Washing Microfiber towels - what temp ?

[Souldetailer]

Cold, low heat.

[Rsurfer]

Hot, med heat.

[kkritsilas]

I'm with Mantligh, hot and high.



This information is just false. I don't know why TRC keeps pushing this false data, I had seen them do it through Yvan at OPT, and apparently through the Junkman also. Here's a chart of melting points in degrees C: Polyamide plays an important role in automotive, electronic and packaging (http://www.plastemart.com/upload/Literature/Polyamide.asp) . The lowest melting temperature is 352 F.

I'm not sure which polyamide grade is commonly used for MF towels, but even if you look at the heat distortion temperature the lowest temperature, converted to degrees F, is 239. And if you look at Nylon 6, or 6,6, which are the most common and what I would suspect towels are made of, that heat distortion is temp is 338 and 437 F, while the melting temps are 431 and 500 F.

My recollection may have been wrong, or it could have been the polyester that starts to melt at 140F, or the combination of Polyester and Polyamide. Even if incorrect, the whole question becomes what does hot water get you over warm water? By all accounts, warm water with a good for microfiber soap seems to get the microfiber clean just fine. So why use hot? The TRC has nothing to gain financially from telling people to wash in warm vs. hot, so there is no ulterior motive that I can see. Seeing as they are a vendor who has specific knowledge of the product, I would have no reason to do otherwose, unless I had the time and money to do my own testing (grab a bunch of microfiber towels, was them repeatedly at say 120F, 130F, 140F, 150 F, and 160F, while examining the fibers with a microscope after each wash for any evidence of melting). Since I cannot do that, there are far worse things to do than to follow the manufacturer's, or in this case, the people who had the towels manufactured for them, recommendations regarding washing.

And while you have pointed at TRC, note that Larry ??? (don't know his last name) at AMMONYC, Gary Dean, and a variety of other people have also said that warm water is fine for washing microfiber towels.

Basic question to be asked remains: What improvement are you getting by washing microfiber towels at hot vs. warm?

[Rsurfer]

Basic question to be asked remains: What improvement are you getting by washing microfiber towels at hot vs. warm?


Because hot water will make dirt and grime release better than in cold water. Some waxes may not even release when washed in warm water.

I have boiled mf with no bad results.

Would you rather use warm or hot water when extracting soiled carpets?

[Eldorado2k]

Basic question to be asked remains: What improvement are you getting by washing microfiber towels at hot vs. warm?

If water temperature didn't make a difference in overall cleaning ability, then there wouldn't be such a huge difference in the cleaning abilities between an entry level steamer such as the Mcculloch 1275, which can bearly generate steam temperatures of around 180-200 degrees if you're lucky, compared to the higher quality professional grade steamers which produce steam at temperatures of 300+ degrees without breaking a sweat.

And it's not all about the psi of the machine either, trust me I've got a McCulloch, and it's a no branier that it's lack of heat holds it back from being able to do the real cleaning you see in the infomercials [where soap scum magically melts away from shower tiles]
The fact is the McCulloch 1275 is very limited in its real deal cleaning power and it has as much to do with temperature as it does it's lack of psi compared to higher grade units.

Heat matters when trying to clean heavy duty grit off most any surfaces with only a few exceptions, such as when working with bleach, it works better in cold water.. But when it comes to cleaning heavy dirt and grit + compound/polish residue off of microfiber towels, hot trumps warm any day of the week.

Why do you think Woolite recommends using cold water? Because you're bearly cleaning those select delicate garmets you're using it with, and that right there is a pretty basic indicator that washing in cold water vs. hot equals a lighter ability to clean vs. using a detergent in hot water.

I could be wrong, but it seems logical to me.


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[kkritsilas]

Carpets are not microfiber, so that is an invalid, and way out comparison. I don't know of a lot of carpeting being used to polish paint, however, if you are, then you may have a point. I also don't walk on microfiber like I would on a carpet. Like I said, not an apple to apple comparison. There is however, plenty of anecdotal evidence, even in this thread, that warm and even cold water will get microfiber clean. The people I cited above are also well established detailers, and have no reason to provide any false/misleading information. There is NO cash to be made by any of the above people by recommending warm water washing vs. hot.water washing. In Gay Dean's case, and The Rag Company's case, both of whom sell microfiber towels, it is to their benefit to have their microfiber washed in hot, in the hope that the towels would be damaged so that they can sell you more towels.

Your microfiber SHOULD NOT HAVE HEAVY STAINS, GRIT, OIL, OR GREASE ON THEM. What exactly are you using your microfiber towels for, anyway? You should not be mixing your paint microfiber towels, either (paint only, interior only, engine compartment only). If your microfiber has genuine grit on it, as opposed to compound or polish residue, then you should be outside re-polishing your car. If they do get stains or grease on them, either throw them out, or move them to engine compartment duty. How many times has it been said that mixing microfiber towels should not be done? Not by me, but by a lot better qualified people than I. see above list of people that I have cited.

Woolite can be used for a lot of things. Delicates, in terms of clothes/garments, are washed in cold water for a number of reasons. One of which is that the colors may run. Another is because the delicates may shrink. It can also be that some delicates will not stand up to hot water (see silk, some microfiber shirts, and pretty much all clothes that need to be dry cleaned). An additional one is that most delicates don't really get that dirty, they are worn very briefly, at most for 12-15 hours every few months, in usually very benign environments, so they don't get a chance to get dirty. How many /heaby equipment/jack hammer operators/mechanics have you seen wearing silk shirts? How many fancy dress shirts at a formal affair do you think have ever had heavy grease stains?

[Eldorado2k]

Carpets are not microfiber, so that is an invalid, and way out comparison. I don't know of a lot of carpeting being used to polish paint, however, if you are, then you may have a point.

Who are you directing that comment towards? If you're talking to me, I Never use the steamer to clean carpets... You can search my posts, I'm 1 of the only people who has always stated that it's absolutely useless for cleaning carpets and upholstery. Lol.

Only time I break out my steamer is when I've got some leather interior that needs cleaning. So I don't know why you're talking about carpets. Lol.

I'm talking about cleaning in general... For example, when you fill a mop bucket, do you choose to fill it with hot or cold water + whatever cleaner you're going to use in the water? I dunno about you, but I will always, naturally fill it with hot water vs. cold... Because it's going to clean better. Common sense.

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[fightnews]

I have a bucket of microfiber towels soaking in 3D towel Kleen overnight to wash tomorrow,I will dry them on low heat but which temp do you all find is best for the wash cycle?

ive been doing mine hot but ive read it being recommended both ways from people who sell the detergents

[fightnews]

I'm with Mantligh, hot and high.



This information is just false. I don't know why TRC keeps pushing this false data, I had seen them do it through Yvan at OPT, and apparently through the Junkman also. Here's a chart of melting points in degrees C: Polyamide plays an important role in automotive, electronic and packaging (http://www.plastemart.com/upload/Literature/Polyamide.asp) . The lowest melting temperature is 352 F.

I'm not sure which polyamide grade is commonly used for MF towels, but even if you look at the heat distortion temperature the lowest temperature, converted to degrees F, is 239. And if you look at Nylon 6, or 6,6, which are the most common and what I would suspect towels are made of, that heat distortion is temp is 338 and 437 F, while the melting temps are 431 and 500 F.

well maybe it doesnt melt but it def changes the towel color and softness, i use the gold plush and i dried a few on high before i switched to low. it didnt ruin the towel but it def changed it in a negative way color and texture

[PA DETAILER]

I was informed always wash with COLD. Air dry.

[fightnews]

Who are you directing that comment towards? If you're talking to me, I Never use the steamer to clean carpets... You can search my posts, I'm 1 of the only people who has always stated that it's absolutely useless for cleaning carpets and upholstery. Lol.

Only time I break out my steamer is when I've got some leather interior that needs cleaning. So I don't know why you're talking about carpets. Lol.

I'm talking about cleaning in general... For example, when you fill a mop bucket, do you choose to fill it with hot or cold water + whatever cleaner you're going to use in the water? I dunno about you, but I will always, naturally fill it with hot water vs. cold... Because it's going to clean better. Common sense.

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all dishwashers run on hot water, commercial dish washers get boosted up to 180 degrees, just throwing it out there

[james751993]

I wash my MFs cold with an extra rinse cycle to get rid of any residual detergents.

[Setec Astronomy]

My recollection may have been wrong, or it could have been the polyester that starts to melt at 140F, or the combination of Polyester and Polyamide. Even if incorrect, the whole question becomes what does hot water get you over warm water? By all accounts, warm water with a good for microfiber soap seems to get the microfiber clean just fine. So why use hot? The TRC has nothing to gain financially from telling people to wash in warm vs. hot, so there is no ulterior motive that I can see. Seeing as they are a vendor who has specific knowledge of the product

Basic question to be asked remains: What improvement are you getting by washing microfiber towels at hot vs. warm?

Well, you're right, in a sense. After checking, I see that polyester has a glass transition temperature of 140°F. Clearly TRC, for whatever reason, has latched onto this piece of data to spread erroneous information through the internet like they are running for president. The only problem is, they don't understand what they are talking about. The melting point of polyester is over 400°F.

To quote the Polymer Science Learning Center: "It's tempting to think of the glass transition as a kind of melting of the polymer. But this is an inaccurate way of looking at things. There are a lot of important differences between the glass transition and melting."

Just as a reference point...you use a lot of things ABOVE the glass transition temperature (Tg)...like your tires, you'd better hope you are using them above the Tg or you might break a hole in the side when you hit a pothole.

As to why hot water cleans better...you have to go back to chemistry, physics, and oh, in general, science (which some posters in this thread have a stated hatred for), which of course also helps you understand the differences between Tg and melting point. The basic reason hot water cleans better is the higher the temperature, the more molecular activity, which means the soils, surfactants, and substrates have a better chance of interacting in the way you want for cleaning.

If you've ever wondered why it's harder to start your car on a cold morning, well, the answer lies in science, where the electrons in your battery don't want to move around as easily, and the molecules in your oil don't want to move past each other as easily, resulting in more friction and less electricity.

[Eldorado2k]

Your microfiber SHOULD NOT HAVE HEAVY STAINS, GRIT, OIL, OR GREASE ON THEM. What exactly are you using your microfiber towels for, anyway? You should not be mixing your paint microfiber towels, either (paint only, interior only, engine compartment only). If your microfiber has genuine grit on it, as opposed to compound or polish residue, then you should be outside re-polishing your car. If they do get stains or grease on them, either throw them out, or move them to engine compartment duty. How many times has it been said that mixing microfiber towels should not be done?

My microfiber towels shouldn't have any grit on them eh? Well what exactly do you think happens when I do a rinseless/waterless wash? Do you think I'm out there wiping down a perfectly clean car?

Grit/dirt on microfiber towel from simply wiping down half of the hood.

http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170102/2018da8ebbd3e3a69f968910539a448a.jpg

Towel after wiping down the entire hood.

http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170102/96d6042915c3dcc59fb94aecfa3fc7b6.jpg

This is what 1 of my microfiber towels typically looks like after performing a waterless wash onthe entire car. This towel only cleaned the paint.

http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170102/99fb05d68432a7e62bbd4d79e45572da.jpg

But according to you I should probably throw this towel out or "move it to engine compartment duty"... And I should also be outside re-polishing my car...

1st of all my paint remains swirl free at all times, so I don't need to be polishing anything. Lol. 2nd of all, you can see why I prefer to use hot water to wash my microfiber towels, because they get dirty. News flash-even paint towels get real dirty!

And thanks for helping me provide a perfect example as to why I use Kirklands for my waterless/rinseless wash duties, and save my good towels [Meguiars Ultimate Wipes] for compound/polish removal.
I do not mix my microfiber towels. Nor do I inflict swirls onto paint. My cat finds your comments a bit insulting. Lol.

http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170102/ad76b73dae70381244291f74605046da.jpg

@Setec Astronomy. Just to clarify, I don't hate science, I hate NASA, because they're a bunch of liars.. But this isn't the time nor the place to get into that. But I don't hate science.





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[Setec Astronomy]

I don't hate science, I hate NASA, because they're a bunch of liars..

Don't tell me you haven't gotten over that fake moon landing thing yet, that was almost 50 years ago!