DA Haze - SF3800 - Black Metallic - Please Help

[Tim711]

Hi,

I am performing my first paint correction on >my< brand NEW car. It's a 2017 VW Golf R in BLACK metallic, so the last thing I want to do is make a mistake.

I'm a notice and I have been taking my time with the whole project as I want to learn as much as I can along the way. I have read many articles and watched many how to videos over many years but I have never performed a paint correction. This was an unexpected purchase and I had to jump right into the project with what knowledge I have gathered so far.

I did work on a test spot first to determine what combination would work best.

The vehicle is NEW and was delivered with a car cover, that I was allowed to remove. There is however a lot a marring / light scratches around the entire car, probably from the cover flapping in the wind and the car exchanging hands. The overall paint did not seem too bad at FIRST with the lighting I had at the time, it just appeared to have many small defects. I'm afraid to remove too much clear coat as I am not sure if the paint is soft. From my lack of knowledge, it appears as though the paint is on the softer side as I am able to remove most of defects / light scratches using a Rupes Yellow cutting pad with Menzerna Super Finish Plus SF3800, using my Rupes iBrid Nano on a speed of 3.75-4 and completing about 6-12 section passes. For deeper scratches I stepped up to yellow pads with Menzerna Medium Cut Polish MC2400.

Since I'm afraid to make a mistake on >my< BLACK car and the paint appearing to be soft I decided to try a combo that would be the least aggressive. This may not be the conventional or quickest method to correct the paint but I decided to remove the bulk of the minor defects using 5" Rupes White polishing pads with SF3800, using my 6" GG DA on a speed of 5, 4 section passes. My thought being that the car didn't have heavy swirls but rather small defects and rids. I did this rather than a using a cutting compound with a cutting pad as the paint to me seems soft and I didn't want to get aggressive. I then followed this by surigically removing the small defects using the Rupes Nano and yellow pads with SF3800 or MC2400 on a speed of 3.75-4. For the final polishing step I used 5" Rupes White pads and SF3800, using my GG DA on a speed of 4.5, 4 section passes. These combinations / steps on my test spot seemed to remove the majority of the defects and leave a perfect finish with the lighting I used at the time of my test spot, which were generic brand PAR38 5000K Cree COB LED lights.

However, I recently purchased better lighting; SCANGRIP Sunmatch 2, I-Match 2, and Matchpen lights. These lights are seriously amazing! So good that now I am able to see many more light scratches and rids that I wasn't able to see the first time.

I decided to go back to the hood and roof to remove more of these defects that were left behind. I went back with the Nano, yellow pads, MC2400 and SF3800 to surgically remove more defects. This time instead of going straight to the final polishing step, I decided to add a further step by using 5" Yellow cutting pads with the GG on a speed of 5, 4 section passes. I added this step thinking this may help remove more of what I may have missed with the Nano and hazing from the MC2400. I followed this with the final polishing step but at a speed of 4 instead of 4.5, 4 section passes.

When I was removing the polish after the final polishing step, I noticed a haze on the roof using my I-Match headlamp which was distorting the light at angles as if there is a slight haze / swirls left. The haze is very minor and was difficult to catch at first, even with the Scangrip lighting, but it's there and it's bugging me a lot.

I am confused to what this may be a result from? Could it possibly be from; the added step of using the 5" yellow cutting pads and the paint being soft before proceeding to the final polishing step or something to do with the final polishing step? I am working on about 2' by 2' sections and sometimes 2' by 2.5'.

I have been working on the vehicle for several months as it is difficult as a beginner and being forced to jump right in. I have been working on the vehicle for far too long now, this is my daily driver after all, but I am very persistent to get the paint correction to perfection and be able to maintain it from this point forward. I would also like to figure this out to know what combo is best for future maintenance polishes.

I am not sure at this point what the problem is and what would be best to try next to polish the paint to perfection without leaving a haze.

Any help would be greatly appreciated as I am running out of time for my own trial and error as it is getting late in the year and I still have the entire car to finish. :(

I don't mind purchasing new tools or products if it would help. Would it be a good idea to invest into a nice Rupes LHR 21 MKII, LHR 15 MKII, and/or LHR 75E to speed up my project, rather than using my 6" and 3" GG, as these are planned future purchases anyways?

Thank you for your help,
Tim

[dlc95]

I suppose the first thing I would try is a traditional finishing pad, like a black or blue Lake Country with the 3800.

Yellow Rupes polishing pads with the 2400 will do a great job polishing the paint. The yellow is actually capable of finishing out beautifully with many types of polishes too.

I'm not familiar with Menzerna 2400, but it could be 3800 isn't strong enough to remove the marring that 2400 might be leaving behind. Something like 3500 would be able to do that.

[WRAPT C5Z06]

Menzerna 3800 is very oily. Make sure you're not mistaking haze for the residual polishing oils left behind. What kind of MF towels are you using?

[DaveT435]

What kind of towel are you using to remove the polish?? Are you needing to apply pressure?? If the paint is indeed very soft you may be marring it when your wiping polish. If your needing to apply pressure to remove the polish try using a quick detailer when removing the polish. I've never had an issue with the yellow Rupes pad leaving marring.

The only other thing I would say is make sure your working the polish all the way.

[Tim711]

I suppose the first thing I would try is a traditional finishing pad, like a black or blue Lake Country with the 3800.

Yellow Rupes polishing pads with the 2400 will do a great job polishing the paint. The yellow is actually capable of finishing out beautifully with many types of polishes too.

I'm not familiar with Menzerna 2400, but it could be 3800 isn't strong enough to remove the marring that 2400 might be leaving behind. Something like 3500 would be able to do that.

The Menzerna 2400 was only used for isolated areas, many many isolated scratches, with smaller 1-2" Rupes Nano Yellow cutting pads and not for the entire panel with larger pads. The entire panel was polished using Rupes Yellow cutting pads and Menzerna SF3800 not MC2400.


Menzerna 3800 is very oily. Make sure you're not mistaking haze for the residual polishing oils left behind. What kind of MF towels are you using?

I did remove any residual polishing oils left behind by using Microfiber Madness Yellow Fellow 2.0 towels with Gyeon Prep or CarPro Eraser.


What kind of towel are you using to remove the polish?? Are you needing to apply pressure?? If the paint is indeed very soft you may be marring it when your wiping polish. If your needing to apply pressure to remove the polish try using a quick detailer when removing the polish. I've never had an issue with the yellow Rupes pad leaving marring.

The only other thing I would say is make sure your working the polish all the way.

I am using Microfiber Madness Yellow Fellow 2.0 towels to remove the polish and when using Gyeon Prep or CarPro Eraser to remove the remaining polish oils. I don't need to apply much of any pressure, just back and forth strokes and it seems to come off easy often, not sure the normal as I am a novice. Would a quick detailer leave behind traces of polymers that I don't want before applying my protection? Would Eraser or Prep be a better option to aid in wiping off of the polish and not leaving anything behind?

[Paul A.]

The only other thing I would say is make sure your working the polish all the way.

My thoughts also. Menzerna uses diminishing abrasives and I work them a long time. Initial moderate machine pressure then reduced to machine weight only and sometimes negative weight. I like to think I've worked those fine abrasives down to maybe talcum powder like effect.

Plus super clean towels.

[Tim711]

My thoughts also. Menzerna uses diminishing abrasives and I work them a long time. Initial moderate machine pressure then reduced to machine weight only and sometimes negative weight. I like to think I've worked those fine abrasives down to maybe talcum powder like effect.

Plus super clean towels.

Hi Paul, I worked in a slightly larger section than maybe I should have, 2' by 2' or 2' by 2.5', and did 4 section passes. The polish was worked down until you could barely see any oils behind and caused dusting. So much so that the Rupes Yellow and White 5" pads on my 6" GG would get soo hot that some are actually damaged. Steam would come off the pads when finished and the foam is separating around the edge where the velcro adheres to the foam. Even the middle of the foam on some shrunk / distorted and are ruined. So, I would imagine I worked the polish long enough, even though I didn't do the traditional 6 section passes, but maybe I am working in too big of a section? I didn't use much pressure, just the weight of the machine and a little pressure to keep it planted and not hopping around.

[WRAPT C5Z06]

If you live in the USA, PM me your address. I will send you a sample of Scholl S30+. It's the best finishing polish I've ever used on soft black paint.


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[Tim711]

I am using freshly washed pads each time after the 4 passes on one section. The pads are being fully primed on the entire face the foam pad and the sides followed by three larger than a pee sized drops.

[Tim711]

If you live in the USA, PM me your address. I will send you a sample of Scholl S30+. It's the best finishing polish I've ever used on soft black paint.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Unfortunately, I live in Canada but I do appreciate your kind offer, thank you. Being in Canada and getting later in the Calendar year I am starting to panic about getting the paint how I want. It's hard to get much work done during week nights after work and my weekends being a beginner.

[Bruno Soares]

Being a VW I bet the paint is actually hard. My grey MK7 GTI has pretty hard paint and 3800 would not cut anything on its clear coat.

[Tim711]

Being a VW I bet the paint is actually hard. My grey MK7 GTI has pretty hard paint and 3800 would not cut anything on its clear coat.

This may be the case but I am confused to how the micro marring occurred with my gentle washing regiment, fresh pads, and quality microfiber towels. I haven't looked at the other panels in depth but the hood and roof definitely have the haze which were the only panels that saw the 5" Rupes Yellow Cutting pads.

[WRAPT C5Z06]

Unfortunately, I live in Canada but I do appreciate your kind offer, thank you. Being in Canada and getting later in the Calendar year I am starting to panic about getting the paint how I want. It's hard to get much work done during week nights after work and my weekends being a beginner.
Canada is OK. I get free shipping at work. PM me your address.

I'd use 3 pea sized drops after priming. Don't use too much polish.

[jjamesh87]

The polish was worked down until you could barely see any oils behind and caused dusting. So much so that the Rupes Yellow and White 5" pads on my 6" GG would get soo hot that some are actually damaged. Steam would come off the pads when finished and the foam is separating around the edge where the velcro adheres to the foam. Even the middle of the foam on some shrunk / distorted and are ruined. So, I would imagine I worked the polish long enough, even though I didn't do the traditional 6 section passes, but maybe I am working in too big of a section? I didn't use much pressure, just the weight of the machine and a little pressure to keep it planted and not hopping around.

Im no expert by any means, but im willing to bet this is why youre having issues. maybe try a bit quicker arm speed? are you swapping pads often before they get loaded up? I use only menzerna abrasives with my GG6 and LC 5.5" flat pads and have never ran into this issue. even having ran HC400 long enough to dust before knowing any better.

jesse

[Tim711]

Im no expert by any means, but im willing to bet this is why youre having issues. maybe try a bit quicker arm speed? are you swapping pads often before they get loaded up? I use only menzerna abrasives with my GG6 and LC 5.5" flat pads and have never ran into this issue. even having ran HC400 long enough to dust before knowing any better.

jesse

The steam was coming off the pad when removed from the backing plate if that matters. The yellow pads took the worst abuse and I ruined about 3 out of the 4 I have. The white didn't get damaged around the velcro to foam section but some did dimple or sink in around the center of the pad.

I am swapping pads out after each section (4 passes) with freshly washed / dried pads. Maybe I am moving way too slow after all.