Infamous M105/M205 combo; why do I need M105?

[flaco]

After reading lots of great feedback on Meguiar's M205, I picked up a bottle to try. I found M205 cuts and finishes well, dusts very little (almost zero) and wipes off easily. Clean up is easy. It works pretty well by hand, too. I even used it to clean up my headlights...worked great with a rotary and a foam pad. It has to be the user-friendliest polish I've ever used.

I also did alcohol wipe-downs to make sure that the polish wasn't filling in scratches. It wasn't.

My question is, why do I need M105? People boast about this 'great combo' for detailing..."use M105 and follow-up with M205", but I for one do not see the need for M105.

The M205 bottle says you can remove 2000 grit sand scratches with it (which I proved myself; they came out easily with a rotary and wool pad), so why bother with two polishes? I've yet to get into a detailing situation that represented something more difficult to remove than 2000 grit scratches. M205 cuts as well as I need it to. I bet it would take out 1500 grit with a rotary and wool pad too (I'll try that next).

Is the combo recommended just for non-rotary users who need extra HP since they're not using a rotary? Or rotary users that don't like wool pads? Do they need the extra cut in M105 that I don't need since I am using a rotary with wool?

I don't mean to come across negative...again, I am thrilled with M205. :xyxthumbs:

[GMC83]

Nowhere on the bottle it states that it removes 2000 grit sand scratches as you say.

[flaco]

Nowhere on the bottle it states that it removes 2000 grit sand scratches as you say.
LOL...you are correct! I just checked my bottle.

However, other advertisments for the product claim 2000 grit scratch removal (I thought I was going crazy there for a second, see below) and like I said previously, I verified that it actually does remove 2000 grit scratches. Other guys make similar claims on the net so I'm not the only one.

Regardless of what it says or doesn't say on the bottle, it still has awesome correction, and I believe my point is still valid. Using M105 appears unnecessary.

Meguiars M205 Ultra Finishing Polish

A companion to their M105 Ultra Cut Compound, Meguiars M205 Ultra Finishing Polish also incorporates Meguiar's new abrasive technology to quickly restore a mirror-like gloss without haze. The revolutionary abrasives in Meguiars M205 Ultra Finishing Polish are so advanced and milled so perfectly that the polish produces flawless results regardless of how it is applied. Ultra Finishing Polish permanently removes swirls and light defects leaving a deep gloss whether applied by hand, random orbital, dual-action or rotary machine polisher. The ultra fine, ultra hard abrasives used in Ultra Finishing Polish do not degrade in quality or cut during application. This polish can remove up to 2000 grit scratches, sanding marks, pig tails, acid rain damage, scuffing, and bird bomb etching effortlessly while finishing to a smooth, reflective finish. The “non-diminishing abrasives”, used in M205 Ultra Finishing Polish are fine tuned to remove microscopic amounts of paint quickly yet still leave the paint glossy, shiny, and haze-free.

[GMC83]

Alright?

[Rsurfer]

If your happy with 205 and don't need 105 don't use it. You are answering your own question.

[Mike Phillips]

My question is, why do I need M105? People boast about this 'great combo' for detailing..."use M105 and follow-up with M205", but I for one do not see the need for M105.




Remember, the target market for these products are body shops where they're sanding and buffing fresh paint. After sanding they will need an aggressive cutting compound to use with a wool cutting pad on a rotary buffer to cut-out the sanding marks.

M205 would not be aggressive enough for the initial cut.

Always evaluate the surface then match the right product to the job.


:)

[Harleyguy]

I think alot of us here would be more then happy if we didn't need to use 105 everytime.As Mike always points out use the least aggressive product first and recheck your work.If it looks good and your happy with the results no need to go that extra step like using 105.

[Nappers]

I agree, I have M105 just in case, our Neon always needs something stronger but our Yukon is easy as pie to work with!

[flaco]

Remember, the target market for these products are body shops where they're sanding and buffing fresh paint. After sanding they will need an aggressive cutting compound to use with a wool cutting pad on a rotary buffer to cut-out the sanding marks.

M205 would not be aggressive enough for the initial cut.

Always evaluate the surface then match the right product to the job.


:)
I understand...and I'm not faulting Meguiar's at all regarding marketing/etc. I think they've marketed both products well.

I am specifically talking about detailers that push the combo and I don't understand why.

I still can't believe there'd every be a need for a detailer to use M105, unless he/she is wetsanding with 1500 grit...but hey, do whatever suits you. I don't need 105 in my arsenal. :)

And yes M205 would be aggressive enough if a body shop finished with 2000 grit. I did it easily on paint that was 2 years old, so I know fresh paint would be a snap. However, a lot of body shops finish with 1500 grit so I could see leaning towards 105 in that situation, even though I think I could remove 1500 grit scratches almost as easily with M205 (I still need to do that experiment).

[ryandamartini]

M205 on a white compressor with the rotary is magic. I swear there is a genie living in my buffer when those three come together. I love the 105/205. I think what makes them unique is their non-diminishing abrasives.

[flaco]

M205 on a white compressor with the rotary is magic. I swear there is a genie living in my buffer when those three come together. I love the 105/205. I think what makes them unique is their non-diminishing abrasives.
OK so here I go beating the dead horse again...why do you need 105?

[ASPHALT ROCKET]

I understand...and I'm not faulting Meguiar's at all regarding marketing/etc. I think they've marketed both products well.

I am specifically talking about detailers that push the combo and I don't understand why.

I still can't believe there'd every be a need for a detailer to use M105, unless he/she is wetsanding with 1500 grit...but hey, do whatever suits you. I don't need 105 in my arsenal. :)

And yes M205 would be aggressive enough if a body shop finished with 2000 grit. I did it easily on paint that was 2 years old, so I know fresh paint would be a snap. However, a lot of body shops finish with 1500 grit so I could see leaning towards 105 in that situation, even though I think I could remove 1500 grit scratches almost as easily with M205 (I still need to do that experiment).

There will always be a need for 105, but not on every car. 205 is not strong enough to remove some defects no matter what pad you use. Plus when you run into a hard clear coat with defects and 205 once again will not remove them you will need 105. Also just because paint is two years old does not mean it is going to be a breeze to work on.

[flaco]

There will always be a need for 105, but not on every car. 205 is not strong enough to remove some defects no matter what pad you use. Plus when you run into a hard clear coat with defects and 205 once again will not remove them you will need 105. Also just because paint is two years old does not mean it is going to be a breeze to work on.
Excellent point. I have not tried M105 on very hard paint yet.

Cheers

[ASPHALT ROCKET]

Don't forget by using different pads you can "adjust" the cut M105 has and finish nicely, then 205 can come in a do a little clean up. Then if you are like me and feel 205 just doesn't have that little extra, follow it up with UF.

[switerajaya]

Remember, the target market for these products are body shops where they're sanding and buffing fresh paint. After sanding they will need an aggressive cutting compound to use with a wool cutting pad on a rotary buffer to cut-out the sanding marks.

M205 would not be aggressive enough for the initial cut.

Always evaluate the surface then match the right product to the job.


:)

Then can it be done with 205 (just longer process)? or it can't be done at all using 205, and using 105 is a must?

Thanks, Mike.