Windshield coating - skipping wipers (new car)

[SalmonPride]

Hi guys,

Been here for a while educating myself, just got a brand new GLC Coupe and decided to give it the protection it deserves to keep it shiny and new as long as possible.So I went to a reputable detailer and we agreed to put coatings on almost any surface. I wouldn't spam with the complete list, but all the products used were G Techniq.

The post is about something I experience with my wipers.
So the windshield was polished and coating applied - G1 Clear Vision Smart Glass. Also same coating put on the wipers.

I got the car from the detailer yesterday, it was raining and when I used the wipers they started to chatter and skip. When I use wash fluid or there is some more water on the windshield it is fine, they glide and clean flawlessly, but when I put them on rain sensor and there's less rain drops they always chatter and skip.

Talked with the detailer, he thinks it might be that the wipers have some extra protection by default and couldn't absorb the Smart Glass coating. However I researched a bit more and a lot of Benz customer are complaining of GLCs skipping OEM wipers. I would also be driving it to the detailer in a week or two and we'll try to apply some more coating on the wipers only and see if that would fix the issue.

So my question is could it be that the car is really really new, only 250km on it when I applied the glass coating? I mean should I give it some time for the wipers to break in ? I drove it just once in rain before I got it to the detailer and didn't really notice any chattering, so I think it is the coating and the wipers that were not able to absorb it.

If the second coating and the break in doesn't work I guess we would need to remove the coating or maybe try to get better wipers. I think Benz OEMs wipers are Bosch and not many people are impressed with them.

Any experiences you can share or solutions different than the ones above?
Thanks!

[Bruno Soares]

I’ve had that before and usually goes away in a couple weeks. The one time it wasn’t getting better I replaced the wipers with Bosch Icon blades and all was great after that.

Try to use the wipers less often and let the coating repel the water as you drive.

[SalmonPride]

I’ve had that before and usually goes away in a couple weeks. The one time it wasn’t getting better I replaced the wipers with Bosch Icon blades and all was great after that.

Try to use the wipers less often and let the coating repel the water as you drive.

Thanks, yep, I will try to give it some time. Car was actually ready last Thursday, so that's around 4 days with applied coating , sitting , waiting for me. Will give it a chance till next rain. The detailer said that Bosch in general are bad due to some special coating they have on them, probably he had issues before with that brand.

And what about wipers - you should coat them as well , right? I mean if I would change, it is good to apply the glass coating on the new ones as well?

Regarding your suggestion - I tried to use them less often, but sitting in stop and go city traffic and in general in city traffic it's kind of dangerous not wiping and relying only on repel. I can hardly reach higher speeds to repel the water effectively.

[Desertnate]

Due to spotty experiences, windshields and wipers are the one place I never mess with. The products seem to work great when there is a hard rain, but when you get into a thick, wet, fog or misty/drizzle conditions there is the possibility of smearing and/or wiper chatter.

One thing I've noticed with my German cars is the OEM windshield glass seems to be polished and/or coated with something from the factory. Both my VW and two BMW's tend to bead water nicely and it blows right off. Cars from other makers don't seem to do the same. I've never felt the need to do anything to my German cars.

As for the Bosch wiper blades, I found the Icon's to be excellent and used them on my GTI for years. Highly recommend them if you can get the right fitment. They don't make them for my current car, but I've found the OEM's to be excellent and cheaper than Bosch if purchased from the right place.

[Bruno Soares]

Thanks, yep, I will try to give it some time. Car was actually ready last Thursday, so that's around 4 days with applied coating , sitting , waiting for me. Will give it a chance till next rain. The detailer said that Bosch in general are bad due to some special coating they have on them, probably he had issues before with that brand.

And what about wipers - you should coat them as well , right? I mean if I would change, it is good to apply the glass coating on the new ones as well?

Regarding your suggestion - I tried to use them less often, but sitting in stop and go city traffic and in general in city traffic it's kind of dangerous not wiping and relying only on repel. I can hardly reach higher speeds to repel the water effectively.

I've coated several windshields before, never coated the wipers themselves. I've heard of people doing it but I haven't. Some did chatter for a bit but after a few rains or washes it was good. Some worked great from the beginning. And on a Hyundai I had to replace the wiper blades and that took care of the issue.

Due to how finicky coatings can be on windshield, some prefer to just use a glass sealant and apply it more often. You can't know which one will work best for you until you try. Fortunately it's just the windshield so even if you're not doing it yourself, it shouldn't be too expensive to get it re-done.

[TTQ B4U]

Due to spotty experiences, windshields and wipers are the one place I never mess with. The products seem to work great when there is a hard rain, but when you get into a thick, wet, fog or misty/drizzle conditions there is the possibility of smearing and/or wiper chatter.

One thing I've noticed with my German cars is the OEM windshield glass seems to be polished and/or coated with something from the factory. Both my VW and two BMW's tend to bead water nicely and it blows right off. Cars from other makers don't seem to do the same. I've never felt the need to do anything to my German cars.]

^^ This. Most German cars and some Lexus come with a factory coating that seems to work VERY well. I did my Audi with a coating at first and it worked too but I'm not sure it really needed it.



I've coated several windshields before, never coated the wipers themselves. I've heard of people doing it but I haven't. Some did chatter for a bit but after a few rains or washes it was good. Some worked great from the beginning. And on a Hyundai I had to replace the wiper blades and that took care of the issue.

Due to how finicky coatings can be on windshield, some prefer to just use a glass sealant and apply it more often. You can't know which one will work best for you until you try. Fortunately it's just the windshield so even if you're not doing it yourself, it shouldn't be too expensive to get it re-done.

Like Bruno, windshields are tricky. I typically use NeverWet for Glass as a sealant/coating and it work pretty well. If I get some chatter, I first try a little Beadmaker to calm it down until the wipers can wear into the coating and remove the "Grabby" tendency of things. Only once has it resulted in me having to re-polish things.

[SalmonPride]

Thanks guys, well what's done is done. Actually today I ran a few dry runs - no water or fluid on the windshield. Didn't hear anything else than the wipers motor, at the 6-7 run they started a bit of chatter, but I guess that would be no normal for perfectly dry windshield. We'll see at next rain, as Bruno said it would be easy to reapply or use other product. Detailer is happy to fix it if problem persists.



One thing I've noticed with my German cars is the OEM windshield glass seems to be polished and/or coated with something from the factory. Both my VW and two BMW's tend to bead water nicely and it blows right off. Cars from other makers don't seem to do the same. I've never felt the need to do anything to my German cars.


Most German cars and some Lexus come with a factory coating that seems to work VERY well. I did my Audi with a coating at first and it worked too but I'm not sure it really needed it.


Just wanted to ask you guys as you mentioned it comes with coating from the factory. I guess when we polished the glass we removed it , but we didn't really do any damage, it was just a factory coating , that would wear off after a while, right? Or there is some UV reflective coating that we might have damaged, this is what worries me. In general does the polishing do any damage?

And my second question would be just for future reference, E class can come with reflective foil coating that prevents heat generation due to solar radiation, some BMWs also have the solar film. If same procedure if applied , I mean if we polish the glass of a brand new car just to remove any stains or eventually scratches would that remove the special UV foil as well or it will be just the layer of factory coating on top ?

[Desertnate]

Just wanted to ask you guys as you mentioned it comes with coating from the factory. I guess when we polished the glass we removed it , but we didn't really do any damage, it was just a factory coating , that would wear off after a while, right? Or there is some UV reflective coating that we might have damaged, this is what worries me. In general does the polishing do any damage?

I've never noticed the factory glass properties wearing off, even after long periods of time. I owned my first BMW for 7 years and 130K+ miles and it never wore off. I owned my VW GTI for 6 years and 75K miles and the glass behaved the same across the entire time I owned it. My current BMW is 5 years old (I've owned it for almost 2) with 50K miles and it's still going strong. Maybe you can polish it off, but I'm not sure what is on the glass or what it would take to remove it.


And my second question would be just for future reference, E class can come with reflective foil coating that prevents heat generation due to solar radiation, some BMWs also have the solar film. If same procedure if applied , I mean if we polish the glass of a brand new car just to remove any stains or eventually scratches would that remove the special UV foil as well or it will be just the layer of factory coating on top ?

I'm only guessing here, but I think those UV foils/blockers/etc are in between the layers of the windshield glass. I do know windshield glass has at least two layers and the safety film that keeps them from shattering like a beer bottle lies between those two layers. I would think that same foil would either be sandwiched in there as well or possibly applied to the inside of the glass as another alternative.

[Mike Phillips]

For what it's worth, I find most glass coatings do or can make wipers chatter.

I always use Pinnacle Black Label Surface Coating. Works great, no chatter. After 30 mph water flies off the windshield.


The other thing I do and educate others on is when it comes to the windshield, because a RUBBER wiper is going to drag over the glass, it's going to micro-abrade anything you put on it off. It's reality. So instead of looking for a one-and-done or set-it-and-forget-it type product, I look for a product that quick and easy to re-apply.

I already know whatever I put on it is going to wear-off, so I find something that's quick and easy to re-apply.

Make sense?

Then after washing and drying my car, because the Surface Coating is quick and easy to apply - I simply re-apply. It only takes a few mists of product and it spread out and disappears as you wipe it.

Truly a versatile product. I also mist it over all the cars I detail after the initial coating install. It makes rubbery coatings feel slick, smooth and slippery. The stuff is bubba-proof.



FWIW and YMMV


:)

[SalmonPride]

For what it's worth, I find most glass coatings do or can make wipers chatter.

Thanks Mike. I do experienced that when I got the car. The coating was also put on the wipers to avoid that rubber chatter, I will try it in the next days, but as I said - no issues with dry window , we'll see how it behaves in rain or when I change the wipers in 6-12 months.

But I guess you are correct - next time I'd rather put something that might last less and save myself the trouble of that chatter.
However I think I am more worried with the polish itself - is it something bad to be done on a new car windshield? We also polished the side and rear windows. We used G4 nano polish.



I've never noticed the factory glass properties wearing off, even after long periods of time. I owned my first BMW for 7 years and 130K+ miles and it never wore off. I owned my VW GTI for 6 years and 75K miles and the glass behaved the same across the entire time I owned it. My current BMW is 5 years old (I've owned it for almost 2) with 50K miles and it's still going strong. Maybe you can polish it off, but I'm not sure what is on the glass or what it would take to remove it.


Thanks, I guess all the properties lie in between the layers as you said, so maybe what's removed is just some kind of factory coating, if there is any at all.

So you are not using any coatings, but my question is - do you avoid polishing glasses as well ? You said 15 years of ownership, but I guess you did polish at some point to deep clean it?

The car came brand new, but had a lot of nasty stuff on the windshield - for example a number written with some kind of white chalk, and also some deposits. I guess the proper way to clean the windshield and all the side and rear windows, would be to polish and remove all of those nasty stuff? I mean we didn't do any harm , polishing is the correct way?

And one more - what about side and rear ? I think it's perfectly fine to polish and coat, right?

I guess it all depends on the detailer doing the job, but just to understand people's thoughts.

[Mike Phillips]

However I think I am more worried with the polish itself - is it something bad to be done on a new car windshield?

We also polished the side and rear windows. We used G4 nano polish.



As far as I know, you're good. I've heard some car manufacturers put "something" on the OUTER SURFACE of their car's windshield but I don't know this as a fact. AND - to me it doesn't make sense as their engineers must be able to figure out what this working class dog posted previously - that is,





a RUBBER wiper is going to drag over the glass, it's going to micro-abrade anything you put on it off. It's reality.




Car manufactures have ZERO idea what's going to happen to their cars and specifically the windshields after they get pooped out of the assembly plant. Zero. So I don't know why they would insert the potential for problems and headaches by putting some type of coating on the glass. I'm sure there are filters sandwiched in-between the glass, but ON the glass?

Maybe someone somewhere has this answer?






but my question is - do you avoid polishing glasses as well ?

You said 15 years of ownership, but I guess you did polish at some point to deep clean it?



I'm guessing you're new to Mike Phillips? I have MORE articles on glass polishing than anyone breathing. A few key words and using my first and last name on Skynet will show you this.


I posted this yesterday, hasn't received any attention, some articles do, some don't.

2016 Mercedes-Benz S550 4MATIC Coupe - Wolfgang Paint Correction and Ceramic Coating (https://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/how-to-articles-by-mike-phillips/129332-2016-mercedes-benz-s550-wolfgang-paint-correction-ceramic-coating.html)

Here's polished glass.

http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/data/4275/Cermic_S550_006.JPG



How to avoid staining plastic, vinyl and rubber trim

It's real simple - cover over the trim with some quality painter's tape. In this example I'm using the green 3M Brand.

http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/data/4275/Cermic_S550_007.JPG


I ALWAYS polish all glass on every car I detail. Then at this time, as a very last step to the car - I spray-on and wipe-off the PBL Surface Coating.






The car came brand new, but had a lot of nasty stuff on the windshield - for example a number written with some kind of white chalk, and also some deposits. I guess the proper way to clean the windshield and all the side and rear windows, would be to polish and remove all of those nasty stuff? I mean we didn't do any harm , polishing is the correct way?



In my experience, mechanically polishing glass is the best way to get it absolutely clean.





And one more - what about side and rear ? I think it's perfectly fine to polish and coat, right?



Yup. See the picture above. I also did the glass sunroof and the back window. Again - I do this for all the cars I detail and show it in my classes.





I guess it all depends on the detailer doing the job, but just to understand people's thoughts.



Sounds like he knows what he's doing.

It's natural for most people and most detailers to put a glass coating on glass. It's sold to us this way. All I know is my own experience. When I have done this in the past, the wipers chatter. People hate it when their wipers chatter. Customers complain. I reduce the potential and go with what I know. Been sharing the PBS Surface Coating with others on this forum for YEARS. And I get it people can be cynical, (not saying your cynical, just people in general), but at this time, it is in fact one of my favorite products. I use it on my wife's Infinity over the paint coating and on the glass. I use it on the glass on my car. I use a cleaner/wax on the paint for my car, it's just a ho-hum daily driver that sits outside 24x7.


Hang tight, I'll share a picture that will blow most people's minds...



:)

[Mike Phillips]

Hang tight, I'll share a picture that will blow most people's minds...




Here you go, cropped and resized the originals to 1000 pixels wide for everyone's viewing pleasure. I think I'm one of the last guys on earth that actually knows how to work with images on a discussion forum. :laughing:


For the record - the majority of people on planet Earth should not do this. At all. It's more work than words can describe and once you're committed, you MUST see it through all the way to the crystal clear end.


Machine sanding glass

http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/data/4276/Mike_Phillips_Machine_Sanding_Glass_01.JPG




Everything I used...

http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/data/4276/Mike_Phillips_Machine_Sanding_Glass_02.JPG




There was a film on the inside of the glass so I hand polished it with the BLACKFIRE Water Spot Remover (https://www.autogeek.net/blackfire-glass-water-spot-remover.html) (good stuff but be sure to shake well before use)

http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/data/4276/Mike_Phillips_Machine_Sanding_Glass_04.JPG




Then applied the PBL Surface Coating to the inside and outside...

http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/data/4276/Mike_Phillips_Machine_Sanding_Glass_05.JPG

http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/data/4276/Mike_Phillips_Machine_Sanding_Glass_06.JPG



Not bad...

http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/data/4276/Mike_Phillips_Machine_Sanding_Glass_03.JPG



:D

[Mike Phillips]

Here's a recent example of using the PBL Twins because I knew the owner would love how it looked and how slippery it makes the paint feel.

1972 Cutlass - Wet-sanded and Ceramic Coated - PBL Diamond Paint Coating (https://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/how-to-articles-by-mike-phillips/129293-1972-cutlass-wet-sanded-ceramic-coated-pbl-diamond-paint-coating.html)

http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/data/4266/1972_Cutlass_Scuff_Buff_024.JPG


We used the PBL Diamond Paint Coating on the paint and then used the PBL Surface Coating OVER the paint coating.


And "yes" we used the PBL Surface Coating on all the glass after we machine polished all the glass.

http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/data/4266/1972_Cutlass_Scuff_Buff_034.JPG


:)

[Desertnate]

Thanks, I guess all the properties lie in between the layers as you said, so maybe what's removed is just some kind of factory coating, if there is any at all.

The UV protection would be between the layers, but I'd think whatever makes the glass hydrophobic is on the exterior surface of the glass itself.


So you are not using any coatings, but my question is - do you avoid polishing glasses as well ? You said 15 years of ownership, but I guess you did polish at some point to deep clean it?

No, I've never polished a windshield on any car other than one instance on an old Toyota SUV we owned a while ago in which I had a couple bug splatters I could not get off by any other means. For my German cars since the water beads up and sheets off so well, I've never had to polish them at all. I've kept them clean with normal maintenance and/or a clay bar and I've not had any issues with hard staining/streaking, so far. However, despite my best efforts, our Toyota Highlander is starting to see some staining on the side windows which will require polishing and my daughter's car we purchased used also needs the side windows to be polished as well. Neither of those seem to have whatever the German auto makers use on their glass.

I don't coat/seal glass based on experience with a Mazda I owned one. I used a sealant on the car for that windshield, and while it worked great in a hard rain, I found in misty/drizzzle/snowy conditions it smeared the water really bad. During the day it wasn't a problem, but at night it really hampered visibility. Cleaning repeatedly with a stong window cleaner and a clay bar helped.

On my current BMW I tried the Aquapel glass coating on the rear window. The window beaded/sheeted water pretty well already, but since it's a coupe and the window is at a steep angle I wanted to make it shed water faster. After applying the coating, I saw no improvement over what the OEM glass did from the factory, so I've not used it again. It might work better on US, Japanese or Korean cars.


The car came brand new, but had a lot of nasty stuff on the windshield - for example a number written with some kind of white chalk, and also some deposits. I guess the proper way to clean the windshield and all the side and rear windows, would be to polish and remove all of those nasty stuff? I mean we didn't do any harm , polishing is the correct way?

I'm not a glass expert by any way, but I've used APC's, bug/tar remover, and a clay bar in the past to get some of that stuff off. It all depends on what it is. Polishing may have been the only choice if nothing else worked. I could see a car sitting on a lot for a long time having issues from sprinkler water and other contaminates in the air staining the glass.[/quote]


And one more - what about side and rear ? I think it's perfectly fine to polish and coat, right?

Like Mike demonstrated you can do any of the windows if needed, I've just found the glass from at least two German automakers already has the same properties as a coating. As mentioned above, I'm going to need to do the side windows of my two Japanese cars, but they've just now got to that point after many years/miles. When I'm washing those cars, I will wipe down the side/rear windows with whatever QD I'm using to eliminate any water spots, but I don't do the windshield.


I guess it all depends on the detailer doing the job, but just to understand people's thoughts. Absolutely. Lots of variable and conditions, I'm just one person sharing how I approach the problem. I'm sure others will disagree with me and have very valid points for their approach, which is just fine. We all learn.

[PA DETAILER]

Currently experiencing the same thing. Wipers are close to new. Glass currently wearing Pinnacle glass coat. When i use the washers, they are fine. When it rains i will get dragging on the wipers. No noise, but you can clearly see them drag. So when weather permits this week, going to start from ground zero. Stopped by AA today and picked up Invisible Glass GLASS STRIPPER. Removes water spots, coatings, road film and contaminants. I have a bottle of DP coating prep polish that maybe would have been ok to use also? I will observe the results after the GLASS STRIPPER. Because you do final rinse of water after using the product. If i had to guess, this should work. Then if it does i am hesitant to use any more glass coatings on the windshield in the future. As mentioned above, using any coating will cause some amount of wiper chatter or drag.


Good read on the subject....Treated glass is so slick, it tends to GRAB the wipers.

Please Wait... | Cloudflare (https://www.wiperbladesusa.com/wiper-blade-chatter-noise)

Blades are designed to WIPE the glass surface free of water and whatever down to the glass. But if the surface contains wax and other compounds designed to "stay" or "adhere" to the windshield surface it's actually going to be a battle between the waxy compound and the rubber wiper blade. Thus the chatter.