Ultima waterless wash or optimum no rinse?

[bevans]

Looking to order one of these products, was wondering which one u guys would recommend??

[Garry Dean]

They are two completely different products. The Ultima has Polycharger which takes a few minutes to cure to give you a super slick surface. It works similarly to ONR when used as a rinseless wash, but it is slicker when used as a quick detailer.

The ONR is a really awesome product as well, but not quite as concentrated. ONR does not seem to leave any real protection behind.

If you are looking for more initial slickness, ONR is for you. If you are looking for awesome lubrication, not quite the maximum slickness, but you want the maximum of protection boosting ability while having at least the same rinseless washing ability you are looking for the Ultima Waterless wash concentrate.

Hope that helps.

[gatoman39]

Looking to order one of these products, was wondering which one u guys would recommend??
What is your intended use for the products? Rinseless wash, QD, or clay lube?

[bevans]

I was going for a rinseless wash and probably clay lube

[Garry Dean]

I was going for a rinseless wash and probably clay lube


See my previous post.

[srtnate]

I'm with Garry. I have used the ONR and I must say that is makes a good clay lube and it works good as a no rinse wash as well.

Nate

[Emm]

I have used both as a rinseless wash, and I have to say Ultima is a bit more slick. I always had used ONR, but now I use Ultima as a rinsless wash and a quick detailer. I add 1/2 oz. to my regular was bucket as well, really leaves behind a slick surface.

I would say Ultima waterless wash is my most used item out of my detail supplys

[CEE DOG]

My answer is Both.
I use UWWP more than any other product I have(allthough not for washing entire cars with) .
I use ONR for clay lube, as a 1/2 oz additive to my car wash solution, and for an occasional rinseless wash. I use to use it to remove bugs from my Sky after every drive but now that job belongs to UWWP.

Check out my Q&A and/or reviews below to get some answers about UWWP, Optimum Opti-Clean, and ONR. The (2) reviews listed are Opti-clean and UWWP. Their are two Q&A that I posted below as well as a quote on how I use a waterless wash (different then how i use a rinseless) One Q&A (very short is for the UWWP and the other is from the Opti-clean review but has some information that will give you insight about the differences between itself and ONR.

http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/product-reviews/29647-review-ultima-waterless-wash-plus.html

http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/product-reviews/28895-review-optimum-opti-clean.html


Ok, I got some new information on Ultima Waterless Wash.

I spoke with Sam Lankford today and asked him a couple questions. We spoke over the phone so I didn't get his replies word for word but my notes and memory should get us there.


Q1: Can you use Ultima Waterless Wash on interiors?
A1: Yes, you can use use UWW on interiors. This product is PH neutral and won't do any harm. I actually dilute the product about another 25% for use on interiors but there is no need to do so if you don't want to.

Q2: Does Ultima Waterless Wash contain any UV protection?
A2: Yes, it does. UWW is by no means a sealant but it does contain about 12%-15% of the same UV protection solution that you find in UPGP. Some of the reasoning behind it not containing more than that is as follows: Maintaining a neutral PH in UWW was important in its deveolpment and using more then this amount of the UV protection solution could affect the ease of application/removal.




A member of AG messaged me about some things which caused me to realize my method has changed from what I described in this review.


This is the method I use on my Sky if I want to remove a couple days of dust after it sits in the garage. If you car sits outside and has moisture contacting it the dust is no longer dust (but partially bonded material) and a waterless wash may not be the correct solution.

The biggest change in my method is to complete an entire panel at one time. One of the reasons is I don't want to re-contaminate my towel or clean section.

I thought I would post this portion of my reply to the pm.

Currently my method is this: I spray 1 panel down with UWWP. Then I take my mf towel and drag very lightly with no pressure whatsoever in straight lines. After a drag or two I flip the towel to a fresh side and repeat till the panel is complete. This first step is intended to remove all of the very loose dust and contamination.

Next I take a fresh towel or fresh side of a towel and start over on that same panel but this time I apply gentle pressure... just enough to get the remainder of the UWW residue off. If you have very soft paint then you could try spraying the panel again before this gentle pressure step. This second step is intended to get any and all dust and contamination that wasn't picked up on the first pass.

Lastly I once again start over but this time with a dry towel. You might subsitute a dry towel for one with just a spray or two of UWW for lubrication if you have marr happy paint. This 3rd step is intended to remove any streaking or residue from the over application of waterless wash solution.



Below is a response from Dr. David Ghodoussi of Optimum. He gave some very thorough responses which I really appreciated. Black print shows my questions and blue print shows Dr. G's answers.

Hi Corey,
Thank you for joining the Optimum forum and for using the Optimum Car Care products. I do remember our conversation about No Rinse at Detailfest and I appreciate that you decided to try it out since then. I appreciate also your thorough review of Opti-Clean and I will try to do the same in answering your questions below.


1. - For what reason would someone not just use ONR in the place of OOC for the purpose of cleaning paint. What I mean is: When a car is at the stage where OOC would be a good solution for cleaning, why not use ONR in a spray bottle and MF towels to achieve the same result?

No Rinse used as a quick detailer works fine for a car with light dust while Opti-Clean can be used on a car with several days of build up. The reason is that Opti-Clean contains the same polymers in No Rinse that encapsulate dirt but at a much higher concentration than No Rinse QD as well as other polymers not used in No rinse that offer more lubricity and gloss.

2A.- Will Opti Clean have any negative affects on looks, durability, or protection if a sealant or wax is applied directly after using it? Context: Someone has washed their car at night and decided to come back to it in the morning to seal. Because of the condensation on their vehicle they decide to wipe it down with Opti Clean before sealing.
2B.- Same question for ONR
2C.- Same question for OID

Based on the chemistry of these products (Opti-Clean, No rinse, Instant Detailer), there should be no bonding issues or affects on the longevity of waxes or sealants when you use these products before or after application of waxes or sealants. The protective film these products leave behind is dissolved and removed by the chemical solvents and abrasives used in waxes or sealants. None of these products contain detergents or solvents to remove waxes or sealants and therefore they only add protection not remove them.

3A. - What are the finer points of reasoning on the ONR directions stating to use a MF towel rather then a wash mitt or other media? I prefer using an MF towel but would like to know the reasoning behind that being specifically stated.

The reason we recommend Microfiber towels is that there are anywhere from 50,000 pores per square inch for an average microfiber to 200,000 pores per square inch for a very plush Microfiber towel. These pores are active sites to trap dirt and remove it from the surface. Therefore you get a much greater cleaning and protecting effect from a microfiber towel than a wool mitt, etc. The towels we offer are on the upper end of the range I mentioned. The only draw back when using a Microfiber towel as the wash media is that it is hard to remove the dirt that is trapped by No Rinse from the towel unless you use a strong detergent like Power Clean.
Another great wash media is a soft sponge (minimum 80 PPI) that works great for washing with No Rinse. The advantages of sponge over Microfiber is that dirt particles can get adsorbed into the sponge and away from the surface. We are working with a foam manufacturer to develop a mitt that not only is safe and gentle for the automotive paint but also has good cleaning and dirt release properties. Once we complete all the testing and development, we will make this new foam mitt available to help make the wash process with Optimum No Rinse easier.

4. - What is the main difference in OOC and ONR? What I mean is: Is their something interesting you can point to that wouldn't require us to be chemists to understand? Such as: Do they have a much different PH? Does one contain much more protective polymers then the other? Which has a stronger cleaning ability if used in the same way?

While both of these products are pH neutral, Opti-Clean contains much higher levels of polymers than No Rinse as well as some new polymers that we developed for this type of application. The added polymers are necessary to compensate for using a fraction of the water as compared to a regular No Rinse wash.

5.- Do the polymers in OOC have any level of UV protection in them?

You do get some level of UV protection from the reflection effects as well as some sacrificial UV protection (the polymers breaking down rather than the paint). But for UV protection, you need specific compounds designed to block UV light. The main product we offer for exterior application that provides the most UV protection is Optimum Car Wax which contains these specific chemicals to block UV light.

Please let me know if I can be of further assistance. Thanks again.
Best Regards,
David,

[Crazy Amos]

Onr

[Old Tiger]

I was going for a rinseless wash and probably clay lube
If this is what you want , no doubt ONR is the answer, It is much cheaper as an RW if you buy a gallon and ime uww+ IS TOO SLICK FOR A CLAY LUBE. btw i DIDNT USED TO THINK that was possible! But Ive seen it and Mike has said it!

[bluegoose]

I have to say ONR for an all around product. I seem to use it for just about everything (clay lube, rinseless wash, QD, spot cleaner, etc). I really need to try UWWP+ too as I've been dabbling in waterless washing lately and hear this works great for that. Good luck. //bluegoose//

[bevans]

Well I ended up ordering both uwwp and onr. And somehow I managed to order 2 uwwp on accident haha so hopefully I like the stuff.


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[Kaleb G.]

Well I ended up ordering both uwwp and onr. And somehow I managed to order 2 uwwp on accident haha so hopefully I like the stuff.


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I used it for the first time yesterday and loved it. I live I'm an apartment and don't have access to a hose, so as long as the truck isnt too dirty this will be what I use.

[Garry Dean]

UWWC is really good stuff. It works very well for its intended purpose, a waterless wash. It also works very well as a quick detailer at the WW dilution.

I have been testing it out as a rinseless wash and I have found that it works best at 2oz to 3 gallons of water.

I have tried it at .5oz, 1oz, 1.5oz, 2oz and it seems that if you use more you get more lubricity.

When you use ONR @ 1oz to 3gal you really see the water sheet when you wipe a panel, but in my testing it takes more UWWC to get similar lubricity. Not that its good or bad, but UWWC was designed to be a WW, but can be used as a rinseless wash.

I can say that as a rinseless wash UWWC works best on a well maintained vehicle.

[bevans]

Thanks for all the info Garry, I appreciate it. And thanks to everyone else who also chimed in.