Should I get two buffers?

[Nick 93]

Hey guys, I've been looking into getting my first buffer for personal use and maybe a little side work. I've been using a Dewalt 849x rotary buffer at my place of work for the last year and I feel that I do pretty good with it. In fact, I felt it was all I would need until I looked into the many kinds of buffers. I've removed deep scratches by wet sanding by hand and have been successful using a wool pad. I would then use two foam pads; one is slightly abrassive and removes swirls while the other is soft and polishes. Anyway, I know what swirl marks are and I don't really have a problem with that but I heard the DA buffers are really good at removing swirls or just everything besides major cutting. Since I'm looking to invest in some detailing supplies would it be a good idea to buy both a rotary and a DA? I've seen people say that after using a DA that they wish they would've made the switch sooner. I have also seen people say that its very difficult to remove holograms with a rotary. Now I'm wondering if I should get both? So far I'm thinking of just starting with the Dewalt to see how I do. Also is it true that you can work faster with a DA? Thanks in advance for any advice?

[GSKR]

Hey guys, I've been looking into getting my first buffer for personal use and maybe a little side work. I've been using a Dewalt 849x rotary buffer at my place of work for the last year and I feel that I do pretty good with it. In fact, I felt it was all I would need until I looked into the many kinds of buffers. I've removed deep scratches by wet sanding by hand and have been successful using a wool pad. I would then use two foam pads; one is slightly abrassive and removes swirls while the other is soft and polishes. Anyway, I know what swirl marks are and I don't really have a problem with that but I heard the DA buffers are really good at removing swirls or just everything besides major cutting. Since I'm looking to invest in some detailing supplies would it be a good idea to buy both a rotary and a DA? I've seen people say that after using a DA that they wish they would've made the switch sooner. I have also seen people say that its very difficult to remove holograms with a rotary. Now I'm wondering if I should get both? So far I'm thinking of just starting with the Dewalt to see how I do. Also is it true that you can work faster with a DA? Thanks in advance for any advice?
Yes always good to have both da and rotary.

[GSKR]

With a da ,you work neat no sling and major dust. Rotary is good for dampsanding heavey intial cut correction or isolated scratches.or just get one machine flex 3401.

[TTQ B4U]

just get one machine flex 3401.

^^ this. I use a 3401 for most everything now and have a smaller Porter Cable 7424xp that is a dedicated 4" unit.

[Setec Astronomy]

I have also seen people say that its very difficult to remove holograms with a rotary. Now I'm wondering if I should get both? So far I'm thinking of just starting with the Dewalt to see how I do. Also is it true that you can work faster with a DA? Thanks in advance for any advice?

Well, I guess you could say that it's difficult to remove holograms with a rotary, because a rotary is usally the cause of the holograms. I'm not sure how anyone figures they can work faster with a DA, unless that means if you count all your steps and cleanup as GSKR noted; if you're talking about defect removal, I'm not sure how anyone could say a DA would be faster, perhaps equal with some of the machines today.

As GSKR suggested a Flex 3401 is kind of a combination of the two machine types.

[Nick 93]

Wow thanks for the quick replies! I'll do some research on the Flex 3401. I did not know there was a combination of the two. Unfortunately I only used what the dealership supplies me so even though I have experience detailing I am still new to a lot of things I have never heard of or seen.

[TTQ B4U]

Wow thanks for the quick replies! I'll do some research on the Flex 3401. I did not know there was a combination of the two. Unfortunately I only used what the dealership supplies me so even though I have experience detailing I am still new to a lot of things I have never heard of or seen.

Get the flex. I started with a non-forced rotation traditional DA and then added a second, one for 6" and the other for 4" pads. Never had an issue with capability of the units just the time involved. The flex won't stop, bog, slow down, etc and while I thought my traditional units were doing fine, I never realized how fast correction with the 3401 could be done. It powers through anything.

Good luck and I don't mean to spend your money but had I known, or used one first hand prior, I'd have bought one a long time ago.

[Setec Astronomy]

The Flex 3401 is a great machine that you should be comfortable with immediately if you've used a rotary, the only thing that might throw you is the direction of rotation is opposite.

[Nick 93]

I just did a youtube search and found the autogeek video on the Flex 3401. Looks to be very impressive. I will be doing some more research but so far I'm fairly convinced on this buffer. I'd rather invest in a good buffer to begin with than invest in something I do not like. I heard that DA buffers take different pads than rotary buffers; does the flex take both or is it one or the other? Also I had some more questions on pads. Usually I use a wool pad on deep scratches but I've seen other detailers that use only foam pads. Are some foam pads as good as cutting as the wool pads are? Can they take out scratches that are fairly deep?

[TTQ B4U]

I heard that DA buffers take different pads than rotary buffers; does the flex take both or is it one or the other? Also I had some more questions on pads.

The range of pads for the 3401 is more extensive but you can use the traditional thicker pads from a DA on the 3401. I'm currently using the stock I have without issue. You just don't want to use the thin pads that one would use on a traditional DA. The hybrid pads are what I'll be moving to but I think there's even a better version coming out soon as well. Choices are great.



Usually I use a wool pad on deep scratches but I've seen other detailers that use only foam pads. Are some foam pads as good as cutting as the wool pads are? Can they take out scratches that are fairly deep?

I use wool on a rotary but not often. Foam on the 3401 takes out most everything without issue. The compound/product is more of a factor than the pad is. Really deep RIDs will likely be best removed or filled and sanded. No different than prior.

[idriveblackcars]

I love Rupes machines but even my mk2 experiences pad stall

[Nick 93]

Thanks for the advice! Its almost overwhelming how many options there are as far as pads and compounds, etc.

[Setec Astronomy]

you can use the traditional thicker pads from a DA on the 3401. I'm currently using the stock I have without issue.

The 3401 is great for using up your thick 7" pads from back when that was what was available for your (original) PC and you don't know what to do with now.

[Mike Phillips]

I just did a youtube search and found the autogeek video on the Flex 3401. Looks to be very impressive.



This one...


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Arn_kVH3BVc






I will be doing some more research but so far I'm fairly convinced on this buffer. I'd rather invest in a good buffer to begin with than invest in something I do not like. I heard that DA buffers take different pads than rotary buffers; does the flex take both or is it one or the other?



The FLEX 3401 can burn and turn all types of pads but in my opinion the best pads are the Lake Country Hybrid pads. You can use the 6.5" Hybrid pads with the FLEX 3401 right out of the box then later get the Lake Country 4" Backing Plate Adapter and then you can burn and turn Lake Country 5" Hybrid pads and even 4" pads if you're careful. There are tons of articles on all these topics here on Autogeek.

Also, there's a how-to book that explains everything you need to know about doing both show car detailing and production detailing using the FLEX 3401



Paperback

How to use the Flex 3401 for Show Car Detailing (http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/ask-expert-featuring-mike-phillips/86256-how-use-flex-3401-show-car-detailing.html)


http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/watermark.php?file=83320




Or ebook

The paperback book on the FLEX 3401 is now available as an e-book for fast easy download.


Only $14.95


Click this link to get your copy...

How to use the Flex XC3401 VRG Dual Action Orbital Polisher (http://www.autogeek.net/mike-phillips-flex-book.html)



http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/watermark.php?file=83320





My boat detailing book also puts a LOT of emphasis on using a FLEX 3401 for removing oxidation on gel-coat boats.


Paperback book - How To Detail Boats With Marine 31 by Mike Phillips (http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/marine-31-boat-detailing-classes/97252-paperback-book-how-detail-boats-marine-31-mike-phillips.html)


http://www.marine31online.com/gallery/data/532/Boat_Cover.jpg










Also I had some more questions on pads. Usually I use a wool pad on deep scratches but I've seen other detailers that use only foam pads. Are some foam pads as good as cutting as the wool pads are? Can they take out scratches that are fairly deep?



The rotary buffer with a wool pad and a quality compound will remove paint faster than any other tool.

That said, "yes" you can use a wool pad on a rotary buffer, here's a recent article I wrote specifically on this topic....

Almost as fast as a rotary buffer but a lot safer - What is it? (http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/ask-mike-phillips-your-detailing-questions/100682-almost-fast-rotary-buffer-but-lot-safer-what.html)



What is almost as fast as a rotary buffer but a lot safer to use?

The Flex 3401 with a wool pad!



So you want to do some major correction work huh? Remove years of neglect that has left millions of swirls, scratches, oxidation and water spots in the paint? Or, you're working on a gel-coat boat and you need to remove years of heavy oxidation?


Then get yourself a Flex 3401 and a Lake Country 7.5" Electrified Wool Polishing pad. No matter how hard you press against the Flex 3401 because it's a gear-driven orbital polisher there's nothing you can do that will stop the pad from both rotating and oscillating and that means you can do what I call,


Power through a detail


Then to increase the cutting speed and power, get a wool pad for your FLEX 3401.
Even though they use the word polishing to describe the 7.5" Electrified White Sheepskin Final Polishing Pad - don't be fooled, it still cuts like a son-of-a-gun because it's a WOOL pad.

Fibers are a form of abrasive be they wool cutting or wool polishing pads.


Electrified?
The word electrified means Lake Country has taken the extra step to electrify the wool which removes the natural sharp barbs found in wool creating a pad that cuts fast but finishes with less scouring of the paint. This is a real benefit when buffing thin, scratch-sensitive clearcoat finishes.


http://www.marine31online.com/gallery/data/620/FLEX_3401_HD_023.jpg

http://www.marine31online.com/gallery/data/620/FLEX_3401_HD_024.jpg

http://www.marine31online.com/gallery/data/620/FLEX_3401_HD_025.jpg

http://www.marine31online.com/gallery/data/620/FLEX_3401_HD_026.jpg

http://www.marine31online.com/gallery/data/620/FLEX_3401_HD_027.jpg





The FLEX 3401 with a wool pad
http://www.marine31online.com/gallery/data/618/1969_Tbird_043.jpg



http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/watermark.php?file=104121

http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/watermark.php?file=104122

http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/watermark.php?file=104123

http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/watermark.php?file=104124

http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/watermark.php?file=104125

http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/watermark.php?file=104126

http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/watermark.php?file=104127

http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/watermark.php?file=104128

http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/watermark.php?file=104129

http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/watermark.php?file=104132


Before
http://www.marine31online.com/gallery/data/618/1969_Tbird_001.jpg

http://www.marine31online.com/gallery/data/618/1969_Tbird_006.jpg

http://www.marine31online.com/gallery/data/618/1969_Tbird_007.jpg





After
http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/watermark.php?file=104167

http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/watermark.php?file=104166



Faster than any free spinning dual action polisher no matter what the shape of the panel or condition of the paint and safer than a rotary buffer.



On Autogeek.com

FLEX 3401 Dual Action Orbital Polisher (http://www.autogeek.net/flex-orbital-polisher.html)

7.5" Electrified White Sheepskin Final Polishing Pad (http://www.autogeek.net/lc-wool-sheepskin-polishing-pad-7inch.html)



Hope that helps...


:)

[Setec Astronomy]

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