what buffer combo on AG to get for paint correction?

[saulpr]

hi,

i am very new to detailing, i have a black bmw 335 with swirl marks. from 1-10 id say my swirl marks are a 7.

Ive been reasearching a little and have found AG buffer combos to be well priced.

I saw a awesome video of mike removing swirl marks using wolfgang products and a porter cable. very helpful!

Now my quesion is this: of the buffer combos ive seen on AG which ones have you guys used and which is better?

ive looked at adams and theyre products seem easy enough but they seem a little expensive at least to me.

i was looking at the Griots kit which i believe to be fairly priced and meguiars is very reputable. Griot’s Garage & Meguiar’s Paint Perfection Kit 3rd Generation! (http://www.autogeek.net/griots-garage-paint-perfection-kit.html)

what do you guys think?
what has been youre experience with products that work as far as removing swirl marks with less effort?
what machine is the most effective , comfortable and well priced?

[Mike Phillips]

Hi Saul,

DA polishers, the entry level type like Porter Cable, Griot's and Meguiar's are completely capable of de-swirling your BMW. In fact millions of cars have been de-swirled using these type of tool and I know I've done a few myself.

The next step up would be either a Flex 3401 or a Rupes Bigfoot polisher.


Most people that start out with a Porter Cable style are either happy with the tool if they're only dong their own cars. If a person starts doing more cars for fun or money they soon find out the limitations of the PC style tools as you can stop the pad from spinning with too much downward pressure or when buffing curved body panels.

If you're going to get a PC style tool then no matter which tool you get you'll want to get a 5" backing plate and go with the 5.5" pads as these will rotate best on this type of tool and pad rotation is necessary for removing swirls and scratches.


See my article here, all my articles have links for the products shown to make it easy to get what you want plus lots of pictures so you can see what I'm talking about.


5 inch Backing Plates on Meguiar's, Griot's and Porter Cable DA Polishers (http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/auto-detailing-tools-accessories/48668-5-inch-backing-plates-meguiar-s-griot-s-porter-cable-da-polishers.html)



And I cover all this in my how-to book in-depth...


Detailing How-To Book and Detailing How-To E-book by Mike Phillips (http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/ask-expert-featuring-mike-phillips/64360-detailing-how-book-detailing-how-e-book.html)


Also, this is a very good how-to video, it covers TONS of techniques you'll need to know when buffing out your car.



How to buff out a car

How to buff out a car





:)

[mwoolfso]

I faced this same dilemma a few years ago. Which one to buy??????

I rationalized it by leveraging my experience. I have been building and fixing things with my hands (and tools) for quite awhile, and I figured I would be able to learn quickly. I got the Flex 3401 and have never looked back since.

[Mike Phillips]

I faced this same dilemma a few years ago. Which one to buy??????

I rationalized it by leveraging my experience. I have been building and fixing things with my hands (and tools) for quite awhile, and I figured I would be able to learn quickly. I got the Flex 3401 and have never looked back since.


The Flex is a Pro Grade tool and when optimized with the 4" LC backing plate and 5" Hybrid pads it's a very capable tool for just about any detailing project.


:)

[saulpr]

How about the waxing and swirl remover products are they basically all as good as promised?? I tried meguiars ultra compound and regular carnauba by Hand no improvement . Looks a little better for like 5 mins after that the same. I heard in one of your vids I sart with the most basic swirl remover than move up gradually. For example m105 if doesn't work 205? As far as I've seen most of these products work as advertise with the machines be it poor boy, meguiars, Adams etc. as long as you have the right machine and pads? And TECHNIQUE!

[cleanmycorolla]

How about the waxing and swirl remover products are they basically all as good as promised?? I tried meguiars ultra compound and regular carnauba by Hand no improvement . Looks a little better for like 5 mins after that the same. I heard in one of your vids I sart with the most basic swirl remover than move up gradually. For example m105 if doesn't work 205? As far as I've seen most of these products work as advertise with the machines be it poor boy, meguiars, Adams etc. as long as you have the right machine and pads? And TECHNIQUE!

Any correction by hand will be minimal if not done slowly and properly. Not fair to judge the products based on hand use.

Also it's not so much the polishes as its your technique. Yes some polishes have a learning curve. But any one can use the Wolfgang twins and get great results. They're idiot proof.

[Desertnate]

I'll through out another option that served me well.

Harbor Freight has a DA for around $60. Less if you use a coupon that you can find anywhere.

It probably isn't what a pro with his own buisness needs, but for my twice a year, 2~3 car usage I think it will work out just fine.

Of course pads and products would come from here.

Just a thought.

[Mike Phillips]

I tried meguiars ultra compound and regular carnauba by Hand no improvement .




I would say that in my life, I rarely meet anyone that knows how to remove swirls and scratches out of a clear coat by hand.

Rarely.


It is very time consuming and requires a LOT of work. Work = fast hand movement with firm pressure over a small area, about 8" square. Now extrapolate that out to get an idea of what it would take to do an entire car.


Also, read my posts on page 2 of this thread,

http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/auto-detailing-101/68396-how-can-i-polish-varnished-wood-nice-finish-2.html


Specifically posts #16 and #17, especially #17.


If you want to remove swirls out of a clear coated car then you need to move up to machine polishing or hire someone that knows what they are doing to do it for you.

Then be prepared to wash and wipe your car's finish carefully as clear coat paints are scratch-sensitive. This means they might be harder than traditional single stage paints but the still scratch easily.

I cover all this in the first chapter or tow of my how-to book. It's very thorough and detailed.

Detailing How-To Book and Detailing How-To E-book by Mike Phillips (http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/ask-expert-featuring-mike-phillips/64360-detailing-how-book-detailing-how-e-book.html)




:)

[saulpr]

Wolfgang twins??

[Detailing by M]

Rupes Bigfoot, Meg's DAMF System. Is my choice for your car.
From my experience with BMW, what year is yours?, is that they have very difficult paint to correct. So a machine is a necessity on your car or any car that needs paint correction.
If you can't afford the Bigfoot get a Meg's G110, great machine.
You can get an older PC/Meg's G100 on slEaseBay for around $80 bucks

[saulpr]

2007

[saulpr]

Decided to order Wolfgang Duo & Porter Cable 7424XP, I saw a the video again of mike working on a Lexus IS and the swirl marks look almost like what I have. Also it's a black car, so I decided to go with what seems to be the combo he used in the vid. I'll let u guys know how it goes , hopefully I won't mess up. There's a lot of guys on the forums that speak highly of the porter cable and it basically being very hard for a novice to do damage with it. So I'm going with that.