have enough power to keep larger, thicker foam pads rotating under pressure so if that works for you then go for it.

Do keep an eye on pad rotation as the pads become saturated with product as Pad Saturation is also a key factor that will reduce pad rotation no matter which DA polisher you're using.

Wet, soppy foam tends to absorb and dissipate the energy coming out of the tool and the larger the pad the more liquid it can hold so a larger wet pad will tend to not want to rotate very well.






Just wondered if I'm better off with smaller.



Thin is in and smaller diameter pads rotate better on any dual action polisher better than thicker, larger diameter pads. That's just physics.

The other key benefit to smaller diameter pads is they fit the body panels of modern cars better than larger diameter pads.

By this I mean the pad will fit in-between an edge and a raised body line as modern cars have a lot of thin section to panels.

:)

[Mike Phillips]

The sap is actually etched into the paint. What should i do?

I've used Wolfgang SR and UC with orange flat pad and neither touch the spots.




Ugh....

IF UC with a foam cutting pad isn't touching these etchings then it's time to get more aggressive.

I'd try a wool pad with a rotary buffer and the UC


:)

[mbpress01]

One quick question. Have you followed Mike's technique for the buffing part. I am surprised the etchings didn't come out. I had the exact same and 6-8 sections passes going with slow arm speed should do it. Unfortunately it takes a lot of patience as you must go slow and and watch the pad rotate with the black line on the backing plate. If you did that and still didn't come out then move to what Mike said. The only reason I comment is that I had the EXACT same on a car I did last weekend and it came right out after the 8th pass. I am a complete newbie also. One or two passes did nothing. 4-5 it got lighter and by the 8th they were gone. I used the rupes 15 with rupes green pad and compound. (Prob same as wolfgangs).