I need some help...

[Tom Weed]

Okay, a couple of months ago I detailed a white Caddy Escalade for a lady who lives here in town, her husband owns 4 Rolls Royces and wants me to detail one of them, but with the stipulation that I do all the polishing by hand, no machines. I've only seen the car from a distance and can't tell the true condition of the paint. Is there a video somewhere that say Mike Phillips or someone else using a DA polisher and showing how safe it is that I can direct this gentlemen to? I'd love to have the opportunity to work on his cars, but not sure about doing them by hand... Any advice or tips would be greatly appreciated...

Thanks,
Tom

[LegacyGT]

There are some videos from DF, and others that I have seen where he polishes his hand to prove they are safe. Here is mike holding on to a DA while it is running ...
http://www.smugmug.com/Cars/Detail-Fest-2011/IMG5624/1229359258_AK7Ug-L-2.jpg

I'll see if I can find the videos later tonight if someone else has not already found them.

[LegacyGT]

Try starting here: http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/autogeek-s-detailfest-info/34895-watch-now-detailfest-saturday-sunday-classes-live-broadcast.html

[Tom Weed]

Try starting here: http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/autogeek-s-detailfest-info/34895-watch-now-detailfest-saturday-sunday-classes-live-broadcast.html


Thank you so much! I totally understand this gentleman's concern, but didn't know how to go about explaining safe machine polishing to him.

Thanks!

[maximus20895]

Those are the videos I was looking for!

[richy]

Tom, yes it would be nice to work on a Roller. But, what's most important, in my opinion is that you run your own show. You know polishing with a DA will break down the polishes properly and do a great job. He either trusts you and your judgement to do the job with the utmost care of his vehicle, or he doesn't. You do it your way or not at all. That would be my position and it is non-negotiable. Nobody tells me what tools to use. That's why they are paying me: for my expertise. Don't be afraid to A) lose the job or B) stand up for your principles. When someone else f*cks it up by doing a bad job by hand, he can come back to you. Or not. Who cares. People will judge the final result and won't want to hear "Oh, he insisted I do it by hand". Non-negotiable.

[LegacyGT]

I would try to educate the client first. It could be that he just needs to understand the process better, and he is naturally protective of his rolls. Better to explain the process and alleviate any concerns ahead of time. Much like a doctor would explain a procedure before actually performing it on you. I have never had a doctor tell me 'my way or the highway' when I asked questions about treatment (and they are experts), they welcomed my questions and concerns so I could better understand the process and be comfortable.

Knowing when to cut & run is a valuable skill, but probably not the best first reaction to have.

[Y2KSVT]

Tom, yes it would be nice to work on a Roller. But, what's most important, in my opinion is that you run your own show. You know polishing with a DA will break down the polishes properly and do a great job. He either trusts you and your judgement to do the job with the utmost care of his vehicle, or he doesn't. You do it your way or not at all. That would be my position and it is non-negotiable. Nobody tells me what tools to use. That's why they are paying me: for my expertise. Don't be afraid to A) lose the job or B) stand up for your principles. When someone else f*cks it up by doing a bad job by hand, he can come back to you. Or not. Who cares. People will judge the final result and won't want to hear "Oh, he insisted I do it by hand". Non-negotiable.


Couldn't have said it better myself. If he wants it done by hand, I assume he has two of them at the end of his arms. See how thrilled he is about polishing an entire Rolls by hand after he gets done with one fender. I certainly don't tell my dentist which tools to use on my teeth; I certainly wouldn't want someone telling me how to run my business. If educating him doesn't work; I'd personally walk away since you might not physically be able to after hand polishing one of his cars!

Mark

[embolism]

I remember seeing a video where Mike turned the machine on then put his hand on the hood and put the pad on his hand... couldn't find it though

If you used a machine to do his wife's car then I would explain that you couldn't get it to look that way without the machine. It would take much longer, it would cost much more, and the result by hand would probably still not be on par with the machine results.

If after that, he still wants you to do it by hand, then explain to him that you'll just wash, clay, do a paint cleaner, and hand wax it and charge him accordingly...

[AeroCleanse]

Bring you polisher and do the demo Mike does in front of him. If he still refuses to let you use one, do a test spot with something like Dodo Juice Lime Prime by hand.

If Lime Prime by hand doesn't fix the issues, tell the owner, sorry but I can't correct it without using a machine. If LP does fix it, do it all by hand and charge them appropriately.

[JSMet]

My feeling is that this individual may be like I once was when I thought of machine polishing: I heard horror stories that went back 15 to 20 years about rotary polishers in the hands of inexperienced users damaging paint. I now know better, hopefully you can convince this person that as a professional you will not do anything that will negatively affect his vehicle's finish. Good luck.

[Tom Weed]

Tom, yes it would be nice to work on a Roller. But, what's most important, in my opinion is that you run your own show. You know polishing with a DA will break down the polishes properly and do a great job. He either trusts you and your judgement to do the job with the utmost care of his vehicle, or he doesn't. You do it your way or not at all. That would be my position and it is non-negotiable. Nobody tells me what tools to use. That's why they are paying me: for my expertise. Don't be afraid to A) lose the job or B) stand up for your principles. When someone else f*cks it up by doing a bad job by hand, he can come back to you. Or not. Who cares. People will judge the final result and won't want to hear "Oh, he insisted I do it by hand". Non-negotiable.




I would try to educate the client first. It could be that he just needs to understand the process better, and he is naturally protective of his rolls. Better to explain the process and alleviate any concerns ahead of time. Much like a doctor would explain a procedure before actually performing it on you. I have never had a doctor tell me 'my way or the highway' when I asked questions about treatment (and they are experts), they welcomed my questions and concerns so I could better understand the process and be comfortable.

Knowing when to cut & run is a valuable skill, but probably not the best first reaction to have.


Couldn't have said it better myself. If he wants it done by hand, I assume he has two of them at the end of his arms. See how thrilled he is about polishing an entire Rolls by hand after he gets done with one fender. I certainly don't tell my dentist which tools to use on my teeth; I certainly wouldn't want someone telling me how to run my business. If educating him doesn't work; I'd personally walk away since you might not physically be able to after hand polishing one of his cars!

Mark


I remember seeing a video where Mike turned the machine on then put his hand on the hood and put the pad on his hand... couldn't find it though

If you used a machine to do his wife's car then I would explain that you couldn't get it to look that way without the machine. It would take much longer, it would cost much more, and the result by hand would probably still not be on par with the machine results.

If after that, he still wants you to do it by hand, then explain to him that you'll just wash, clay, do a paint cleaner, and hand wax it and charge him accordingly...


Bring you polisher and do the demo Mike does in front of him. If he still refuses to let you use one, do a test spot with something like Dodo Juice Lime Prime by hand.

If Lime Prime by hand doesn't fix the issues, tell the owner, sorry but I can't correct it without using a machine. If LP does fix it, do it all by hand and charge them appropriately.


Thanks a lot everyone, I appreciate the advice!!! I am going to email him the link that LegacyGT posted on Mike at Detailfest showing how safe the DA is, then offer to stop over on my way after work and show him the machine and ask if I can do a test spot. My gf works for them and I would like the opportunity to gain his trust before walking away, although if it comes down to doing it by hand, I would probably use an like Polyseal and top it with Optimum spray wax and tell him I will not be able to remove defects and polish the car like it deserves to be.

Aero: I used a rotary with 205 and a LC tang pad on his wifes vehicle, I think that would scare him and seeing the what kind of car it is, I totally understand where he is coming from.

[ScubaCougr]

If it comes down to doing it by hand, I would probably use an like Polyseal and top it with Optimum spray wax and tell him I will not be able to remove defects and polish the car like it deserves to be.

If he's still skeptical of the DA, this might be the best route. And maybe it's dropping a tool or accidentally banging trim that is his concern, not paint scratches.

Proving you didn't put that scratch/blemish/boo-boo in his car could be pretty impossible and I'd hate to consider what a repaint on a Rolls would cost.

Sometimes walking away is the smarter idea.