View Full Version : Which machine is best? Orbital, DA Orbital, Random Orbital, Rotary for removing oxidation on gel coat fiberglass RV?
1. Which machine is best for removing oxidation and hopefully diminishing/lightening a yellowed/cream gel coat fiberglass (originally was white) on a 2001 RV?
- Orbital
- DA Orbital
- Random Orbital
- Rotary
2. I have read that using a wool pad would be best. Will any wool pad work or is there a particular one that would be better to use?
Example:
- Twisted wool cutting pad
- Wool cutting pad
- 100% heavy cut wool pad
- 50/50 wool polishing pad
- Thin foamed wool pad
Setec Astronomy
05-24-2016, 01:51 PM
Gelcoat is hard, I think you're going to want to use a rotary, or you have left off a type of machine from your list, the forced-rotation DA, like a Flex 3401. This gives you some/most of the power of a rotary, without sacrificing all of the safety of a DA. Someone else will have to speak to your pad choice as I rarely use wool.
Mike Phillips
05-24-2016, 02:02 PM
How bad is the oxidation?
In my boat detailing book, I understood "condition" would be a HUGE factor when recommending a tool, pad and product. Thus when I wrote it I divided boats into 4 categories,
Category 1: New or Like New
Category 2: Good condition with light oxidation
Category 3: Mild neglect
Category 4: Severely oxidized and neglected
For what it's worth... the cover of any book is considered the most valuable real-estate for the book. So a person would think and plan carefully how to use the cover of the book to send the most leveraged message possible.
Note the tool and the pad...
http://www.marine31online.com/gallery/data/532/Boat_Cover.jpg
:)
Mike Phillips
05-24-2016, 02:06 PM
Which tool to use really comes down to,
How fast do you want to get the job done.
How many steps do you want to do?
In my book, somewhere I recommend never letting your boat get to category #3 or #4. Then you can tackle in one step without holograms using the FLEX 3401.
Soon as you start using a rotary buffer then you have to decide do you want holograms in the gel-coat? Or do you want to leave a flat, more perfect surface.
See my article here,
Holograms in gel-coat boats by Mike Phillips (http://www.marine31online.com/forum/showthread.php?t=138)
:)
Which tool to use really comes down to,
How fast do you want to get the job done.
How many steps do you want to do?
In my book, somewhere I recommend never letting your boat get to category #3 or #4. Then you can tackle in one step without holograms using the FLEX 3401.
Soon as you start using a rotary buffer then you have to decide do you want holograms in the gel-coat? Or do you want to leave a flat, more perfect surface.
See my article here,
Holograms in gel-coat boats by Mike Phillips (http://www.marine31online.com/forum/showthread.php?t=138)
:)
Thank you Mike for replying and providing the links. I really appreciate it.
My MH is a Category 3: Mild neglect. The fiberglass has turned a cream/beige color and there is a contrast between the fiberglass and white metal bay doors.
I do not want holograms in the gel-coat. I want to lighten the cream/beige color and I want a nice smooth shiny surface.
Zen Dong
05-24-2016, 07:07 PM
These days, I 'm also confused about these machines.
Attached is a pic of my MH. Apologize for the pic quality; the pic is taken my phone. The fiberglass is more cream/beige color in person than what the picture is showing. A couple years ago I used Meguiar’s #49 and Meguiars #56. I put these on with an orbital polisher.
If it is possible, I want to lighten the cream/beige color on the fiberglass.
48529
Mike Phillips
05-25-2016, 07:43 AM
Thank you Mike for replying and providing the links. I really appreciate it.
My MH is a Category 3: Mild neglect. The fiberglass has turned a cream/beige color and there is a contrast between the fiberglass and white metal bay doors.
I do not want holograms in the gel-coat. I want to lighten the cream/beige color and I want a nice smooth shiny surface.
Attached is a pic of my MH. Apologize for the pic quality; the pic is taken my phone. The fiberglass is more cream/beige color in person than what the picture is showing.
A couple years ago I used Meguiar’s #49 and Meguiars #56. I put these on with an orbital polisher.
If it is possible, I want to lighten the cream/beige color on the fiberglass.
http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/attachments/rv-motorhome-detailing/48529d1464138413-machine-best-orbital-da-orbital-random-orbital-rotary-removing-oxidation-gel-coat-fiberglass-rv-rv_01.jpg
A few years ago when you used the Meguiar's #49 and the #56 did this restore the brighter white color to the gel-coat?
If it did, then repeat the process. If if didn't it could be the gel-coat has yellowed as the pigments have faded.
Are the graphics vinyl and laying on top of the gel-coat?
These make buffing a pain...
:)
precisionmobile85
05-25-2016, 07:58 AM
Before i went on my own i worked for a company that use to go to lake winnepasake in N.H. and detail boats. I learned that every gelcoat finish seems to react different to different pads, polishes, compounds etc.... We would test all the above and pick whats best for the job we were working on
A few years ago when you used the Meguiar's #49 and the #56 did this restore the brighter white color to the gel-coat?
If it did, then repeat the process. If if didn't it could be the gel-coat has yellowed as the pigments have faded.
Are the graphics vinyl and laying on top of the gel-coat?
These make buffing a pain...
:)
When we purchased the MH the fiberglass was a darker cream color and had a very dull/chalky finish and the graphics were pretty much gone. It had been neglected from the previous owners. The #49 did lighten the cream color of the fiberglass to the stage it is now. We did not have the right buffer or pad.
The graphics are painted on top of the gel-coat by us.
Mike Phillips
05-25-2016, 03:25 PM
When we purchased the MH the fiberglass was a darker cream color and had a very dull/chalky finish and the graphics were pretty much gone. It had been neglected from the previous owners. The #49 did lighten the cream color of the fiberglass to the stage it is now. We did not have the right buffer or pad.
The graphics are painted on top of the gel-coat by us.
Sounds like a challenge to buff around the graphics. The M49 is a quality compound.
We have a product in our Marine 31 line for gel-coat boats that I prefer as it cuts fast and finishes like a polish. It's called Captain's One-Step Compound & Polish.
I'm guessing to get the best results I would cut first with a wool pad on a rotary as that way I could go up on edge around the painted graphics to focus the wool pad and the compound onto just the gel-coat.
Next I would use the same compound, (Captains Compound), with a foam pad on the FLEX 3401 with a 6.5" blue light cutting Hybrid pad as this would remove the hologram scratches left by the wool pad and leave you a flat but high gloss finish ready to seal with a wax or sealant.
:)
Sounds like a challenge to buff around the graphics. The M49 is a quality compound.
We have a product in our Marine 31 line for gel-coat boats that I prefer as it cuts fast and finishes like a polish. It's called Captain's One-Step Compound & Polish.
I'm guessing to get the best results I would cut first with a wool pad on a rotary as that way I could go up on edge around the painted graphics to focus the wool pad and the compound onto just the gel-coat.
Next I would use the same compound, (Captains Compound), with a foam pad on the FLEX 3401 with a 6.5" blue light cutting Hybrid pad as this would remove the hologram scratches left by the wool pad and leave you a flat but high gloss finish ready to seal with a wax or sealant.
:)
Thank you Mike.
Sounds like a challenge to buff around the graphics. The M49 is a quality compound.
We have a product in our Marine 31 line for gel-coat boats that I prefer as it cuts fast and finishes like a polish. It's called Captain's One-Step Compound & Polish.
I'm guessing to get the best results I would cut first with a wool pad on a rotary as that way I could go up on edge around the painted graphics to focus the wool pad and the compound onto just the gel-coat.
Next I would use the same compound, (Captains Compound), with a foam pad on the FLEX 3401 with a 6.5" blue light cutting Hybrid pad as this would remove the hologram scratches left by the wool pad and leave you a flat but high gloss finish ready to seal with a wax or sealant.
:)
I am trying to decide on using a wax, sealant or wax/sealant when I am finished with the RV. Most of the products have carnauba wax in them. I'm concerned if I use a product with carnauba wax in it; the carnauba wax could cause premature oxidation and/or discoloration from the UV rays of the sun on the white gel-coat/fiberglass of the MH. My MH is always outside in the sun/weather 24/7. I do not know if this can happen, but have heard/read from other's experience this could be a possibility. I don't want to use a product that could cause premature oxidation and especially any discoloration to the white gel-coat/fiberglass.
Would a sealant only be a better option?
Does the gel-coat need to breath since it's porous?
:confused:
Mike Phillips
06-07-2016, 02:41 PM
I am trying to decide on using a wax, sealant or wax/sealant when I am finished with the RV. Most of the products have carnauba wax in them. I'm concerned if I use a product with carnauba wax in it; the carnauba wax could cause premature oxidation and/or discoloration from the UV rays of the sun on the white gel-coat/fiberglass of the MH.
My MH is always outside in the sun/weather 24/7. I do not know if this can happen, but have heard/read from other's experience this could be a possibility. I don't want to use a product that could cause premature oxidation and especially any discoloration to the white gel-coat/fiberglass.
Great questions.
First a carnauba wax or a synthetic sealant or a hybrid which is a product that contains both carnauba wax and man-made or synthetic protection ingredients will not cause oxidation. I explain how oxidation is caused in my how-to book,
The Complete Guide to a Show Car Shine
It has to do with free radicals in the air and the molecules that make up the material that "could" oxidize.
Can one of the above products cause discoloration or yellowing? Possibly. Back in the old days when people would layer waxes the waxes would build up and yellow. At least that's what old-timers have led me to believe. I don't think any modern "quality brand name products would cause this problem.
Would a sealant only be a better option?
For long lasting protection a synthetic product will tend to last longer than a naturally occurring ingredient. At least that's my opinion.
Does the gel-coat need to breath since it's porous?
:confused:
No. Materials don't breathe. You and I breathe but materials don't breathe.
Materials can outgas but that tends to be when they are new and there are carrying agents, solvents and other ingredients used to manufacture the material or component leave the components, sometimes via evaporation.
Due to the environmental conditions your Motorhome (MH) is exposed to there is no perfect answer or product. We have a gel-coat "coating" in our Marine Line that outlasts traditional waxes and synthetic sealants but it's more steps to apply.
I've been very impressed with a product called SONAX Polymer Net Shield. Or PNS for short. I would suggest looking into this product as an option. SONAX is like the Meguiar's of Europe. That is to say they've been around a long time and have a long record of success when it comes to their chemistry. They truly make some top shelf products. I've never used their product on gel-coat but I'm pretty confident it will work on any clean, hard shiny prepared surface.
On Autogeek.com
SONAX Polymer Net Shield (http://www.autogeek.net/sonax-polymer-net-shield.html)
SONAX Application Sponge (http://www.autogeek.net/sonax-application-sponge.html)
http://www.autogeekonline.net/gallery/watermark.php?file=105547
:)
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