Can't get rid of swirls and scratches

[cheekyage]

Hi all,

I am really enjoying the forum as I am new to the detailing world.

I attempted to polish a car using a Random Orbital machine with a friend of mine following all the basic and recommended steps however I was disappointed with my results.

I achieved fantastic gloss and reflections yet I could still see some light swirls, water marks and light scratches which I thought would have been removed.

Here is a guideline of my process and products used

1. 2 Bucket Wash
2. Clay
3. Menzerna PF2500 on Orange pad
4. Menzerna SF4000 on Black pad
5. Opti-Seal Sealant

Am I perhaps missing something or doing something wrong?

Any feedback or advice would be great :)

[davidg]

Which machine? Do you have a lake country green or white pad?

[Scott@IncrediblyDetailed]

Start here.

http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/tricks-tips-techniques/20021-definitive-how-article-removing-swirls-scratches-water-spots-using-porter-cable-7424xp-g110v2-griot-s-garage-polisher.html

http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/questions-about-porter-cable-7424xp-7424-7336-griot-s-meguiar-s-dual-action-polishers/38399-da-polisher-articles-help-newbies-machine-polishing.html

[Kaban]

Probably need something alot more aggressive than the PF,,,that doesn't have that much cut.

That or you are going too gentle and not using enough pressure.

[Black's Magic]

Feed back please Need more info and pics could help.
What machine are you using? Which pads are you using (LC, Cobra, etc?) and what are their condition. How much product are you applying to the pads?




Hi all,

I am really enjoying the forum as I am new to the detailing world.

I attempted to polish a car using a Random Orbital machine with a friend of mine following all the basic and recommended steps however I was disappointed with my results.

I achieved fantastic gloss and reflections yet I could still see some light swirls, water marks and light scratches which I thought would have been removed.

Here is a guideline of my process and products used

1. 2 Bucket Wash
2. Clay
3. Menzerna PF2500 on Orange pad
4. Menzerna SF4000 on Black pad
5. Opti-Seal Sealant

Am I perhaps missing something or doing something wrong?

Any feedback or advice would be great :)

[Evan.J]

Need more info like machine you are using pads and technique.

When you say random orbital do you mean a 40 buck wax spreader you can get from your local auto part store or a machine like a Griots garage Dual action polisher?

[HateSwirls]

I hope you're not talking about one of those cheap "Wax Spreader Polishes"
You applied the sealant already , should have waited until you were happy with the results.

When I do a full correction I do the following.

2BM
Clay
GG6 polisher.
CG'S orange hex pad
Meg's UC or m105
CG's white hex pad used with m205

Then I inspect the entire car before I do anything else.
It's so important to take your time polishing, test spot is a must , that way you know if your products and procedure is working for you,

Good Luck:)

[cheekyage]

Thanks for your prompt replies so far guys.

Machine -
Bosch GEX150T

Pads -
6.5' Lake Country Flat Pad, Orange
6.5' Lake Country Flat Pad, Gray/Black

[HateSwirls]

What did you think about the Opti-Coat?

[Scott@IncrediblyDetailed]

Thanks for your prompt replies so far guys.

Machine -
Bosch GEX150T

Pads -
6.5' Lake Country Flat Pad, Orange
6.5' Lake Country Flat Pad, Gray/Black

Pads are too large for a non-forced rotation machine.

5.5 inch max.

[VP Mark]

Hmm that really depends on the rotation of the pad. He might have just had poor technique elsewhere. If the pad is spinning fast enough it shouldn't really matter the size of the pad.

Non forced rotation machines can run 6.5 in pads just fine, I run them all day long on my rupes 15.

Sent from my DROID RAZR using AG Online

[EddieF]

Thanks for your prompt replies so far guys.

Machine -
Bosch GEX150T

Pads -
6.5' Lake Country Flat Pad, Orange
6.5' Lake Country Flat Pad, Gray/Black

Pads could be to big for the polisher and the Gray/Black pads could be to fine to get out the fine swirls the compound is producing. Try following up with a white pad after the compounding.

[cheekyage]

For the moment I have been using the machine in regular Random Orbital mode.

I am still getting the hang of Forced Rotation mode and using this more on the bigger flatter panels and sometimes even combining both modes.

But Random Orbital mode is what I have been mainly using.

In terms of technique I apply a gentle amount of pressure on the top of the machine but pretty much let the machine do the work.

I have been using the cross-hatch technique to apply the polish, not rushed or fast paced. Slowly and carefully.

I start the machine on speed 1 or 2 and begin to spread the polish.

I then bump up the speed to 4 or 5 as I have noticed the pad does not spin very well at lower speeds in Random Orbital mode on this particular machine.

[cardaddy]

Woah there, did you say you sealed it BEFORE you actually checked the progress to make sure it was what you wanted?

Best advice would be a test spot. Maybe do a few just to figure out how far you want to go with your compounding stage. Although the Menz 2500 isn't going to give you a ton of real correction, even with an orange pad.

Speaking of the pad(s), how many do you have and how often are you both cleaning as well as changing them out? You'll need more than 1 or 2 to do an entire vehicle. Actually you'll need more like 2 to do just the hood. Another 2 for the roof. Another 2 for the sides (each side), and so on. It's possible to do the compounding stage with as few as 3 or 4 but not in a day, not unless you're drying the cleaned pads between your duty rotation of them. Say you start with #1 work it till it needs cleaning and switch to #2. At that point you'd need to clean #1 and sit it in the HOT sun to dry, turning it over a couple of times. Same thing with the next 2 while you're going.

By then you'd be able to go back to the now, totally dry (and clean) pad and continue on.

Why be so surgical with it? Because dirty pads will cause swirls, and marring.

After you figure out what works for your compounding stage by doing your test spots then move to your polishing testing. May be a white pad, or green, or blue, or black. Can't say without being there and trying it.

Changing the machine speed, arm speed, arm pressure will affect everything in both the compounding and polishing stages. What works on one paint may not work on another. Especially when one is hard and the other is soft.

Although I'd say you would be doing good to pick up a bottle of Menzerna PG1000 for more cut going in, unless your paint is really hard then FG400 would be a better choice.

Also (along the lines of keeping a clean pad) remember that once you have the pad primed and have worked your first section that not only is there spent and broken down product in your pad, but contaminates and paint are in there now as well. Work that stuff back all over your panel and you're doing more damage than good. Do a section pass and clean on the fly. Do that with each and every section pass!

[cheekyage]

Thanks so much for your informative reply cardaddy.

I'm learning more and more with every post :)

I didn't realise that I needed more than one of each type of polishing pad.

Is this normal practice or too much overkill?

Should I have maybe gone for a higher cut polish then?
Something like Menz FG500 or similar?