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Mike Phillips
11-23-2009, 01:54 PM
The practical differences between single stage paints and a clear coat paints (http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/hot-topics-frequently-asked-questions/21924-practical-differences-between-single-stage-paints-clear-coat-paints.html)

I've worked on hundreds of cars with single stage paints as well as conducted a number of extreme makeovers where the project car had single stage paint and below I'll outline some of the practical differences between single stage paints and clear coat paints. One of the reasons I chose single stage paint for the extreme makeovers was just to give younger detailers a chance to work on single stage paint, usually on very cool cars, this is becoming a more rare opportunity as time passes.

Clearcoat paints were introduced to production cars in the U.S.A. starting in the early 1980's and since that time the technology has continually improved to create automotive paint systems that will last a long time as well as provide a beautiful finish with great gloss, clarity and shine.

The oldest factory clear coat finish I've ever worked on was an all original 1980 Corvette and after that it was an all original 1982 Corvette. Here's a picture of the 1982 Corvette, I'm still searching my hard drive for a picture of the 1980 Corvette.

All original 1982 Corvette
http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/gallery/data/500/2AprilFinished2.jpg

Since clear coat finishes, or what's called Basecoat/Clearcoat Paint Systems were introduced and become mainstream, we now have entire generations of people that have only owned cars with what's called a basecoat/clearcoat paint system; they have never owned, nor worked on a car that has a single stage paint system.

From time to time a new member will join our forum and ask for help removing oxidation from their car's finish not knowing that the problem with their car's paint, (basecoat/clearcoat), is not oxidation, but is in fact clearcoat failure.

Clear coat paints, when exposed to too much sun over time and without out proper care will deteriorate throughout the entire matrix or thickness of the clear layer of paint. You can't fix it by abrading the surface because the problem isn't just on the surface, it's throughout the entire layer of paint. This is called clearcoat failure and the only honest fix is to repaint the affected panels or the entire car.

Clear Coat Failure
http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/data/724/clearcoatfailurebeginning.jpg


The primary problem most people experience with the clearcoat finish on their car is swirls. Swirls are actually scratches in the paint and besides being ugly and unsightly, they block your view of the color coat under the clear coat.

Swirls can be removed because they are topical, that is like oxidation the swirls are in the upper surface of the layer of clear paint and all you have to do is use a compound or a paint cleaner and remove a little paint from off the surface which will act to level or flatten out the surface again. See the below thread for more information.

What it means to remove swirls, scratches and water spots out of automotive clear coats (http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/faq/19986-what-means-remove-swirls-scratches-water-spots-out-automotive-clear-coats.html)


Single stage paints like the type of paint that came on a 1965 Mustang will oxidize and the problem can be fixed because like swirls, the problem is topical and isolated to just the upper surface of the paint. The way you fix oxidation is to abrade or remove just a little bit of paint off the surface to expose a fresh layer of paint or what we call a fresh base.

Top: 1965 Mustang with single stage finish. Bottom: 2009 Mustang with a basecoat/clearcoat finish.
http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/data/719/medium/RedMustangs.JPG


Classic cars with oxidized single stage paints are easy to fix, (in my opinion), as well as fun to work on, (again, just my opinion).


The thing to understand is that there's a huge difference between these two types of paint systems; the good news is you can usually fix true oxidation but the bad news is in most cases once a clearcoat finish deteriorates to what we call clearcoat failure there's really nothing you can do to permanently fix the problem and restore a nice looking finish that will hold up over time. Usually you have to repaint the affected sections or repaint the entire car, or learn to live with the problem.


Single stage paints will tend to be messier because whatever color of the paint is will be transferred to all your microfiber polishing cloths as well as to your buffing pads and this worries some people. There's nothing to be worried about. In most cases, washing your polishing cloths and buffing pads will remove most of the transferred pigment but not all of it however there's nothing to worry about as your polishing cloths and buffing pads can still be used for a future detailing session.,



Here's the practical difference

Single Stage Paints
The problem with single stage paints is oxidation as they oxidize very easily. Single stage paints still get swirls and scratches however in the real world the noticeable problem is the dullness and fading by oxidation.

Oxidation Before
http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/data/763/1960Ranchero01.jpg


After removing oxidation
http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/data/763/1960Ranchero05.jpg


Clear Coat Paints
The problems with clear coat paints is swirls and scratches as they oxidize very slowly. Clear coat paints will oxidize but in the real world the noticeable problem will be swirls and scratches. When you work on your own car or a customer's car your primary goal will be to remove swirls.

Swirls Before
http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/data/773/SwirlsInClearCoatBefore.jpg

After removing swirls
http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/data/773/SwirlsInClearCoatAfter.jpg


The best tool for either type of paint when it comes to restoring a show car finish will be an electric polisher like one of these,

Dual Action Polishers - Free Rotating Spindle Assembly
Porter Cable 7424XP (http://www.autogeek.net/dual-action-polishers.html)
Griot's Garage Random Orbital Polisher (http://www.autogeek.net/griots-random-orbital-polisher.html)
Meguiar's G110v2 (http://www.autogeek.net/meguiars-dual-action-polisher-g110.html)

Hybrid Dual Action Polishers - Direct Drive - Forced Oscillation & Rotation
Flex 3401 Forced Rotation Dual Action Orbital Polisher (http://www.autogeek.net/flex-orbital-polisher.html)

Rotary Buffers - Direct Drive - Rotation
Flex 3403 Lightweight Rotary Buffer (http://www.autogeek.net/flex-l3403vrg-rotary-polisher.html)
DeWalt 849 Rotary Buffer (http://www.autogeek.net/dw849.html)
Makita 92227c Rotary Buffer (http://www.autogeek.net/ma927po.html)
Flex LK603VVB Rotary Buffer (http://www.autogeek.net/flex-lk603vvb-circular-polisher.html)


Of course you can work by hand if you want to but most people find it very difficult and very time consuming to try to remove swirls by hand due to the hardness factor of clear coat paints. (See below for more on paint hardness)

Also check out the time difference to remove the swirls to machine quality results by hand as compared to how long it took to get the same results by machine.

Man versus Machine (http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/faq/20257-man-versus-machine.html)

http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/data/728/Lincoln041.jpg

http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/data/728/Lincoln064.jpg


Final Results from the Man versus Machine Test

The surface prep steps by Hand: 1 hour and 45 minutes
The surface prep steps Machine: 30 minutes.
That's a difference of 1 hour and 15 minutes for one half of a hood done by hand versus machine.



Paint Hardness

Clear Coats
The hardness of a clear coat finish is determined by primarily the type of resin used to make the clear paint and then by a number of other factors like whether it's catalyzed or not and also the type of hardeners used, types of solvents used, other additives as well as the drying or baking process used.

Single Stage
The hardness of single stage paints is also determined by primarily the type of resin used to make the paint but also by the type of pigment used to give the paint color. Different pigments in and of themselves can be soft or hard and thus alter the resin, (that's the paint), to make it either softer or harder. Here's an article that discusses this at length I wrote back in 2004

A Lesson From White Paint (http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/hot-topics-frequently-asked-questions/22982-lesson-white-paint-teaches-us.html)

While you'll often times find threads on discussion forums that generalize the hardness or softness of entire manufactures lines of cars, trucks and s.u.v.'s, it's really not a good idea to generalize this aspect of a car. A better idea is to push away from the keyboard and actually go out into your garage and work on your car and determine on your own if your car's paint is hard or soft.


Summary
Because generally speaking, most single stage paints are softer than modern clear coat paints and because the before and after differences are so dramatic with a single stage paint as compared to most before and after differences for a clear coat finish, a lot of people find restoring a show car shine to a classic car with a single stage paint to be easier, more fun and usually more rewarding even though it will tend to be messier.

Because generally speaking modern clear coat paints tend to be harder than traditional single stage paints, it will usually require a person to focus more on the task at hand in order to get show car results as well as shrink their work area down to a smaller size. Luckily electric polishers will take a lot of the work out of the swirl removal step.


Closing thoughts...
If after reading all the above you're wondering,

If single stage paints tend to be more user-friendly to work on for the average person, why do car manufactures spray them with basecoat/clearcoat paint systems?

Good question!

The primary reason the OEM industry, (OEM means, Original Equipment Manufacture, which in this case the equipment is a car or truck), switched paint systems was due to new laws and regulations from the EPA and other government regulatory agencies. The new basecoat/clearcoat paint systems emit less V.O.C.'s into the air, (V.O.C.'s means Volatile Organic Compounds, which typically means some type of air-borne solvent), and thus supposedly have a less negative impact on the earth.

A benefit to modern basecoat/clearcoat paint technology is that due to the harder resulting finishes and the improved resin technology modern bc/cc finishes will tend to last longer over the service life of a car as compared to the time period a single stage paint would last on a new cars built before the early 1980's

Don't make the common mistake of confusing the words I wrote above that state last longer to mean look good longer because you can have a clear coat finish with swirls that are ugly and the paint can still last a long time although it won't look good over that long time.


:D

John M.
11-23-2009, 03:50 PM
Awesome write up, Mike! Every question I had regarding SS paint and base/clear paint was all answered! :D

I always learn so much whenever I read one of your write up's!

LincolnZephyr2006
11-23-2009, 04:15 PM
Heyyy I remember on the Meg's forum about you having to use a vinyl dressing of some sort to put some life into the black vinyl on the side of the vet!

skizot
11-23-2009, 08:27 PM
Thank you for this information, makes perfect sense and so clearly explained.

Mike Phillips
11-23-2009, 08:54 PM
Heyyy I remember on the Meg's forum about you having to use a vinyl dressing of some sort to put some life into the black vinyl on the side of the vet!

The graphics were the original vinyl graphics from 1982 and they were looking very flat, dull and lifeless. I rubbed them down very carefully with Gold Class Trim Detailer and then wiped the excess off using a clean soft microfiber and a little spray detailer.

I've been using GCTD for vinyl graphics and flat black paint ever since it was introduced as M42 was discontinued years ago and that was my go-to product for flat black pant, plastic and graphics previously.

Here's some more pictures of this car, it belong to a real "car girl" by the name of April the Vette Lady.

April's Corvette. April is also known as "The Vette Lady"

http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/gallery/data/500/2AprilsVette.jpg


Here's a model of her car

http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/gallery/data/500/2AprilsModel.jpg


After
http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/gallery/data/500/2AprilFinished2.jpg

http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/gallery/data/500/2AprilFinished4.jpg

http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/gallery/data/500/2AprilFinished5.jpg

http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/gallery/data/500/2AprilFinished1.jpg



Here it is on display at a car show, towards the back of the picture Chip Foose is signing autographs...

http://archive.meguiarsonline.com/gallery/data/500/2AprilAtShow1.jpg


I've talked with Chip Foose for that last 7-8 years and always offered him my services for anything he needed buffed out. He's invited me to his shop twice where we sat around and talked shop and wet-sanding and buffing, but alas... never got a call for work. He's always really nice when I talk to him and again I gave him my new Autogeek business card and made the offer again but he was rushed off by his handlers so we didn't have a chance to talk. One thing I'm good at though and that's persistence. I'm not giving up and I would fly out to California in a instant to work on a Foose project.

The guy that's currently doing his detail work is a heck of a nice guy, he's been to both the Detailing 101 and Advanced Class I taught for Meguiar's and I saw him at SEMA and he said he's even attended a 3rd class since I left Meguiar's which is cool because you can never know everything and it's always a good plan to be open to new products, procedures and ideas. Lucky dog!


:xyxthumbs:

Klasse Act
05-01-2012, 08:43 AM
Mike, I just read the entire article on "Lessons from white paint" and it couldn't have come at a better time as I'm supposed to detail an 88' Mazda RX7 this Saturday. I'm pretty much a noob for the most part with using my GG wheel ( only having it for one year and doing all CC paints so far ) and the last thing I wanna do is ruin this car! After reading the article about white and what its made of it has made me think its above my skill set for sure and not worth the chance of messing up the paint, the $125.00 I was going to charge to wash/clay/polish/wax the car isn't the issue, the real issue is damaging the paint, the car is pretty good shape but needs some attention. The hood is the worst part on the car, due to it being a top surface as well as the hot running turbo engine under it, the white on the hood looks different than the rest of the car for sure. To make matters worse the other car he's got is a pristine 92' Miata and you guessed it, it too is white!

I think for right now I'm going to punt on this one, just to play it safe. I'm pretty sure the RX7 is SS and I know the Miata is as well, what do you think?

Mike Phillips
05-01-2012, 08:47 AM
Mike, I just read the entire article on "Lessons from white paint" and it couldn't have come at a better time as I'm supposed to detail an 88' Mazda RX7 this Saturday. I'm pretty much a noob for the most part with using my GG wheel ( only having it for one year and doing all CC paints so far ) and the last thing I wanna do is ruin this car!

After reading the article about white and what its made of it has made me think its above my skill set for sure and not worth the chance of messing up the paint, the $125.00 I was going to charge to wash/clay/polish/wax the car isn't the issue, the real issue is damaging the paint, the car is pretty good shape but needs some attention.

The hood is the worst part on the car, due to it being a top surface as well as the hot running turbo engine under it, the white on the hood looks different than the rest of the car for sure. To make matters worse the other car he's got is a pristine 92' Miata and you guessed it, it too is white!

I think for right now I'm going to punt on this one, just to play it safe. I'm pretty sure the RX7 is SS and I know the Miata is as well, what do you think?


I would take them on as long as the customer's expectations are realistic.


Make sure the customer knows that you know that the paint on the hood has changed due to exposure over time to engine heat and that chances are very good that no compound or polish can undo the damage.

If he agrees then go for it.

Miata's a breeze to buff out, I've done a bunch of them. Just keep in mind the hardness factor of white paint and don't expect or try to remove all below surface defects.

Also, take good before and after pictures. You cannot get the kind of depth out of white like you can get with dark colors but you can maximize gloss by getting the paint really smooth.

:)