Devil is in the details, and other lessons

[lokerola]

Hi there everyone, I hope you had a great weekend! I finally started to get over this wretched sinus infection and I got out to wash my old beater truck today. 2 bucket wash, microfiber dry, and some Klasse AIO by hand. Just didn't feel up to dragging out the DA today.

Anyway, I've learned some lessons recently I thought I'd share with you. These are lessons that have been passed on before by Mike and others here, but they so simple, so easy to overlook, that -- well, I overlooked them in the last year and I think they contributed to adding swirls to my 2011 Dodge Charger.

I'll also add that my observations might be appropriate for the fellow hobbyist, not the pros out there as I'm sure the pros have this stuff down cold.

1. Have a clean container for dirty microfiber. I used to "gently" put my used and dirty microfibers down on a "clean" (or so I thought) surface, like an old chair I keep outside. I didn't have a dedicated container for my used Microfibers. My microfibers have been picking up a lot of SMALL debris that I'm sure have been contributing to some swirls in my paint. Do your self a favor and pick up a new, 10 dollar bucket at your Lowes, Home Depot, whatever, and use it for collecting dirty microfiber. I have also discovered that my basement environment may have been contributing to my "infected" mircofibers. God bless my wife, but she was drying, folding, and putting my microfibers on the FLOOR next to the washer where they were picking up tiny little bit of debris. I found that if I gather all my dirty microfibers after I wash & wax into a single dedicated container, and then put all the clean microfiber into the same clean container, I can avoid a lot of hassles with what I call "infected" microfiber.

2. This lesson came from lesson #1. Don't look at your microfiber - INSPECT your microfiber! At first glance, the big lump of microfibers out of the dryer looked clean and ready for use. But oh no my friends....it was not true! About 1/3 of the microfibers had very small bits of debris still left in the fiber. Small I tell you, but still there. I spent about 30 minutes going over both sides over every microfiber that came out of that dryer. Most were OK with only 1 or 2 small bits that had to be removed. But some of them were what I call "infected". Thay looked OK at an initial glance, but when you sit down, and really, really, look hard - there were tiny little bits of grass, etc I had to pick out. So now part of my wash cycle is to pick through all my microfiber very closely before it gets washed and check it all again after it comes out of the dryer.

Anyway - this is probably the most boring "lessons learned from a hobbyist" ever, but maybe some of you will look more closely and keep those microfibers clean. Because at the end of the day I have some minor swirls I still need to remove from the paint of my 1 year old car and I think the "infected" microfibers had something to do with it .

Good luck and happy detailing! :buffing:

[mjlinane]

Good lessons. MFs play a crucial role in the things we do and deserve to be treated accordingly.

[Vegas Transplant]

I was very AR about my MF's before switching back to cotton.
I would give each a 'snap' before inspection, and then another snap before hanging to dry.
I would also do the same before folding and putting away. And a final snap before use.

Q? Did you ONR much between winter prep and now?

Thanks for your post.

[steveh4263]

I wouldn't put the dirty mf's with the clean mf's in the same container. Two containers would be a good idea. One for dirty mf's and one for clean mf's.

[tuscarora dave]

I've learned this lesson over and over. Now...I stock finishing towels that after used on the finishing stage of one multiple stage paint correction, they go into the everything else bin, and then there's the engine and trunk jam towel bin which is the bottom of the scale. If it's dark in color and gets perfectly finished, nothing but a brand new towel touches it.

[RhetoricMixes]

Everytime i get my MF towels out the dryer i sit down and inspect every one of them since 99% of the time they get very small pieces of debris in them that would most definetly instill some swirls. My advice to you would be to get ANY kind of MF detergent wash. Doesnt matter what brand just be sure to get some, it will save your towels SO much in the long run.

[lokerola]

Good lessons. MFs play a crucial role in the things we do and deserve to be treated accordingly. Very true Mjlinane, just one of those things I realize need more attention from me. I've been focused on polish, pads, sealants,etc, etc - and I ignored some of the basics. Thanks!


I was very AR about my MF's before switching back to cotton.
I would give each a 'snap' before inspection, and then another snap before hanging to dry.
I would also do the same before folding and putting away. And a final snap before use.

Q? Did you ONR much between winter prep and now?

Thanks for your post. Vegas - you're using cotton? Do tell! I'd like to hear more about how you use cotton without getting scratches. I did do ONR. But I was careless a few too many times with spot cleaning between the regular washing and the rinse-less washes. I would see a little spot that needed and quick wipe and I'd pull out the QD and microfiber and clean it. Then I'd see another spot, and another. I couldn't leave well enough alone and would gosh darn nearly wipe the whole car down with 1 microfiber and the QD bottle. Ugh.


I've learned this lesson over and over. Now...I stock finishing towels that after used on the finishing stage of one multiple stage paint correction, they go into the everything else bin, and then there's the engine and trunk jam towel bin which is the bottom of the scale. If it's dark in color and gets perfectly finished, nothing but a brand new towel touches it. Dave - good to hear I'm not the only one learning lessons over and over! I may go to your method and have multiple bins to match the different ways microfibers get used. For now, I'm just happy they're in a clean container!


Everytime i get my MF towels out the dryer i sit down and inspect every one of them since 99% of the time they get very small pieces of debris in them that would most definetly instill some swirls. My advice to you would be to get ANY kind of MF detergent wash. Doesnt matter what brand just be sure to get some, it will save your towels SO much in the long run. Rhetoric, your method is my new method. INSPECT after every wash. Not a quick glance and fold, but INSPECT. I do use a MF detergent, and the microfibers come out soft and ready to be used again. It's just those occasional pesky micro-debris I found out you have to inspect for!

[Vegas Transplant]

I've learned this lesson over and over. Now...I stock finishing towels that after used on the finishing stage of one multiple stage paint correction, they go into the everything else bin...nothing but a brand new towel touches it.

TD, great advice hand. I did not do this in my testing phase back in January.
I've got brand new Sonus towels still in the bag, that I got in after I decided to switch to cotton.

My game plan on cotton was simple. Watch the weekly circulars from the big box department stores and buy the large plush 100% cotton towels. Wash with fabric softener, dry with dryer sheets, trim the borders and cut to 20x20 squares. Shake or snap vigorously to remove linting from the cutting process. Use, then never touch paint again.

However, after reading TD's post, I will do more testing due to the fact that my cotton 20x20 are one-time paint use only. I have a custom '71 truck, metallic blue, that I'm doing Tuesday, to try this out on.

[tuscarora dave]

TD, great advice hand. I did not do this in my testing phase back in January.
I've got brand new Sonus towels still in the bag, that I got in after I decided to switch to cotton.

My game plan on cotton was simple. Watch the weekly circulars from the big box department stores and buy the large plush 100% cotton towels. Wash with fabric softener, dry with dryer sheets, trim the borders and cut to 20x20 squares. Shake or snap vigorously to remove linting from the cutting process. Use, then never touch paint again.

However, after reading TD's post, I will do more testing due to the fact that my cotton 20x20 are one-time paint use only. I have a custom '71 truck, metallic blue, that I'm doing Tuesday, to try this out on.
I get cotton towels in 25 pound boxes at a local janitorial supply for about $30.

One day I looked up the address of every detail supply or auto body and paint supply store in my area then drove to each one asking if they had 70/30 microfiber towels. The ones that said yes to my question sold a pack of towels to me. Over the next few detail jobs I tested all these towels out after the final finishing pass on a few dark colored cars and observed the performance of the towels. The 2 winners were a plush purple 70/30 made in China for $10.95 for a 4 pack, and the other was a red not as plush 70/30 made in China for $18.99 for a 12 pack.

I went with the red ones and when I get down to about 6 new red towels left, I drive over and score an additional two 12 packs. I always have them and only use them for finish wiping once before demoting them to the other stuff bin.

The system works well for me and I never have to re polish because of towel induced marring.

[FUNX650]

I prefer cotton towels over MF towels on paint...
But...Care should be taken when using any "towel"...especially those made from polyamide/polyester.

:)

Bob

[Vegas Transplant]

Thanks TD, great advice again hand, as usual.
I was getting my MF's from a supplier out of Jacksonville 70/30 & 75/25 right at $15/dozen + shipping. So I still have oodles of used mf's that do get used somewhere every job.

I don't know this area well but @ $30 you can bet that I'll check it out hand.

[lokerola]

TD, great advice hand. I did not do this in my testing phase back in January.
I've got brand new Sonus towels still in the bag, that I got in after I decided to switch to cotton.

My game plan on cotton was simple. Watch the weekly circulars from the big box department stores and buy the large plush 100% cotton towels. Wash with fabric softener, dry with dryer sheets, trim the borders and cut to 20x20 squares. Shake or snap vigorously to remove linting from the cutting process. Use, then never touch paint again.

However, after reading TD's post, I will do more testing due to the fact that my cotton 20x20 are one-time paint use only. I have a custom '71 truck, metallic blue, that I'm doing Tuesday, to try this out on. Vegas, I'm confused.. you said "Use, then never touch paint again." Are you saying these are one-use only? I must be missing something here as this can't very economical.

[Vegas Transplant]

TD,

My game plan on cotton was simple. Watch the weekly circulars from the big box department stores and buy the large plush 100% cotton towels. Wash with fabric softener, dry with dryer sheets, trim the borders and cut to 20x20 squares. Shake or snap vigorously to remove linting from the cutting process. Use, then never touch paint again
.


It does get expensive hand...but so does $15 for 1 20x20 or 24x24. Or whatever you guys are paying. But thanks to TD I will adapt my process to last step buffing.
If you feel comfortable with MF's then keep with it. Far be it from me to suggest this to you or anyone else on the forum. That's the reason that I bumped the cotton vs. mf thread earlier.
Have a great week hand!

There are many other uses-just not paint. Actually I haven't tried rewashing and reusing on paint because of all the labor involved, but my past experience says not to .