Wax Question

[shadowstep]

I have been reading a lot about the wax and sealants. I know to apply these products in thin layers but what are the ideal number of layers that should be applied to get ideal results?

[BobbyG]

I have been reading a lot about the wax and sealants. I know to apply these products in thin layers but what are the ideal number of layers that should be applied to get ideal results?

As a general rule I apply one of each. If I'm prepping for winter here in the North East I'll go one sealant and two wax........... but that's just me...

[shadowstep]

I am located in the north east also, how do find a way to was and wax during the colder weather in winter? I can imagine that it will be hard to to keep the water from freezing.

[BobbyG]

I try do do as much when I'm home but there are those times that I need to be creative!

If one of my vehicles need a bath and it's too cold here's what I do.

Home

I mix up a 5 gallon bucket of hot water, my favorite car wash then pop the top on it and in the back of the truck it goes. Included in my arsenal is a car wash brush, wash mitt, and a pair of rubber gloves.

Car Wash

Use their pressure washer with high pressure water only. This blasts allot of the grime, salt, and debris off the finish.

Next the car wash brush and my soapy solution. I wash the surface liberally cleaning it with the soapy solution dipping the brush several times so that the dirt particles fall from the bristles. Rinse the surface with high pressure water only.

Follow this up by washing the entire vehicle thoroughly with the mitt and soapy solution paying particular attention to all areas. Rinse the surface with high pressure water only and be sure to clean under the fender wells.

Home

Drive home and dry the truck in the garage. Wax the surface as needed for continued protection.

[shadowstep]

If I that at one of those wash your own car wash, then wouldn't it get dirty from the salt on the road?

[svs]

I have been reading a lot about the wax and sealants. I know to apply these products in thin layers but what are the ideal number of layers that should be applied to get ideal results?



If i'm using just a sealant I apply at least 2 layers for even coverage. If i'm using both a sealant and wax I just use 1 layer of each. Same goes for the wax if I use it as a stand alone, 2 layers.

[shadowstep]

Awesome thanks!


If i'm using just a sealant I apply at least 2 layers for
even coverage. If i'm using both a sealant and wax I just use 1 layer of each. Same goes for the wax if I use it as a stand alone, 2 layers.

[ScottB]

anything more than 2 coats is likely just wasted product = Point of Diminishing Returns

[shadowstep]

Awesome that's great to know!


anything more than 2 coats is likely just wasted product = Point of Diminishing Returns

[BobbyG]

If I that at one of those wash your own car wash, then wouldn't it get dirty from the salt on the road?

You wouldn't take your car to the car wash with the roads covered with slush, sand, and water.. Wait until the storm is over and the roads are clear and dry, then go to the car wash.

[Nira]

If i'm using just a sealant I apply at least 2 layers for even coverage. If i'm using both a sealant and wax I just use 1 layer of each. Same goes for the wax if I use it as a stand alone, 2 layers.

+1

I also do two coats

[jlb85]

This question comes up a lot, and IMO is a direct effect of the marketing around many of the products out there.

Wax or sealants do not build up. The first coat you apply will leave a thick layer over the paint. As you buff it off, the layer gets infinitesimally thin. Adding more product a second time makes the layer get very think again. But once you wipe it off, it becomes infinitesimally thin again. Sealants stick to paint, not necessarily to sealant. Further, one coat of sealant over a previous coat of sealant creates ONE coat of sealant. There is no interstitial layer between coats. There is no increase in resistance through them due to interstices. The shear strength of the product you apply is very low, and will basically shear off once it gets to a certain thickness as you buff it off. This might be at one layer thick, it could be at two layers thick. But the sealants stick to the paint and not to anything else, which is why the bead water and feel slick. Once you have an increase in the thickness of the sealant, the excess sealant, i.e. the one NOT stuck on paint, will basically bead off just like anything else you try to get to stick to the freshly finished vehicle, leaving the thinnest layer it can.

So layering stuff is good fun, but do not expect it to be any better than one thorough coat of anything. Further, the effect of layers is not cumulative. Adding a second layer of anything does not make the whole twice as durable. More layers applied over each other in a short period of time will not increase the life of the coating. More layers applied periodically though time will increase longevity from the point of view of the paint. But it is really just getting "new" LSP, so the LSP per se does not have an increased longevity.

I hope this makes sense!

So I always recommend two coats of LSP due to the fact that there is always a missed spot, which typically gets gone over during the second apply. It is much more beneficial to reapply LSP once every month than to do 3 layers and expect it to last 3 months.

Wax tends to be better to "layer", since it is thicker and doesn't really "stick" to the paint as much as it rests upon it. One should see some benefit from applying wax over sealant, but anything more than one coat of each is overkill. If you still want more layers, after sealant + wax, I would throw on some high shine QD like #425 or a spray wax. But careful, stuff like Red Mist Tropical (probably the shiniest QD out there!) will remove most waxes due to the strong solvents it contains.


This does not apply to something like Opti-Coat or A-Quartz or Nanolex, which I still haven't figured out if it layers or not. Initial testing shows good promise, but there will always be a point of diminishing returns. Still playing with it... and measuring!

[BobbyG]

So I always recommend two coats of LSP due to the fact that there is always a missed spot, which typically gets gone over during the second apply. It is much more beneficial to reapply LSP once every month than to do 3 layers and expect it to last 3 months.

Wax tends to be better to "layer", since it is thicker and doesn't really "stick" to the paint as much as it rests upon it. One should see some benefit from applying wax over sealant, but anything more than one coat of each is overkill. If you still want more layers, after sealant + wax, I would throw on some high shine QD like #425 or a spray wax.

Exactly................:props:

[shadowstep]

This question comes up a lot, and IMO is a direct effect of the marketing around many of the products out there.

Wax or sealants do not build up. The first coat you apply will leave a thick layer over the paint. As you buff it off, the layer gets infinitesimally thin. Adding more product a second time makes the layer get very think again. But once you wipe it off, it becomes infinitesimally thin again. Sealants stick to paint, not necessarily to sealant. Further, one coat of sealant over a previous coat of sealant creates ONE coat of sealant. There is no interstitial layer between coats. There is no increase in resistance through them due to interstices. The shear strength of the product you apply is very low, and will basically shear off once it gets to a certain thickness as you buff it off. This might be at one layer thick, it could be at two layers thick. But the sealants stick to the paint and not to anything else, which is why the bead water and feel slick. Once you have an increase in the thickness of the sealant, the excess sealant, i.e. the one NOT stuck on paint, will basically bead off just like anything else you try to get to stick to the freshly finished vehicle, leaving the thinnest layer it can.

So layering stuff is good fun, but do not expect it to be any better than one thorough coat of anything. Further, the effect of layers is not cumulative. Adding a second layer of anything does not make the whole twice as durable. More layers applied over each other in a short period of time will not increase the life of the coating. More layers applied periodically though time will increase longevity from the point of view of the paint. But it is really just getting "new" LSP, so the LSP per se does not have an increased longevity.

I hope this makes sense!

So I always recommend two coats of LSP due to the fact that there is always a missed spot, which typically gets gone over during the second apply. It is much more beneficial to reapply LSP once every month than to do 3 layers and expect it to last 3 months.

Wax tends to be better to "layer", since it is thicker and doesn't really "stick" to the paint as much as it rests upon it. One should see some benefit from applying wax over sealant, but anything more than one coat of each is overkill. If you still want more layers, after sealant + wax, I would throw on some high shine QD like #425 or a spray wax. But careful, stuff like Red Mist Tropical (probably the shiniest QD out there!) will remove most waxes due to the strong solvents it contains.


This does not apply to something like Opti-Coat or A-Quartz or Nanolex, which I still haven't figured out if it layers or not. Initial testing shows good promise, but there will always be a point of diminishing returns. Still playing with it... and measuring!

Great feedback! Thank you! It makes perfect sense. I am not only trying to learn and utilize techniques, but I am trying to learn the technical aspect of the products and what does or does not work. I believe having knowledge of the full aspect of detailing and the products along with the science behind it will further help me become a well informed and better detailer. So with that said thanks to all who have contributed to this, any further information is greatly appreciated!