Finishing polish needed?

[Trevor]

Hello everyone and thanks in advance for any suggestions. I'm completely new to detailing and have been reading/watching videos on AGO. Last summer, I clayed my black Escape and then applied some Meguiars 21. It was very easy to use and gave fantastic reflection. However, I also noticed a ton of swirling and light scratches all over the vehicle that appeared amplified.

This year, I'm buying the Porter Cable 7424xp and am going to to get those swirls out and make it shine. Here is what I am planning and please let me know if a step is not necessary:

1. Wash/dry.
2. clay (I figured this would be necessary again, but I'll feel first)
3. Use meg's swirl x first and see if that gets the swirls/scratches out. If not, I'll use ultimate compound, followed by swirlx. Both by DA.
4. Here is my first big question. I had planned on following the swirlx with the megs 21 sealant at this step. But in watching the PC overview by Mike P, I think he used a finishing polish after the swirl remover. Do I need a finishing polish after swirlx and before megs 21? If so, which one?
5. After the megs 21, I'm topping with poorboys natty blue wax. I know its not necessary, but some people's pics on here of the wax on top of the sealant looked really good to my eye. So I'll give it a try.


Additional questions:

The pads confuse me as they give the same description on some (i.e., can be used with polishing, applying waxes..) The PC kit I'm ordering off of AGO has Lake Country pads. Can anyone give me some advice on which ones to use for my above steps? Their orange pad says to use for spot repair of swirls, should I use the white instead with the swirlx/UC? My head is spinning with pad choices.

Finally, is there a wait time needed between any of my steps above? Somewhere I read something about needing to wait at least an hour after using a sealant before wax?

Sorry for packing in the questions, I really did read a ton on here first to try and avoid silly ones, but this is all the further I could narrow them down to! :laughing:

[termigator]

Hello and welcome.

The steps you have mapped out sounds good. You should use SwirlX with the white polishing pad. If you still have swirls, then try the Ultimate Compound with the orange pad. The orange pad has more cut than the white pad. Remember, always go light before going with a heavier cut. Whether you need to follow up with a finishing polish is up to you. You may be happy with the results of the SwirlX. If you want, you can use SwirlX as a finishing polish by using it with a finishing pad (gray pad)

It is advisable to wait about 24 hours between an application of sealant and an application of wax because the sealant needs time to cure. If you were applying a wax over a wax, you would not need to wait.

[Trevor]

Thanks for the reply termigator. I'm thinking about adding Poorboys Black Hole after the SwirlX now, and then sealing with 21, followed by natty blue wax. I just put the order in today. Can't wait to get all the stuff.

[termigator]

I just used Black Hole with a gray finishing pad on one of my cars, a red Prelude. I definitely noticed a difference afterwards. Underneath the fluorescent lights in my garage, it appeared to look wetter than before. It should do the same for your black Escape. Good luck!

[Mike Moore]

...But in watching the PC overview by Mike P, I think he used a finishing polish after the swirl remover.
Do I need a finishing polish after swirlx and before megs 21? If so, which one?...

I might recommend using using Menzerma PO85 before Black Hole then seal with #21.

Wait 12-24 hours hours before applying anything on top of Meguiar's M21 Mirror Glaze Synthetic Sealant 2.0
I might suggest instead of "topping" Meguiar's NEW M21 Sealant 2.0 w/wax just apply another coat of M21.

[Mike Phillips]

But in watching the PC overview by Mike P, I think he used a finishing polish after the swirl remover.


That's correct. It's normal for "Car Enthusiasts", loosely described in this context as someone trying to create a show car finish on whatever it is they are working on to do more than one step during the correction steps to really get a nice looking finish. Thus after doing the initial swirl removal step a person would then switch to a less aggressive pad and product and do some "Finish Polishing" to really refine the surface and maximize gloss and clarity before applying the wax or paint sealant.



Their orange pad says to use for spot repair of swirls, should I use the white instead with the swirlx/UC? My head is spinning with pad choices.


Think of pads as "tools", you use the right tool for the job and in order to be equipped to tackle a variety of jobs, (paint conditions), you need a variety of pads.

A good starting collection would include,


Orange light cutting pads
White polishing pads
Finishing pads, in the Lake Country line that would be Gray, which some people refer to as Black. Or get some blue or red foam pads. To me, for most people on most cars, once you get to the last machine step any of these pads, black, blue or red, are going to do what you want them to do.

Here's a thread I wrote to helps people with the first generation Porter Cable polishers to get the best results out of using them but in reality, the tips and techniques listed work for ALL DA Polishers and the thread has LOTS of pictures of all your pad options with links to the store.


How to maximize the ability of the 1st Generation Porter Cable Dual Action Polishers (http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/how-articles/27166-how-maximize-ability-1st-gen-porter-cable-dual-action-polishers.html)

Here's just a few examples from the thread...

5.5" CCS Pads (http://www.autogeek.net/lake-country-ccs-pack1.html)
http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/data/811/CCSPads01.jpg

http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/data/804/5_0BackingPlates07.jpg


:)

[Trevor]

I might recommend using using Menzerma PO85 before Black Hole then seal with #21.




I might suggest instead of "topping" Meguiar's NEW M21 Sealant 2.0 w/wax just apply another coat of M21.

Wow, that is some expensive stuff there! Is there anything else you recommend? I've read good reviews on the PO85 you mentioned, but it seems hard to find and pricey.

Well actually last year I did two coats of M21. Very shiny, but I felt it lacked the "depth". Thus, why I was going to put poorboys natty blue on top of the M21.

One last thing, and I can't believe I forgot to ask this already. I was dumb and left the M21 in the garage this past winter. It definitely froze at some point. Should I just scrap it, I know meg's says if it freezes it will affect the liquid sealant.

And if so, any opinions on whether I should keep the M21 or switch to something different? I liked how easy M21 was to use and thought it provided great shine.

[Trevor]

Thanks for the pads tips Mike. The kit I ordered gave me five choices so I went two orange, two white, one gray, with two free smaller red ones. Then I added a blue, a gray, and a gold "jeweling" one. I wanted to have options to play with!

[termigator]

Thanks for the pads tips Mike. The kit I ordered gave me five choices so I went two orange, two white, one gray, with two free smaller red ones. Then I added a blue, a gray, and a gold "jeweling" one. I wanted to have options to play with!

What did you get for your free sample? They offer Wolfgang Deep Gloss Sealant 3.0 samples. You could use that instead of M21. I have used both and I thought Wolfgang was a lot better than M21. Don't know how freezing would affect M21 (It rarely gets that cold here in FL), but that would be the perfect excuse to get something else!

[Mike Moore]

Wow, that is some expensive stuff there! Is there anything else you recommend? I've read good reviews on the PO85 you mentioned, but it seems hard to find and pricey.

AG carries PO85rd and yes, sadly it does not come in a 16oz size.

Are you already using Ultimate Compound?

To start out, you may wish to follow through with the Megs Ultimate Trio.
Ultimate Compound, Ultimate Polish & Ultimate Wax (UWax comes in liquid or paste).
Ultimate Compound and Ultimate Polish are based on the M105/M205 technology.
In a lot of cases, these three products should be able to obtain an excellent finish.

I prefer the UWax liquid. I can apply it with a DA and a black or blue pad in under 15mins.
I have done just these three products and three steps and achieved outstanding results.

UC/Orange
UP/White
UW/Black


I also noticed a ton of swirling and light scratches all over the vehicle that appeared amplified.

Preperation is the key!
If you don't correct the swirls first then when your'e done you'll have really shiny swirls!!!
For paint correction I would suggest the new Megs MF DA cutting discs and DA Compound.

Try the UCompound w/orange pad combo first. Practice all the skills you need to learn for using a DA.
Start and stop on the paint, amount of top pressure, keeping it flat, arm speed, overlap section pass.
There is more...quantity of product on the pad, the amount of working time of the product on the pad.
IMHO the Megs trio are good products to learn how to use a DA & did I mention practice, practice, practice.

If UCompund is not removing the swirls then try Megs MF disc/DA compound. Watch the videos FIRST!

[Trevor]

Thanks for the advice merlin. And thanks to everyone for your help, I've decided on the following:

1. Wash, clay if needed.
2. Test SwirlX and white pad. Use more aggressive pad or Ultimate compound if swirls are stubborn. Follow UC with swirlx if it was used.
3. Follow with finishing polish, Menzerna PO85.
4. Follow with PB's Black Hole.
5. Follow with Wolfgang's 3.0 sealant.
6. Let cure for at least 12 hours.
7. Follow with poorboys natty blue wax.
8 Take lots of pictures! : )

I'll post the pics up here after I do it. Hopefully next weekend will be nice!

[R/TED]

Looks like a nice plan, good luck. Don't forget pictures when done.