Paint, Soft or Hard, by Make

[kimtyson]

I hear a lot about how soft, or hard, paint is. I couldn't find a thread about this subject and thought it would be good to put it all in one place. So, generally speaking, what vehicle make has hard, or soft, paint? Also, how does clearcoat factor into this?Thanks.

[FUNX650]

I hear a lot about how soft, or hard, paint is. I couldn't find a thread about this subject and thought it would be good to put it all in one place. So, generally speaking, what vehicle make has hard, or soft, paint? Also, how does clearcoat factor into this?Thanks.

Unless the paint is a single-stage, you are working with the top-most clear-coat paint-film....and it's softness/hardness factor.

Mr. Phillips had some timely input about this subject in his: Post#10 in this thread:

http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/tricks-tips-techniques/30014-tips-clear-coat-hardness.html

Bob

[Flash Gordon]

Clearcoat is what makes it difficult. You never actually polish the paint unless your working with a single stage paintjob

I've also seen some makes that are extremally difficult to work with one day, and then get a car identical later on that turns out easy. BMW is notorious for this IMO

As a general rule Audi & Infiniti have difficult clear. Honda has the easiest IMO

[kimtyson]

Unless the paint is a single-stage, you are working with the top-most clear-coat paint-film....and it's softness/hardness factor.

Mr. Phillips had some timely input about this subject in his: Post#10 in this thread:

http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/tricks-tips-techniques/30014-tips-clear-coat-hardness.html

Bob

Thanks for that. I should have searched for "clearcoat hardness" and not "paint hardness". Maybe I would have found it. So, if I get the drift, the paint hardness is a misnomer. It is clearcoat hardness and there is really no clearcut rule on how hard it will be.


Clearcoat is what makes it difficult. You never actually polish the paint unless your working with a single stage paintjob

I've also seen some makes that are extremally difficult to work with one day, and then get a car identical later on that turns out easy. BMW is notorious for this IMO

As a general rule Audi & Infiniti have difficult clear. Honda has the easiest IMO

Appreciate the input.

Does this mean I should start to ignore what people post about hard or soft paint? Seems that every vehicle is unique, if I am understanding what you guys are saying.

[embolism]

you can have a general idea by make i.e. american and european cars have harder clear, japanese cars have softer clear, but that's why you should always do a test spot.

[JBL]

As a general rule Audi & Infiniti have difficult clear. Honda has the easiest IMO

Easy vs difficult here means...?

(2008 Honda in desparate need of correction is why I ask)

[VW 91]

Easy vs difficult here means...?

(2008 Honda in desparate need of correction is why I ask)


Because Honda's have soft clear but they are easier to finish down. Infiniti's have soft clear also, but can be a pain to finish down sometimes.

[FUNX650]

Thanks for that. I should have searched for "clearcoat hardness" and not "paint hardness". Maybe I would have found it. So, if I get the drift, the paint hardness is a misnomer. It is clearcoat hardness and there is really no clearcut rule on how hard it will be.



Appreciate the input.

Does this mean I should start to ignore what people post about hard or soft paint? Seems that every vehicle is unique, if I am understanding what you guys are saying.

I don't ignore others' input in regards to this subject...therein lies some good history of their methods on varying vehicles.

As embolism (Tim)stated in his post:
"you should always do a test spot".

Since this factor has been reiterated time and time again...Is, IMHO, yet another reason to not ignore others' input on clear-coat's softness/hardness values. :)

Bob

[Mike Phillips]

There's nothing wrong with making generalizations but what really matters is when you push away from the keyboard and go out into your garage and do some testing.

I covered this topic in my e-book, there is no cut and dry answer and this topic comes up often enough that it's kind of a "warm" topic, not quite a "hot" topic.

There's all kinds of variables that have to do with paint hardness or softness, I've been told that in Asian countries they don't have as strict of rules, regulations, or laws on pollution and v.o.c. emissions and this enables them to shoot paints that cost less and the characteristic that "we" see is the paint is softer and easier to remove defects out of.

European countries and America have stricter rules, regulations and/or laws on pollution and emissions and the results "we" see when it comes to going out into your garage and working on your car is harder paints.


Now the above is just a one set of factors that affect paint hardness, I'm sure their are others but this is what I've been told by a number of colleagues in the paint side of the industry.

Guess what? Things change.



Paint or resin technology changes
Method of application changes
Total norms for manufacturing change


Things change so fast that what's true today for paint hardness or softness will be different in just months from now. So generalizations work, for example most people that have worked on a number of new Corvettes will agree the clear paint used is typically on the hard side.

Even if you have a general idea as to whether the make and model of vehicle you're buffing on has hard or soft paint, nothing beats doing some testing and dialing in a system approach that works GREAT to one small area and then once you've proven your system approach, simply duplicate this process over the rest of the car.

Assuming the same paint is on all body panels you should get similar results as long as you use the same products, process and technique throughout the project.

[Mike Phillips]

Check this thread out...

Audi Soft Paint - Making Generalizations about Hardness and Softness (http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/auto-detailing-101/31888-audi-soft-paint-making-generalizations-about-hardness-softness.html)


I have a few threads on this topic on MOL, one is really good and shares examples of extreme hardness and softness on identical cars manufactured only one year apart.

You can find it in the Hot Topics forum... there will be pictures of a silver Chrysler 300 and a dark, metallic brown Chrysler 300 and of course pictures and the story that explains everything.


:xyxthumbs: