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Mike Phillips
10-28-2010, 11:19 AM
Tape it off and avoid a lifetime of ugly... (http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/tricks-tips-techniques/29951-tape-off-avoid-lifetime-ugly.html)


So many times in my life when I've buffed out a classic car, when I first get to the car and inspect it I find compound and polish residue splattered into impossible to reach areas.

A good example of this is the fresh air intake grill usually right before the front of the windshield.

Here's an example, the 1969 El Camino I used for this article on Dampsanding,

Damp-Sanding Tools, Tips and Techniques by Mike Phillips (http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/wet-sanding-cutting-buffing/25915-damp-sanding-tools-tips-techniques-mike-phillips.html)


Upon inspecting the paint I found the typical ugly compound and polish residue splattered inside the fresh air grill left by the guy that buffed the paint out before me.

Here's the 1969 El Camino...
http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/data/834/DampSanding75.jpg


Here's the ugly part...
http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/data/722/TapeOffGrill05.jpg


Because the bottom side of the sheet metal where the slots are stamped out are rough and jagged, all the compound and polish residue that was splattered by the rotary buffer has embedded like cement and will be very difficult to fully remove, especially now that it's a few years old...


Close-up...
http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/data/722/TapeOffGrill06.jpg



So while this is a very beautiful 1969 El Camino, every time someone looks at the hood area from the side of the car their eyes will be drawn to the very apparent white compound and polish residue that is encrusted where it's hard to reach and remove.


The first thing I did upon finding the compound splatter inside the grill was to point it out to the owner so he would know that I didn't create the problem and then while he was standing there, I took photos of the crusty splatter so that it was established that the splatter was there before I ever worked on the car.

This is a good best practice for your own detailing business because you don't want to get blamed for The Other Guy's Wax or TOGW

TOGW = The Other Guy's Wax (http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/hot-topics-frequently-asked-questions/21283-togw-other-guy-s-wax.html)



So here's a tip...
Before machine polishing any vehicle with areas that will be hard and even impossible to detail (http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/tricks-tips-techniques/22285-polishing-paint-polishing-paint-detailing-getting-wax-out-cracks.html) later should any compound or polish residue be splattered into these areas is to take a few moments to tape, cover and protect these areas from splatter before starting.

For example, here at Autogeek's Show Car Garage we are regularly asked to test out upcoming products for many of the manufactures we represent and then file a report with our results and observations. Yesterday I had 4 different products from 3 different manufactures to test that involved machine sanding and using a rotary buffer.

My test vehicle was our in-house 1964 Ford Falcon which has extreme orange peel, so it offers plenty of real-estate for testing a variety of different products.

As far as I can tell this car has never been machine polished, either before it was repainted nor after it was repainted because there are no signs whatsoever of splatter underneath the fresh air intake grill.

I'm not going to be the first person to get splatter into this area so before starting the testing I simply taped the grill off using a brand new masking tape made especially for use on automotive paints.


Meguiars Professional Masking Tape (http://www.autogeek.net/meguiars-masking-tapes.html)


Taping off areas like this takes just a little time in the beginning of a detailing project as compared to the massive amount of time it will take to try to remove any splatter after the project is finished. And in some cases, it's all but impossible to remove splatter residue in hard to reach areas, so taping off and covering up ensures no splatter and protects your customer's car's appearance and your reputation.

Zero splatter under the grill of this 1964 Ford Falcon
http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/data/722/TapeOffGrill01.jpg

http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/data/722/TapeOffGrill02.jpg

http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/data/722/TapeOffGrill03.jpg


Meguiar's Professional Masking Tape
http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/data/722/TapeOffGrill04.jpg


After the sanding and buffing, remove the tape and no spatter... no ugly... no worries...

http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/data/722/TapeOffGrill00.jpg


On the Autogeek.net Store...Meguiars Professional Masking Tape (http://www.autogeek.net/meguiars-masking-tapes.html)


:)
BobbyG
10-28-2010, 11:21 AM
Great reminder!

I can not emphasize this enough!
GTPpilot
10-28-2010, 11:26 AM
Learned this the hardway !! Much easier to mask than to deal with removing wax from plastic and rubber trim as well.
richy
10-28-2010, 11:31 AM
I'm sorry, granted I have a twisted little mind, but when I read the title about avoiding a lifetime of ugly....I thought there was going to be a condom reference here:poke: (would equally apply to me too Mike, no personal attack here bud)
Kurt_s
10-28-2010, 11:31 AM
Great point. Cleaning up mistakes is PITA and better to do it right the first time.

Since I'm sure others are thinking the same thing, how did you polish the paint below the tape?
Mike Phillips
10-28-2010, 11:56 AM
Great point. Cleaning up mistakes is PITA and better to do it right the first time.

Since I'm sure others are thinking the same thing, how did you polish the paint below the tape?

Usually either by carefully machine waxing during the last steps or by hand.

I actually wrote a detailed answer to this question in one of the first write-ups I posted to this forum after moving to Autogeek from Meguiar's.

Step-by-Step How-To Article using Pinnacle Products with the new PC 7424XP (http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/how-articles/19994-2008-lexus-250-pinnacle-detail.html)





Here we've taped-off the rubber gasket between the glass and the window frame and I'm pointing to show that there's about an 1/8th of an inch of paint that's not going to get buffed with either of the two polishing steps. After the correction steps we'll remove the tape and carefully wax these areas for a uniform look that will match the polished areas next to the tape line.

While not perfectionist detailing in some eyes, remember this is a daily driver, not a show car.

You can invest more time and just run the tape down the rubber and get it close to the edge of the panel if you want or just overhang a little like I did here. It's your choice based upon what you're trying to accomplish and how much time you want to invest.
http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/data/723/detail-141.jpg




Another factor that will affect how much time you want to invest into the "little picture" is how much you're charing for your work. Doing fine detailing to small areas is very time consuming and most detailers already struggling charging as much as they want to get...


But that's what I do... I major on the majors... and minor on the minors unless someone is willing to pay for the time it takes to minor on the minors...


:)
AndrewBall
10-28-2010, 12:00 PM
such good advice. like an idiot this past weekend i missed a spot while taping stuff off (i was in a rush working by myself with 6 hours to do a full correciton on a boxster :help:) afterwards i noticed and i spent close to an hour cleaning it out.
Kurt_s
10-28-2010, 12:13 PM
such good advice. like an idiot this past weekend i missed a spot while taping stuff off (i was in a rush working by myself with 6 hours to do a full correciton on a boxster :help:) afterwards i noticed and i spent close to an hour cleaning it out.
I've been down that road more than once too. You'd think that I would learn my lesson?
Kurt_s
10-28-2010, 12:15 PM
Usually either by carefully machine waxing during the last steps or by hand.

I actually wrote a detailed answer to this question in one of the first write-ups I posted to this forum after moving to Autogeek from Meguiar's.

Step-by-Step How-To Article using Pinnacle Products with the new PC 7424XP (http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/how-articles/19994-2008-lexus-250-pinnacle-detail.html)


:)

Thanks Mike!
AeroCleanse
10-28-2010, 12:19 PM
Or use water based compounds / polishes, makes cleanup much faster.
Mike Phillips
10-28-2010, 05:26 PM
Or use water based compounds / polishes, makes cleanup much faster.


Great idea... for some applications... :xyxthumbs:

Most body shop products are formulated for just this reason, but I personally still wouldn't want to have to blast water down the fresh air intake of someone else's car or any other place to remove polish splatter...

Plus then you would have to decide if you're going to do this before the LSP step or after the LSP step. I've done this before, that is wash a car after all the grunt work is done and then finish it off but for me I would rather tape-off then re-wet the car.

Risk of Rust
Plus a lot of antique and/or classic cars the owner doesn't want you getting it wet because water will get into places that can't be dried and that creates a rust issue that many owners of classics don't want to risk.

Blasting compound or polish residue off new cars like a Honda or a Hyundai? Go for it... Most new cars don't have fresh air grills like classic cars referenced in this thread.

Everyone can find the way that works best for them and their own style... this article was just a suggestion for those looking for a solution or alternative to what they're currently doing.


:)
Mike Phillips
10-29-2010, 09:32 AM
I spoke with Mike Pennington, the Director of Training for Meguiar's about some of the cool features for the new Meguiar's Tape and have summarized our conversation below...

The new Meguiar's Masking is really designed to be a great general purpose tape which lends itself well to use in the detailing world.

Product Attributes:

Excellent handling
Instant adhesion and good holding power
Resists curling and lifting
Solvent and moisture resistant
Ideal for automotive detail application



Normal painter's tape, usually the blue or green tape we commonly see and use when taping-off a car, is a fantastic tape, it is really an overkill from a design perspective for the detailing market.

Normal painter's tape is purposefully constructed for application where a wet edge (critical edge) is present, that is where fresh paint is being applied and for this reason one of its main features is designed to prevent bleed-through. That is to say that painter’s tape is designed so that wet paint won't leak under it at the edges. This is an important feature when applying fresh paint.

When detailing cars, this is an unnecessary feature that affects price. The Meguiar's masking tape is more specific to the needs of detailing, it is safe enough to protect what you want to cover and protect from product residue but not over designed for its intended use. In addition, the Meguiar's tape has much improved adhesion performance over traditional painters tape when exposed to situations where water is present. (For example - Wet sanding)

Note that because Meguiar's tape is not designed for use where a critical edge is a factor, it is not recommended for use as an actual "Painter's Tape".

Painter's Tape and Detailing Masking Tape, different designs for different applications.

Hope this helps...

:xyxthumbs:
AeroCleanse
10-29-2010, 09:39 AM
Mike, no need to blast it with water. I use a wet MF to clean up residue, as water based compounds / polishes clean up a lot faster.
AndrewBall
10-29-2010, 09:43 AM
I spoke with Mike Pennington, the Director of Training for Meguiar's about some of the cool features for the new Meguiar's Tape and have summarized our conversation below...

When detailing cars, this is an unnecessary feature that affects price. The Meguiar's masking tape is more specific to the needs of detailing, it is safe enough to protect what you want to cover and protect from product residue but not over designed for its intended use. In addition, the Meguiar's tape has much improved adhesion performance over traditional painters tape when exposed to situations where water is present. (For example - Wet sanding)


I have noticed this as well. Great to hear my experiences confirmed!


I know when i first saw the tape i said i will just go get some form Home Depot/Lowes. WRONG! it was almost $8 a rolll there. much cheaper from AG!
Mike Phillips
10-29-2010, 09:53 AM
Mike, no need to blast it with water. I use a wet MF to clean up residue, as water based compounds / polishes clean up a lot faster.

What if the splatter is inside an area you can't wipe, like the pictures I included of the fresh air grills on classic cars, which was one of the points about covering these areas off in this article?

Zero splatter under the grill of this 1964 Ford Falconhttp://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/data/722/TapeOffGrill01.jpg


In this picture, what you don't see is all the spatter from the other guy that's down inside, under the area you could wipe by hand.


Here's the ugly part...
http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/data/722/TapeOffGrill05.jpg



Regardless... however it works for you is the best way...


As for me, I don't want a customer unhappy so I tape-off these areas that cannot be reached by hand and wiped.


:xyxthumbs: