Will Wolfgang Twins work on 2006 MBZ Ceramiclear?

[Jawzey]

Hey all,

Relatively new here, and I have a question that I need to ask. I have a 2006 MBZ that has the ceramiclear paint. It has moderate swirls with some RIDS. I want to use the Wolfgang Twins with orange and white LC flat pads to remove them, however I am not sure if the Wolfgang products are strong enough. I know I should do a test spot, however I don't want to purchase something to only find out it will not work on my rock hard paint. If anyone has had experience with this, can you please give some insight?

Any help is greatly appreciated.

J-

[Evan.J]

Hey all,

Relatively new here, and I have a question that I need to ask. I have a 2006 MBZ that has the ceramiclear paint. It has moderate swirls with some RIDS. I want to use the Wolfgang Twins with orange and white LC flat pads to remove them, however I am not sure if the Wolfgang products are strong enough. I know I should do a test spot, however I don't want to purchase something to only find out it will not work on my rock hard paint. If anyone has had experience with this, can you please give some insight?

Any help is greatly appreciated.

J-

Here is a great article on just that topic:

Ceramiclear Paints - Be Careful (http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/hot-topics-frequently-asked-questions/47152-ceramiclear-paints-careful.html)


http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/data/715/D8182.jpg


Had a phone call from Shawn Kelly at Premier Detailing about a problem he was having on a brand new Mercedes-Benz AMG with Ceramiclear finish.

The customer bought the car brand new but brand new from the dealership it came with holograms, buffer marks and compound residue everywhere.

Shawn is an experienced Pro Detailer and when he started having problems working on the paint he called me to discuss possible remedies. In our conversation he told me that he had heard from someone in the auto industry that the chemistry design of Ceramiclear paints is that the nano particles in the resin migrate to the top to form the scratch-resistant surface.

I told him that I've heard of paint technologies like this but had no concrete information that this is the case for the PPG Ceramiclear. So I called the Doctor.

I called Dr. David Ghodoussi, who has either worked for or consulted for the majority of automotive paint manufactures for more information on this subject. Dr. Ghodoussi is more than qualified to talk about paint chemistry and he confirmed that what Shawn was told is correct.

From Dr. Ghodoussi...

After the "cerami"clear top coat is sprayed, the nano particles of Fumed Silica (SiO2), which are synthetically engineered, migrate to the top 0.2 mils of the clear coat as it is curing.

If you remove this potion of the clear layer of paint, the paint under it will be much softer and will not polish out or react the same way the nano particle portion did or would.
You will at some level have compromised the the finish on the car.


Knowing this, my opinion is that this is bad paint technology because while it might work in the testing labs, in the real world it puts detailers and car owners at risk.

Dr. Ghodoussi said this is an example of over-engineering.

I agree. The paint systems on new cars should not be rocket science for detailers or even car owners to work on. Daily drivers see wear-n-tear and the way wear-n-tear, (swirls, scratches, water spots and oxidation), is addressed is to abrade the surface using some type of compounding and/or polishing process.

Paint manufactures and Car manufactures, (the companies using the paint), should know the paint on the finished product is going to become scratched and swirled and then compounded and polished and they should be taking this into consideration and providing a finish on new cars with this mind.

To Paint Manufacturers and Car Manufacturers
Just to note... if there are any representatives from paint manufacturers or car manufacturers reading this, cars are often times polished more than ONCE over their service life. So start putting more paint on your cars and make sure the paint can be compounded and polished by both pro detailers and enthusiast detailers without having to have a degree in chemistry.


Choose wisely
Knowing all of the above I would suggest that any time you are asked to work on a car with a Ceramiclear finish to first find out the history of the paint, that is... has it been cut with a compound by someone else that has worked on the car previously. If you find out others have compounded the Ceramiclear paint then choose wisely whether or not you put yourself at risk doing any type of compounding or polishing work to the paint.

Regardless of whether or not the car has ever been compounded or polished, follow this advice,

"Use the least aggressive product to get the job done" (http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/ask-expert-featuring-mike-phillips/28505-use-least-aggressive-product-get-job-done.html)



There's a famous line from a Kenny Rogers song called The Gambler that goes like this,


You've got to know when to hold 'em
Know when to fold 'em
Know when to walk away
And know when to run

It could be that when it comes to cars with Ceramiclear paint jobs... you might want to as I say...

Let some other guy have the blessing...



:)


From PPG.com (http://www.ppg.com/coatings/autooem/products/Pages/clearcoat.aspx)


CeramiClear Clearcoat
PPG's CeramiClear® clearcoat was the first clearcoat to use nanoparticle technology to achieve a previously unattained level of scratch, mar, and etch resistance.

This patented technology creates a hard, silica-like surface that provides superior resistance to damage caused by day-to-day use, car washes, and environmental hazards such as acid rain and tree sap.

While this technology is currently employed as a two-component liquid clearcoat, PPG is very close to commercializing a one-component version for use in automotive assembly plants.


:)

[Jawzey]

I read that thread, however I still did not find an answer to my question there. To my understanding, Wolfgang is made by Menzerna, whom specializes in German paint. Would that be any indication that the Wolfgang Twins could work on my hard ceramiclear paint?

[cleanmycorolla]

You'll be fine.

[Nick McKees37]

Would that be any indication that the Wolfgang Twins could work on my hard ceramiclear paint?

Yes. :dblthumb2:

[silverfox]

One thing about the WG twins...you can get consistently excellent results on any type paint...With black being the benchmark for polishes.

[ScottB]

Wolfgang is perfect as the abrasives used were designed for ceramiclear finishes. Menzerna is another choice.

[Jawzey]

Thanks for the replies, all. Greatly appreciated. I'm going to try this combination on my hard ceramiclear paint very soon. Will post results once finished. Thanks again.