A question of claying and working backwards?

[fightnews]

Any of these synthetic clay mitts, towels, real clay bars ect marr the living heck out of your paint. Is this really worth doing when your car is in great shape. All it does is make your paint worse. Is this not working backwards?

I know it's very superficial and comes out easy but still. I've use the finest bars and sponges. They still cause a great deal of marring. Especially if u do it quick after the decon wash.

If your car is properly maintained is it really picking up enough contamination to justify doing this? Now you're polishing step is going to get you back to where you were instead of somewhere more refined.

Thoughts?

[Setec Astronomy]

I find when I maintain my cars well, I get almost nothing off when I clay...so little that I wonder why I am bothering to do it. Now, last couple of years I've been pretty lax...I wouldn't be surprised if my clay results are different now...but I probably won't know that until spring.

[MikeC78]

Just depends on your vehicle and driving conditions. I sometimes find the lower rocker and fender well areas requiring a bit of claying or tar removal from time to time, the rest of my vehicle not so much.

[Eldorado2k]

Just depends on your vehicle and driving conditions. I sometimes find the lower rocker and fender well areas requiring a bit of claying or tar removal from time to time, the rest of my vehicle not so much.

Call me crazy, but I find that all vehicles have the least amount of contaminants below the belt line and absolutely no contaminants ever on the wheels.

Just a couple of days ago, I was doing a waterless wash for a friend of mine in order for him to slap a car cover on the car before it rained. The paint was heavily contaminated on the horizontal panels from sitting outside [its in the process of being restored and is prepped for paintjob]
Vertical panels you can feel a bit less contamination... But the moment you run your hand below the body line on the side of the car it’s absolutely smooth. This was a clear indication that contaminants mainly affected the top sides of vehicles, hence the term “fallout”.

I’ll stick to my guns. Lower portions of vehicles always have the least amount of contaminants and wheels have absolutely none. I challenge anyone to clay the face of their wheels after using a wheel cleaner and show contaminants on the claybar.

[MikeC78]

If you ever drive in places that use rock chip and tar, you'll see it much differently. I'm not saying my particular situation is the same as yours, and its mostly certainly dependent on many factor including your geographic location.

[Eldorado2k]

If you ever drive in places that use rock chip and tar, you'll see it much differently. I'm not saying my particular situation is the same as yours, and its mostly certainly dependent on many factor including your geographic location.

I will find tar down there. But as far as baggie test failing grit, it’s always noticeably less IME.

[itsgn]

Call me crazy, but I find that all vehicles have the least amount of contaminants below the belt line and absolutely no contaminants ever on the wheels.
In my experience the most contaminated areas of most cars are a feet long area right behind the wheel wells/fenders under the belt line, the hood and the top/roof of the car. Horizontal surfaces generally get more contaminated than vertical ones (and that's because most of the surface below the belt line is usually not that much contaminated), because solved or floating particles settle easier on them, and also because any and all protection (and also the clear coat) gets degraded faster on horizontal surfaces. The reason for the latter being is that rain drops and the incident rays of the sunlight reach them in a sharper angle and in a larger amount, than the vertical surfaces.

Wheels do not get really contaminated, because their surfaces are vertically aligned, the fender and the tire (which extends over the actual rim) prevents most - if not all - of the stuff hitting them head-on. And also because they're essentially constantly spinning, which in turn means that anything that gets them on will most likely get slung off immediately or shortly by the centrifugal and centripetal forces (with the only exception being probably the surface of the wheel cap).

[Bruno Soares]

My NanoSkin used to marr a lot too but once I stopped using ONR as lube and started using Glide things got so much better. I should have followed manufacture’s recommendation and would have had a better time with it from the beginning.

[Rsurfer]

Wheels do not get really contaminated, because their surfaces are vertically aligned, the fender and the tire (which extends over the actual rim) prevents most - if not all - of the stuff hitting them head-on. And also because they're essentially constantly spinning, which in turn means that anything that gets them on will most likely get slung off immediately or shortly by the centrifugal and centripetal forces (with the only exception being probably the surface of the wheel cap).

Tell that to Mercedes and BMW owners.

[PaulMys]

Call me crazy, but I find that all vehicles have the least amount of contaminants below the belt line and absolutely no contaminants ever on the wheels.

Just a couple of days ago, I was doing a waterless wash for a friend of mine in order for him to slap a car cover on the car before it rained. The paint was heavily contaminated on the horizontal panels from sitting outside [its in the process of being restored and is prepped for paintjob]
Vertical panels you can feel a bit less contamination... But the moment you run your hand below the body line on the side of the car it’s absolutely smooth. This was a clear indication that contaminants mainly affected the top sides of vehicles, hence the term “fallout”.

I’ll stick to my guns. Lower portions of vehicles always have the least amount of contaminants and wheels have absolutely none. I challenge anyone to clay the face of their wheels after using a wheel cleaner and show contaminants on the claybar.

You ever drive a Caddy through a snow bank (end of the driveway), and then onto dirty salted roads?

I'm telling you, Eldo.... That crap does some serious clinging to the lower parts and wheels. It sucks.

Let's switch locations for the winter, Ric. It's was a balmy 17 degrees here this morning. LOL

That said, in warmer temps, I can totally see your point about horizontal vs. vertical. Just makes sense.

[FUNX650]

Any of these synthetic clay mitts, towels, real clay bars ect marr the living heck out of your paint. Is this really worth doing when your car is in great shape. All it does is make your paint worse. Is this not working backwards?

I know it's very superficial and comes out easy but still. I've use the finest bars and sponges. They still cause a great deal of marring. Especially if u do it quick after the decon wash.

If your car is properly maintained is it really picking up enough contamination to justify doing this? Now you're polishing step is going to get you back to where you were instead of somewhere more refined.

Thoughts?
•First of all:
-I always do ”The Baggie Test”: to
determine if I actually need to Clay
any of my vehicles at that given point
in time.


{Note:
•If I determine that Claying is necessary,
then, afterwards: I always perform, at the
very least, a Finishing Polish step—whether
there’s any sign of “Clay-marring”, or not.}


Bob

[LSNAutoDetailing]

Typically I never clay unless I'm prepared to do some form of correction after.

[fightnews]

•First of all:
-I always do ”The Baggie Test”: to
determine if I actually need to Clay
any of my vehicles at that given point
in time.


{Note:
•If I determine that Claying is necessary,
then, afterwards: I always perform, at the
very least, a Finishing Polish step—whether
there’s any sign of “Clay-marring”, or not.}


Bob Yes I usually do this but I had some time after a wash before I could get it in the garage so I just clayed the whole thing after washing while it was still wet.

Nobody is disputing the polishing step but like I said now you are polishing damaged paint instead of undamaged paint from claying. Would you not get a more refined result from your polishing step if you weren't correcting clay marring?

I used a fine grade nanoskin sponge with lots of n914 for lube. I made 2 gallons and went heavy on the lube and still got excessive marring. The paint was in good shape before the sponge marred the living heck out of it.


Typically I never clay unless I'm prepared to do some form of correction after.

Again nobody is disputing this. I've used a lot of clays and nanoskins and the gentlest way Ive found is using the fine grade poly clay on a dry car. But still I get marring on my car no matter what I use. A regular grade clay bar does a lot of damage.

[itsgn]

Would you not get a more refined result from your polishing step if you weren't correcting clay marring?
In my experience the damage that clay baring is or might be causing (because it does not seem to do it always) is well below what a finishing polish can remove - somewhere at the level or just slightly beyond that of holograms, but definitely not swirl level defects. So, in that regard, it makes no difference, because polishing the paint will remove also any and all defects that have been caused by the clay baring process.

However, on the other side, if you wouldn't have clay bared the paint prior to polishing, the contaminants that they clay bar could have removed could very well interfere with the final polishing process itself, by getting caught up into the polishing compound, and cause similar marring to what a clay bar would have caused in the first place. Except of course now you couldn't correct that marring (or at least not without another blob of compound, and another set of passes over the paint), because it would be your polish that would keep reintroducing them into the paint.

So, that's why my answer on your question would be a sound "no", or a "on the contrary: you'd possibly get a worse finish if you wouldn't clay bar first". I personally would always clay bar a paint prior to polishing it whenever there's indication of contamination. And there always is, unless the paint has been polished and/or coated just a few days or weeks ago.

[FUNX650]

•First of all:
-I always do ”The Baggie Test”: to
determine if I actually need to Clay
any of my vehicles at that given point
in time.




Yes I usually do this
but I had some time after a wash
before I could get it in the garage

so I just clayed the whole thing after
washing while it was still wet.

•IMO:
-Just going ahead and Claying, without
first doing “The Baggie Test”, is the
source of your remorse.

-I’d, also, not be too happy because I not
only unnecessarily marred an already
near-perfect paint finish, but now the
paint needs to be repolished—there goes
some more precious CC down the drain.



Bob