What causes black paint to look "gray" in sunlight?

[pittpens24]

Under the Led lighting in my garage both my truck and car looked phenomenal until I pulled them out into the sun. I noticed they both had a grayish look. And just like that old Metallica song, it will "Fade to Black" during the next 12 hours or so.
Wondering if that is the result of a cool panel hitting direct sunlight?
I couldn't wait to pull it out of the garage when done to be like Im the MAN:awesome: but that quickly turned into :dunno:

Is this common? What would have happened if I would have done a Ceramic top coat? Would that have locked in the "gray"?

[Mike Phillips]

Micro-marring makes black paint look grey.

When you scratch something clear the scratch or scratches are whitish or opaque. This makes black paint look grey.

:)

[pittpens24]

Micro-marring makes black paint look grey.

When you scratch something clear the scratch or scratches are whitish or opaque. This makes black paint look grey.

:)So did I do something wrong? Under my led inspection light it looks flawless.
Did I use the wrong finishing pad?


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[Mike Phillips]

I'm not sure what could be causing your black paint to look grey in different light conditions, it could just be the paint?


Has the paint EVER been machine polished? Perhaps even at the dealership?


Here's some recent pictures I took that show micro-marring. I didn't take pictures of the paint before I micro-marred it but I can and that will show you what black paint looks like compared to grey paint from micro-marring.


Pictures of Micro-Marring - DA Haze - Tick Marks - Compounds - Polishes - AIOs - Clearcoat Paints (https://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/how-to-articles-by-mike-phillips/123669-pictures-micro-marring-da-haze-tick-marks-compounds-polishes-aios-clearcoat-paints.html)


:)

[pittpens24]

I'm not sure what could be causing your black paint to look grey in different light conditions, it could just be the paint?


Has the paint EVER been machine polished? Perhaps even at the dealership?


Here's some recent pictures I took that show micro-marring. I didn't take pictures of the paint before I micro-marred it but I can and that will show you what black paint looks like compared to grey paint from micro-marring.


Pictures of Micro-Marring - DA Haze - Tick Marks - Compounds - Polishes - AIOs - Clearcoat Paints (https://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/how-to-articles-by-mike-phillips/123669-pictures-micro-marring-da-haze-tick-marks-compounds-polishes-aios-clearcoat-paints.html)


:)No nothing like that. I had a perfect reflection. But did have that gray tint
Not sure what the dealer did.
I washed
Clayed
Mezerna 2500
Mezerna 3500
CG blacklight
WGPS
Then Fuzion
I did have issues with the Fuzion but black is black and gray is gray.
Looked even better after 1st wash a week later

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[SWETM]

It can be that you didn't get everything off of any of the Blacklight or WGPS or Fusion. Could be the Fusion since it's got better when washed. And could even be a bad reaction between the different products. Some LSP products can even tone down and degrade the gloss on a paint that you polished to a high gloss.

I asume you followed the direction from the manufactures when it's able to be putting on an extra layer or layered with another product. Most sealants needs it's time to crosslink and bond properly before relayered. If it where me I have skipped the Blacklight. And apply the WGPS and let it sit for 24 hours after the wipe off. Then top it up with the Fusion.

[pittpens24]

It can be that you didn't get everything off of any of the Blacklight or WGPS or Fusion. Could be the Fusion since it's got better when washed. And could even be a bad reaction between the different products. Some LSP products can even tone down and degrade the gloss on a paint that you polished to a high gloss.

I asume you followed the direction from the manufactures when it's able to be putting on an extra layer or layered with another product. Most sealants needs it's time to crosslink and bond properly before relayered. If it where me I have skipped the Blacklight. And apply the WGPS and let it sit for 24 hours after the wipe off. Then top it up with the Fusion.I did follow the manufacturer's dry times on the blacklight before going to WGPS and allowed 17 hours dry time before topping with fuzion.

Happened with my car too. With that I used Meg's UC, followed by their showcar glaze and then their Gold Class all by their recommendations. Hated the glaze. Went through a ton of mf's to get all the oils off.

Maybe I should state that I am colorblind, but took a test online and could actually differentiate between more colors than someone who is not cllorblind. Maybe it is just me?

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[custmsprty]

Ditch the Blacklight.

Stick with these two:

WGPS
Then Fuzion

[pittpens24]

Already in the garbage can

[SWETM]

No don't think that it's that you are colorblind at all. That's useally when you get the green and red beside each other that you could have problems.

I just added an extra option of what it can be. And it's hard to know without seeing it and also trouble shooting it. If it's important to really know what happens.

To maybe get to know what's happens if anything or it's just as the paint are on both your truck and car. I would re-polishing the trunk lid or the hood with the SF3800 and a finishing pad or light polishing pad. Use a panel prep wipe product to get off the oils in the kind of oily SF3800. And take out the car and inspect it under the sunlight or daylight. If it's as want it to look at the little deeper black it's awesome. But if you have that grayish look from it I would think it's how the paint is. It's an extremly thin color base coat layer painted on vehicals today. And that can make it under the sunlight to you see through the black paint and down to the primer. That's one thing that bodyshops has problems with even when useing oem paint or the exact oem color code. It's not possible to paint as thin as the oem color base coat layer or the clearcoat layer as the paint robot does. This means the repainted part often gets richer and deeper looking. There are painters that can come close enough so it's not visual for the human eye to see the difference. But most needs a little more paint and that can be what makes the difference.

If you are satisfied with the black paint you got from the re-polishing. Apply the WGPS and let it cure and do the same again to take it out in the sunlight and inspect it. Still fine black paint and you want the carnuaba glow look. Apply the Fuzion and let this also cure until the next day and take it out in the sunlight and inspect it as before. Here you will notice if any of this products got you the grayish look or not and it's where the Blacklight that did. You could be doing 3 or 4 sections where you have the different products beside each other. 1 section polished bare paint and 2nd section WGPS and 3rd Fuzion and 4th WGPS and Fuzion. Then you will see how they and if they change the looks of your black paint. If you get McKees N-914 Rinseless Wash you can dilute it in waterless wash dilution. And do a wipe down with it to get any excess product off it before a second inspection. It don't leaves anything behind as most waterless wash or rinseless wash does so you get what you have on the paint. And all this is also if you really want to know what's happens if anything do.

[Desertnate]

Just throwing out another option.

I've never used Fuzion, but could it be "sweating" in high heat/humidty like Collinite 845 does? With 845, if you put it a little too thick it will haze up in places when exposed to high heat and humidity like what would be encountered when sitting outside.

In that case, either washing or a quick wipe down with a QD spray removes the hazing.

[2black1s]

First off let me say that what your seeing is very common with today's clear-coated blacks and is most likely not caused by anything you did. I have a black Chevy truck that exhibits a similar condition under certain light conditions, although I would describe any color shift on mine to be towards a dingy brownish hue, not so much gray.

My theory for what causes this color shifting of black in varying light conditions is as follows:

- The toners used in different black base-coat formulations may reflect light differently than others.

- The base-coat may be applied in too thin of a layer to achieve complete opacity, thus the underlying primer may be telegraphing through the black base-coat in high intensity light situations.

- Not all clear-coats are crystal clear. Depending on your clear-coat, this may play into it.

- All clear-coats will exhibit some degree of haziness under certain light conditions and from certain angles. This may appear as a slight color-shift or a general "washing out" of the color; and is especially noticeable on black, more so than any other color.

To further expand on my last bullet, back in my painting days (primarily in the 1970s - 1990s) I always found that the blackest, most brilliant, blacks were single-stage. Anytime a clear-coat was added, the "haziness" I described certainly ensued.

[pittpens24]

One other thing that I realized after reading about detailing that I missed and it could have been that big oops. I never wiped it down after polishing to remove the oils. Never saw that step until now. Both the car and truck missed this step. Could that have something to do with it as well?

[pittpens24]

First off let me say that what your seeing is very common with today's clear-coated blacks and is most likely not caused by anything you did. I have a black Chevy truck that exhibits a similar condition under certain light conditions, although I would describe any color shift on mine to be towards a dingy brownish hue, not so much gray.

My theory for what causes this color shifting of black in varying light conditions is as follows:

- The toners used in different black base-coat formulations may reflect light differently than others.

- The base-coat may be applied in too thin of a layer to achieve complete opacity, thus the underlying primer may be telegraphing through the black base-coat in high intensity light situations.

- Not all clear-coats are crystal clear. Depending on your clear-coat, this may play into it.

- All clear-coats will exhibit some degree of haziness under certain light conditions and from certain angles. This may appear as a slight color-shift or a general "washing out" of the color; and is especially noticeable on black, more so than any other color.

To further expand on my last bullet, back in my painting days (primarily in the 1970s - 1990s) I always found that the blackest, most brilliant, blacks were single-stage. Anytime a clear-coat was added, the "haziness" I described certainly ensued.

Yeah I see that brownish tinge too at certain intervals but this was different. Actually looked as though in my diminished capacity about detailing, that I used too rough of a pad and caused hazing, but through the led inspection light it was crystal clear.

My truck has that brown tinge whereas my car is the blackest black I could find - House of Kolor. It is actually a blue black and looks like ink when polished correctly

[2black1s]

Removing polishing oils seems to be a debated subject. Some guys do, some don't.

I've been polishing paint since the 1970s (not professionally for this entire time) and I have never done a dedicated step to remove polishing oils.

I doubt that is your issue.

I'd only be concerned if the product(s) you're using clearly specify that stripping the oils is required.