Swirls & RIDS :(

[Docjunaid]

Hey Guys
I bought recently porter cable 7424xp
and did some paint correction on my brothers Black 2009 Toyota Altis
and the finish was great apart from some RIDS :(

Here is the finishing shot of Toyota

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/04/01/yhazyzy2.jpg


So after this I worked on mine Toyota Vitz 2008 Pearl White
After proper washing with Sonax Car Wash
I tested a spot on the hood
Clayed the area
Then with PC and LC orange pad I used Ultimate Compound

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/04/01/vydybybu.jpg

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/04/01/4apahane.jpg

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/04/01/zanu4a8e.jpg

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/04/01/a6yzada3.jpg


Problem:
Do you see flake like shiny particles in first picture, these were not there before but they are on all of hood after compounding

In other pictures there are scratches which are not going away with 2 passes of Ucompond with PC.

So confused that I stopped till I got some ideas from you guys @ autogeek esp You Mike.Phillips

Any help is appreciated



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[zmcgovern45]

Hey Guys

Problem:
Do you see flake like shiny particles in first picture, these were not there before but they are on all of hood after compounding

In other pictures there are scratches which are not going away with 2 passes of Ucompond with PC.

So confused that I stopped till I got some ideas from you guys @ autogeek esp You Mike.Phillips

Any help is appreciated


Those 'flakes' as you called them appear to simply be very tiny chips caused by road debris. It is a common sight on daily driven vehicles - especially on the hood, fenders, and front bumper. Polishing makes them more noticeably under direct lighting because you are most likely removing some of the contamination that was 'filling them in' previously.

https://scontent-b-ord.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn2/t31.0-8/q87/s720x720/10005781_371170393021086_90478151_o.jpg
^You can see similar tiny, tiny chips in this photo... this was the hood of a daily driven 2006 Nissan Murano



Ultimate compound is not too aggressive of a compound. If you are not making an improvement, you may need to increase your pad and product aggressiveness. I would recommend Meguiar's Microfiber cutting pads as well as M105 cutting compound. This combination will have significantly more cut than UC on an Orange pad.

You may also focus on increasing machine speed, pressure, and making very slow arm movement to maximize cutting power. If needed, use a 3" pad for spot treating such RIDS as a 3" pad will provide much more concentrated force in a particular area.

In all honesty, I usually recommend not chasing deep RIDS on a daily driver. It is simply not worth it IMO. Chances are the car will be scratched in a parking lot by some lady's purse so all of your hard work will be for nothing in a short period of time :) Just something to think about.

-Zach

[Mike Phillips]

The flakes or dots or pinholes, however you like to describe them are a common problem.

In most cases, they are seen after polishing on the front end of a car which leads to a forum consensus that these defects are caused by impact with debris or some type of particulates when driving at highway speed.

Here's a related thread....

http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/ask-expert-featuring-mike-phillips/29528-paint-dots.html



I typed in pinholes mike phillips into google and found something I wrote in this thread,


http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/ask-expert-featuring-mike-phillips/53137-removing-swirls-left-speckles-pinholes-3.html


My theory isn't any better but here goes...

I "think" I've only seen this when using a DA Polisher, not sure I've seen this phenomena when using a rotary buffer. I have no idea why there would be a difference.

The place you see the pin holes or voids in the paint are places where the paint was much softer or places that were covered over with actual paint.

When you buffed the paint you remove enough of the top skin of pait to uncover the pinholes.

Not a very good theory but that's all I got....


Like stated, if you only see the problem on the hood that's an indicator that it's road rash from dirt, gravel, sand or debris being sprayed on you by either the cars in front of you or the wind or both.

If the problem is throughout the finish then it's paint related.

If the problem is only on the horizontal surfaces then it could be something that was airborne and landed on the car, this doesn't so much apply to pinholes as it does craters.


Also see this recent post on this same topic, I included some picture, take a look at them and see if the pictures I posted show what you're seeing...


Tick Marks Pinholes or Solvent Popping? (http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/auto-detailing-101/53239-tick-marks-pinholes-solvent-popping.html)


http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/data/855/BandT004.jpg



:)

[Mike Phillips]

Here's another related thread with some good pictures....

Tiny craters in paint? (http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/ask-expert-featuring-mike-phillips/75287-tiny-craters-paint.html)



Big picture is this, regardless of the cause of the tiny defects, the only way to remove defects "in" the paint is to abrade the paint and thus level the upper surface of the paint with the lowest depths of the defects.

The issue with the above is you don't have a lot of paint or film-build to work with.

So at some point you get to learn to live with them or consider getting a new paint job. Most people don't like the cost that goes with getting a new paint job so they "get" to learn to live with them.


:)

[Mike Phillips]

As for the scratches that are not going away with UC and a PC?

How aggressive is your pad?


Get a more aggressive pad.
Be on the 6.0 speed setting
Push down about 15 to 20 pounds of pressure but mark your backing plate to make sure you can see the pad is rotating.
Move the pad very S-L-O-W-L-Y over the paint as though you were in a slow motion film. S-L-O-W-L-Y.
Reduce the size of the area you're working. This means get small.


If the combo you're using is removing shallow scratches, this means the combo will remove deeper scratches it will just take longer and you need to really dial-in your technique and perhaps tweak it a bit.



You could also get a thin purple wool pad (http://www.autogeek.net/lake-country-thin-foamed-wool-pads.html) at Autogeek.net

Thin is in....


:)

[HateSwirls]

I "Like this" :)
Mike knows:dblthumb2:




Here's another related thread with some good pictures....

Tiny craters in paint? (http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/ask-expert-featuring-mike-phillips/75287-tiny-craters-paint.html)



Big picture is this, regardless of the cause of the tiny defects, the only way to remove defects "in" the paint is to abrade the paint and thus level the upper surface of the paint with the lowest depths of the defects.

The issue with the above is you don't have a lot of paint or film-build to work with.

So at some point you get to learn to live with them or consider getting a new paint job. Most people don't like the cost that goes with getting a new paint job so they "get" to learn to live with them.


:)

[Mike Phillips]

Another option for removing the deeper scratches would be to get a rotary buffer, a wool pad and then use the UC.

You could also wetsand using 3M Trizact #3000 or even #5000 and then buff out your sanding marks.

I did this to some RIDS on the Nova last week.

1966 Blown Nova - Extreme Makeover - Pictures & Videos (http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/pictures-autogeek-s-car-week/78227-1966-blown-nova-extreme-makeover-pictures-videos.html)



http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/data/2310/1966_Nova_Detailed_at_Autogeek_020.jpg



Sanded them with #3000 and then removed them using a wool pad on the Flex PE14


Did the same thing on the 1967 Mustang Fastback GTA

1967 Mustang GTA Fastback - Pictures & Comments Threads (http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/pictures-autogeek-s-car-week/76807-1967-mustang-gta-fastback-pictures-comments-thread.html)


Pig Tails

http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/data/2290/1967_Mustang_Fastback_Autogeek_Mike_Phillips_012.j pg


http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/data/2290/1967_Mustang_Fastback_Autogeek_Mike_Phillips_068.j pg

http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/data/2290/1967_Mustang_Fastback_Autogeek_Mike_Phillips_069.j pg

http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/data/2290/1967_Mustang_Fastback_Autogeek_Mike_Phillips_070.j pg




:)

[Docjunaid]

Thank You Mike & Zac
Im going to modify the technique i used previously
I guess this as they say in cricket " a test match is a 5 day game so play according to format"
I think i was too quick in my method
Thank You for explaining the sand blast effect, i can live with it, my fear was that i induced it

Will get back to you guys with the next update
Cheers




Sent from my iPad2 using Tapatalk HD

[JKL1031]

Those 'flakes' as you called them appear to simply be very tiny chips caused by road debris. It is a common sight on daily driven vehicles - especially on the hood, fenders, and front bumper. Polishing makes them more noticeably under direct lighting because you are most likely removing some of the contamination that was 'filling them in' previously.


^You can see similar tiny, tiny chips in this photo... this was the hood of a daily driven 2006 Nissan Murano



Ultimate compound is not too aggressive of a compound. If you are not making an improvement, you may need to increase your pad and product aggressiveness. I would recommend Meguiar's Microfiber cutting pads as well as M105 cutting compound. This combination will have significantly more cut than UC on an Orange pad.

You may also focus on increasing machine speed, pressure, and making very slow arm movement to maximize cutting power. If needed, use a 3" pad for spot treating such RIDS as a 3" pad will provide much more concentrated force in a particular area.

In all honesty, I usually recommend not chasing deep RIDS on a daily driver. It is simply not worth it IMO. Chances are the car will be scratched in a parking lot by some lady's purse so all of your hard work will be for nothing in a short period of time :) Just something to think about.

-Zach

No excuse, you should be double parked in the back of the parking lot anyway.
:props:

[zmcgovern45]

No excuse, you should be double parked in the back of the parking lot anyway.
:props:


It's amazing how someone will always park next to you anyway :)