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twistedframe
04-20-2010, 07:47 PM
So I have wet sanded several times with great results when it comes to removing scrathes, RIDS etc. However I have a car to play with that has loads of orange peel after a crappy Macco repaint. I have started to do some sanding and was wondering a few things

1. Wet sanding small scratches by hand is no problem, but it will take forever to go over this whole vehicle. What do you guys use to speed up the process? DA sander, palm sander?

2. What wet sanding paper do you prefer? I've been using 3m stuff from Lowes with pretty good results.

3. What steps would you use? 1500, 2000, 2500, 3000 or 1500, 2500, 3000?

Thanks in advance for any info and I appreciate any other tips you all might have.

It's really hard to capture on this color, but the left side is untouched and the right side is done 1500, 2000, 2500 then SIP via yellow pad on PC.

http://i119.photobucket.com/albums/o139/twistedframe512/DSC_0264-1.jpg

Also I have a Nissan frontier that is COVERED in orange peel and it is black so it shows up alot. It is the factory paint, so can I even attempt to fix this issue? It annoys me to no end, but I don't want to mess it up.

Mike Phillips
04-20-2010, 07:52 PM
You want to machine sand, actually damp-sand...

Faster overall
Les buffing
Leave more paint on the car
Buff cooler, better for the clear coat
Less work


I just finished my Power Point Presentation for this weekend's class which is,

Machine Damp Sanding & Machine Polishing

We'll be going over everything you want to do.



Hang on....



:D

twistedframe
04-20-2010, 07:54 PM
Thank you, I look forward to it!

Mike Phillips
04-20-2010, 07:54 PM
Here are a few articles with lots of pictures and links to the right products...


Wet-Sanding
*New* If it has paint... it gets polished... (http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/wet-sanding-cutting-buffing/23865-if-has-paint-gets-polished.html)
RIDS and Feathersanding - A Highly Specialized Technique by Mike Phillips (http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/tricks-tips-techniques/21469-rids-feathersanding.html)
Wet-sanding - Fresh Paint vs Factory Paint (http://www.detailcity.org/forums/wet-sanding-show-car-results/27775-wet-sanding-fresh-paint-vs-factory-paint.html)
Basic Hand Sanding Techniques (http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/wet-sanding-cutting-buffing/21974-basic-hand-sanding-techniques.html)
Removing Orange Peel & Sanding Marks with the Griot's ROP and the Wolfgang Twins (http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/wet-sanding-cutting-buffing/21463-removing-sanding-marks-griot-s-rop-wolfgang-twins.html)
How long will a half sheet of wet/dry sandpaper last before it stops cutting and you need to replace it? (http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/wet-sanding-cutting-buffing/21970-how-long-will-half-sheet-wet-dry-sandpaper-last.html)
Fight or Flight Method for Gaging Surface Temperature (http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/wet-sanding-cutting-buffing/22325-fight-flight-method-gaging-surface-temperature.html)




:)

twistedframe
04-20-2010, 07:55 PM
Thanks!

ASPHALT ROCKET
04-20-2010, 08:06 PM
Hey Dave, let me know and I can come by and show you or help you with wet sanding.

twistedframe
04-20-2010, 08:07 PM
Hey Dave, let me know and I can come by and show you or help you with wet sanding.
Thursday? :) Im the MAN

Mike Phillips
04-20-2010, 08:11 PM
Hey Dave, let me know and I can come by and show you or help you with wet sanding.




Way to go Dana... :xyxthumbs:


Each one teach one...


:)

ASPHALT ROCKET
04-20-2010, 08:14 PM
Thursday? :) Im the MAN

I will be in MD the rest of the week doing a few vehicles.


Way to go Dana... :xyxthumbs:


Each one teach one...


:)

Thanks Mike, I help people all the time.

rohnramirez
04-20-2010, 10:25 PM
Thanks Mike, I help people all the time.


Yeah!!! Very approachable! Great guy!

detailjohn
04-21-2010, 12:00 AM
You can also dry sand it with a D.A. I usually use 1000-1500-2000. Wetsanding is definitely an art. Just make sure that you can polish every area that you sand. It's not worth polishing a tiny little area if you can't polish it out properly. Best of luck.


John

RaskyR1
04-21-2010, 11:36 AM
Hey Dave, let me know and I can come by and show you or help you with wet sanding.

Very cool of you Dana!

I'd takes his Si out and do some burnouts in exchange though! :D


J/K Twisted!



I've been happy with the 3M Trizact sanding disks but I will also be trying out the Mirka Abralon system on a car next week....4000 grit should buff out like a breeze! :props:

Mike Phillips
04-21-2010, 11:50 AM
You can also dry sand it with a D.A. I usually use 1000-1500-2000. Wetsanding is definitely an art. Just make sure that you can polish every area that you sand. It's not worth polishing a tiny little area if you can't polish it out properly. Best of luck.


John

The Rule of Thumb (http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/wet-sanding-cutting-buffing/25042-rule-thumb.html)

First, here's a tip when it comes to sanding paint by hand or machine...

Don't sand where you cannot safely machine compound.


The reason for this is because if you sand right up to an edge or up to a raised body line, it's difficult to run a buffing pad up to the end of your sanding marks and not buff on top of the body line or edge and risk burning through the topcoat.

Even if you're extremely careful it's all to easy to accidentally run the pad onto the edge and it only takes a few seconds to generate enough heat and abrasive sanding or cutting action to eat through the paint on a high point and expose the color coat, primer or even sheet metal underneath.

Remember paint will tend to be thinner on high points as wet paint, (when being sprayed), will flow off a little more than paint sprayed onto a flat panel.

So a good practice is to only sand where you can safely machine compound or another way of saying this is to not sand where you cannot safely machine compound.


The Rule of Thumb
The rule of thumb I use is with my thumb, mostly because I always have it with me. :D

I use the distance from the tip of my thumb to the end of my thumbnail, which I just measured and it's about 3/4 of an inch and that's about how far away I stay from edges and raised body lines when I sand by hand or machine.

Actually a 1/2" is a pretty good rule of thumb the bigger idea is to not sand paint where you cannot safely buff with a wool pad, a cutting compound with a rotary buffer.

This is a technique I teach in our wet-sanding classes to give students a simple method or a simple guideline they can use to know just how far to sand when sanding near a hard body line or the edge of a panel. This is a simple technique that works for me but feel free to come up with your own method.


How to sand right up to an edge and remove your sanding marks by hand
There is a fix for this now with M105 Ultimate Compound because it's aggressive enough you can easily remove sanding marks by hand if you're willing to put a little passion behind the pad (http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/ask-expert-featuring-mike-phillips/23568-put-little-passion-behind-pad-mike-phillips.html).


From this thread... post #15

http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/off-topic/23776-offline-today-tomorrow-2.html

Note: The blue line you see in the pictures below is vinyl tape applied over the top of a body line to make it easy to see and protect it.





Also took some pictures to show you can remove sanding marks by hand if you don't mind putting a little passion behind the pad...


http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/data/834/RemvovingSandingMarksbyHand01.jpg

http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/data/834/RemvovingSandingMarksbyHand02.jpg


This can come in real hand if you want to be extra careful around a raised body line, especially if it's not your car...





The Rule of Thumb (http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/wet-sanding-cutting-buffing/25042-rule-thumb.html)



:)

DARK HORSE
04-21-2010, 12:15 PM
Hey Dave, let me know and I can come by and show you or help you with wet sanding.

When are you going to come by and help me out with some of my vehicles? (working on three currently). :D

twistedframe
04-21-2010, 07:58 PM
Very cool of you Dana!

I'd takes his Si out and do some burnouts in exchange though! :D


J/K Twisted!



I've been happy with the 3M Trizact sanding disks but I will also be trying out the Mirka Abralon system on a car next week....4000 grit should buff out like a breeze! :props:
LOL you guys can come abuse my Si anytime you want. It'll make it easier for me to convince myself to buy a new car!

I was looking that those 3m disks too Rasky, and will probably invest in some to get in some practice. :xyxthumbs: