Ceramic/Hard clear: PB V.s Menzerna

[cobraa]

So I had a little debate with 2 guys today about PB polish. 1 said PB can work as great on hard clear coat as Menzerna. The difference is that the menzerna leave less dust and give a bit more gloss. Me and the other guy were septical about those comments because we read all-over the internet that menzerna IS THE ONLY polish that can work with those scratch-resistant clear..

What is your thought. I'm sure some of you tried both. What is your opinion/feedback !!??

[ScottB]

From what I understand Menzerna uses a different type of abrasive in their ceramiclear polishes. I remember it being milled differently and likely a different ingredient or abrasive. It was originally designed for ceramic coats on Maybach , Mecedes, and BMW. These polishes would indeed be more abrasive than their counterparts with most other polish lines. It doesnt mean a more abrasive polish from another line couldnt work, just that Menzerna SIP/Nano/085 were specifically designed for those harder coatings.

[cobraa]

Yeah so instead of going with SSR2 and an orange pad, I could just use SSR2.5?

What i like about PB is that they work great under the sunlight, not so sure about menzerna.

[Nappers]

So...(Hijack alert!!!!!)

Our Neon, Orange Blast Paint has an extremely hard clear coat and very hard to dial a process in.

I've suceeded with M105/M205 combo but finish about 85%(generous) and finished with M66 prior to laying down a couple of coats of Do Do Juice Banana Armour.

I know there's not a "miracle" in a bottle but should I try something else?

No Acronyms please, not used to the abundance of products available to AG and not familiar with them all yet.

I own a G100, Meguiar's pads (Soft Buff/S.B. 2.0) and Meguiar's Backing Plates.

I'm looking to buy some 5.5 pads and 4" pads in the future. The 6" and S.B. 2.0's are spinning fine but want some options.....

Or....stick with what I got and get a bottle of "patience"

Thanks.

[BarryK]

Me the other were septical about those comments because we read allover the internet that menzerna IS THE ONLY polish that can work with those scratch-resistant clear..


The ONLY?? oh please give me a break. Believe that and I've got a lovely bridge you may be interested in...

I've had excellent success with the Megs M105/M205 combo on cars with very hard clear coats.
In fact, the M105 is definitely more aggressive than the Menzerna.

Don't get me wrong, I'm in no way trying to say that the Menzerna is not a great product but to say that it's THE ONLY product that will work on these types of clearcoats is simply foolish.

[ScottB]

Menzerna designed polishes specifically for ceramiclear, more are likely coming from other companies and newer polishes like the non-diminishing abrasive twins from Megs (105/205) are likely just as nice. Maybe a little extra work but who knows and really who cares, use what you like.

What I will offer is both Nano and 085rd from Menzerna both finish down more glossy and reflective than 105 or 105/205. I would not have noted it but saw it in person and had two others make the same comment and neither even really care about detailing. So maybe the best polishes is a combination of several great lines.

[cobraa]

here's a nice debate. Meg Vs. Menzerna just like Souveran Vs. Fuzion haha!

[nrengle]

To expand on your debate it seems a lot of people are doing the Meg's 105 for compounding, then going to Menzerna SIP, and then Nano, or even skipping SIP and going Nano and 85RD. So for a heavy duty correction it is a combination of two lines, or you can even go 3 lines with 3M Ultrafina...

[BarryK]

here's a nice debate. Meg Vs. Menzerna just like Souveran Vs. Fuzion haha!

no, this is not turning into a Megs vs Menzerna debate.

You originally stated that you read on the internet that the Menzerna was the ONLY product that would work on the newer hard clearcoat systems. I used the Megs as one example to disprove that false information.

Both the Menzerna and the Megs are excellent products and it's my belief that either product will give excellent results. Whether one is better than another is truely subjective and a lot of any differences between the two on final results will come down to the knowledge and experience of the user.
A novice or beginner can get very good results with either product. An experienced detailer that has used the products a lot and learned how to best work them will achieve spectacular results with either one (or at least with the one he/she is used to working with).

That's not to say that Menzerna and Megs are the ONLY two products that will work on the harder clearcoats either. As nrengle mentioned, the 3M very well may work also. I haven't used it but I have heard pretty good things about it

[ScottB]

I would add that both lines, Megs and Menzerna, are quite different and each is not an apple to apple comparision other than generally speaking about polishes. One uses diminishing abrasive (Menzerna) and the other uses non-diminishing abrasives (Megs) and could be a decision maker on your skill level. We are not trying to argue just inform any/all potential users of the differences in each product line. Heck Optimum Polishes offer some great products, work longer than most others, and yet hasnt even been touched on here.

[BarryK]

Heck Optimum Polishes offer some great products, work longer than most others, and yet hasnt even been touched on here.

that's my point, there are lots of high quality products out there, many of which will work and do a very good job on harder clearcoat finishes.
Menzerna is not the ONLY product out there that will work as was being stated in the first post.

This is the point I've been trying to make in this thread - not whether ANY brand is better than, equal to, or less than any other brand whether you are comparing apples to apples or apples or oranges. :xyxthumbs:

[cobraa]

. One uses diminishing abrasive (Menzerna) and the other uses non-diminishing abrasives (Megs) .

1) Is there a guide somewhere where I could understand the benefit and cons of both abrasives?

2) And what is the difference in term of abrasives between REG Menzerna Vs. Menzerna ( mercedes OEM spec) PO85U Final POlish/Final Finish PO85RD/ Micro-Polish po87/PO106 Nano polish.. they all look exactly the same.

3) do you know what kind of abrasive PB use?

[ScottB]

I dont know the abrasive types but believe Jason told me the difference several DF's ago. I want to say Menzerna uses oxide/carbide or something that sounded much more exotic.

SIP is their middle polish. 106FF was the original Nano polish and designed for MB. Then then offered 106FA which is also the same abrasive level of Nano 106FF but offers less dusting. 085rd was there final or finishing polish. Funny thing, almost all have a final gloss rating of the highest rating from Menzerna due to their diminishing abrasive technology.

[cobraa]

I dont know the abrasive types but believe Jason told me the difference several DF's ago. I want to say Menzerna uses oxide/carbide or something that sounded much more exotic.

SIP is their middle polish. 106FF was the original Nano polish and designed for MB. Then then offered 106FA which is also the same abrasive level of Nano 106FF but offers less dusting. 085rd was there final or finishing polish. Funny thing, almost all have a final gloss rating of the highest rating from Menzerna due to their diminishing abrasive technology.

Exactly, for a novice like me, it's pretty hard to follow up with menzerna polish.

[bogdansbg]

I did a 2005 Mercedes SL500 and it took 12 hours to repair the trunk door. Menzerna Power Gloss, that's it. But the pressure I used to cut and repair I think not many people have that mad courage when they work an expensive car :) I'm a 100 kg guy and I've used plenty of presure on pads because it's recommended by Menzerna that way and 2 menzerna pads for this operation.

On the other side Poorboys SSR2.5 was best for finishing on this SL500 :) because of its high-gloss properties. I gave it a hand of Meguiars Glaze 7. I ended with Sonus Sealant and covered with Collinite 845 wax.

I attached some pics :)