autogeekonline car wax, car care and auto detailing forum Autogeek on TV
car wax, car care and auto detailing forumAutogeekonline autogeekonline car wax, car care and auto detailing forum HomeForumBlogAutogeek.net StoreDetailing Classes with Mike PhillipsGalleryDetailing How To's
Page 3 of 4 FirstFirst 1234 LastLast
Results 21 to 30 of 36
  1. #21
    Director of Training Mike Phillips's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Stuart, Florida
    Posts
    35,023

    Re: The Difference Between a Cleaner/Wax and a Finishing Wax

    Quote Originally Posted by emaxxman View Post

    Interesting on the cleaning ability of NXT. I had KSG on my car over the winter and was going to top it off with NXT. I didn't use the NXT 2.0 because I was afraid that it would remove it. I didn't read the labeling on the 2.0 though.
    Keep in mind, it's not just the product... it's also...

    Application material
    Application process

    That is there's a huge difference in applying "any" product with a soft foam applicator pad versus a Scotchbrite pad.

    There's a huge difference between applying "any" product using your hand versus a rotary buffer.

    You can adjust the aggressiveness or "non-aggressiveness" of any product to make it do what you want it to do by tweaking your application material and process.

    I've seen people use NXT to remove oxidation on an oxidized single stage paint job but I can do this with spit and a piece of terry cloth by hand. The product is still meant to be used on a finish in good to excellent condition and if the paint is neglected best results will come from pre-cleaning and polishing the paint first.


    KSG is a very interesting product... it's not like any other sealant I've ever played with, note I'm not saying this to mean positive or negative, just interesting...

    I think any liquid product rubbed against it except for another coat of itself would tend to remove it whether it has cleaners or not...

    Some people like topping it with a Carnauba wax versus a synthetic like NXT

    I wrote on article on "Topping NXT" on MOL back in 2005 (I think), the principals I outlined in that article actually apply to topping "anything" with "anything"


    Mike Phillips
    Host - Competition Ready on Velocity Channel
    Director of Training Autogeek & Marine 31
    IDA Board Member
    CD-SV, RT
    Competition Ready Facebook Page
    Mike Phillips Facebook Page
    Twitter
    Instagram

    Click on a book to get your own copy.



  2. #22
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Northern Virginia
    Posts
    151

    Re: The Difference Between a Cleaner/Wax and a Finishing Wax

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike.Phillips@Autogeek View Post
    KSG is a very interesting product... it's not like any other sealant I've ever played with, note I'm not saying this to mean positive or negative, just interesting...
    Can you expand on that? I currently have only been using the Klasse twins on the DD's I have done, so I don't have any experience with other products as of yet. I am curious to know in what ways you find KSG interesting.

  3. #23
    Senior Member ziggo99's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Southern Illinois
    Posts
    850

    Re: The Difference Between a Cleaner/Wax and a Finishing Wax

    I find it interesting how you put FK 2180 into the Cleaner Wax bracket and FK 218 into the Finishing Sealant bracket when on the FK 218 product page, it says

    Finish Kare 218 Poly Wipe Sealant Conditioner is similar to Finish Kare Ultra Polymer Sealant but with more cleaning ability.
    Is 2180 stronger than I've been lead to believe?
    Kyle
    Quote Originally Posted by Dugdug View Post
    Anyways, a customer with a hummer asked me if there was a surcharge for his hummer. I said yes, it's an SUV. He said quote "well it's an H3, so it's not really an suv".......

  4. #24
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Fairfield County, CT
    Posts
    327

    Re: The Difference Between a Cleaner/Wax and a Finishing Wax

    Hi Mike. Great post! Couple of questions (sorry if I missed the answers above but I don't think I did):

    I currently do: ONR/clay/KAIO/845. Would it be worthwhile to add a sealant between the KAIO/845 (something like Wolfgang Deep Gloss Sealant, KSG or Opti-Seal?) Would it increase the durability and length of protection? Or if I'm topping with 845 anyway, no need for the sealant?

    Also, where does Poor Boys Black Hole fit in? Is it an AIO or a finishing sealant? If it's an AIO, would it be better than KAIO for a black car?

    Thanks!

  5. #25
    Senior Member Wills.WindowsAndWheels's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Gilbert,az
    Posts
    1,619

    Re: The Difference Between a Cleaner/Wax and a Finishing Wax

    Quote Originally Posted by newb001 View Post
    Hi Mike. Great post! Couple of questions (sorry if I missed the answers above but I don't think I did):

    I currently do: ONR/clay/KAIO/845. Would it be worthwhile to add a sealant between the KAIO/845 (something like Wolfgang Deep Gloss Sealant, KSG or Opti-Seal?) Would it increase the durability and length of protection? Or if I'm topping with 845 anyway, no need for the sealant?

    Also, where does Poor Boys Black Hole fit in? Is it an AIO or a finishing sealant? If it's an AIO, would it be better than KAIO for a black car?

    Thanks!
    I think black hole is a glaze...which helps out with those RIDS that you cant quite get rid of (no pun intended). I believe it would come after you have done any correction but before you seal/wax. It has fillers which help to hide those scratches that compounding/polishing didnt get out.
    Wills - Windows & Wheels Auto Detailing Detailing LLC
    www.WindowsAndWheels.com
    'Like' Us On Facebook

  6. #26
    Senior Member FUNX650's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Posts
    20,399

    Re: How To Choose The Right Wax or Paint Sealant

    Sorry...Pushed the wrong key!
    Be wary of the man who urges an action in which he himself incurs no risk~Joaquin de Setanti

  7. #27
    Director of Training Mike Phillips's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Stuart, Florida
    Posts
    35,023

    Re: The Difference Between a Cleaner/Wax and a Finishing Wax

    Quote Originally Posted by newb001 View Post
    Hi Mike. Great post! Couple of questions (sorry if I missed the answers above but I don't think I did):

    I currently do: ONR/clay/KAIO/845. Would it be worthwhile to add a sealant between the KAIO/845 (something like Wolfgang Deep Gloss Sealant, KSG or Opti-Seal?)

    Would it increase the durability and length of protection? Or if I'm topping with 845 anyway, no need for the sealant?

    Good question...

    The thought on forums like this is that when you top a synthetic paint sealant with a Carnauba based car wax that

    A. The sealant will stick to the paint
    B. The Carnauba Wax will stick to the sealant
    C. After the Carnauba wax wears off the sealant will still be on the surface to provide protection until you detail the car again.


    At least that's the theory...

    Another way to look at it would be to put your car on a regular maintenance program and re-wax or seal the paint before all the protection is worn off, call it preventative maintenance. Kind of like an oil change in that you don't drive a car till all the oil is gone and then add more... you replace the oil before it's past maximum performance with fresh oil.


    Quote Originally Posted by newb001 View Post
    Also, where does Poor Boys Black Hole fit in?

    Is it an AIO or a finishing sealant? If it's an AIO, would it be better than KAIO for a black car?

    Thanks!
    Cleaner/Polish or Cleaner/Glaze.

    I asked Steve at Poorboys if this product was Body Shop Safe, that is it contains no ingredients that would cause surface adhesion problems in a body shop and he told me it was body shop safe.

    Waxes, paint sealants, basically any type of "protection ingredient" in a paint care product will tend to make water bead up.

    If a product makes water bead up then it would be a no-no to take it into a body shop or fresh paint environment because it can contaminate the shop and possibly get onto panels or car bodies before being painted and then cause surface adhesion problems.

    One common surface adhesion problem is called Fish Eyes. Fish Eyes is where there's some type of contaminant on a panel before the panel is painted that causes surface tension which shows up as the paint trying to get away from the contaminant and thus you get a Fish Eye in the paint.

    Same idea with a wax or paint sealant, if the protection ingredients create surface tension you get water beading as the water try to get away from the surface. If it can't get away it piles up.

    Thus any product that causes surface tension, (car waxes and paint sealants and even coatings in this day and age), would NOT be Body Shop Safe.

    I used Poorboy's Black Hole Glaze and noticed how it didn't wash off the paint easily so I called him and asked him if it was body shop safe and he said yes. Since he said "yes", I assume the product doesn't contain any "protection ingredients" and thus it's not a cleaner/wax but a cleaner/polish or cleaner/glaze.

    It has the ability to remove a little bit of the defects and the ability to fill in a little bit of the defects but it's not a wax or paint sealant.


    See my article here too...

    Word Definitions - Compounds, Polishes, Glazes, Paint Cleaners and Waxes



    Mike Phillips
    Host - Competition Ready on Velocity Channel
    Director of Training Autogeek & Marine 31
    IDA Board Member
    CD-SV, RT
    Competition Ready Facebook Page
    Mike Phillips Facebook Page
    Twitter
    Instagram

    Click on a book to get your own copy.



  8. #28
    Member hondacare's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Location
    Louisville, KY
    Posts
    84

    Re: The Difference Between a Cleaner/Wax and a Finishing Wax

    This thread is like a encyclopedia. I can Lear so much just from here.
    Don't go around saying the world owes you a living. The world owes you nothing. It was here first.
    Mark Twain

  9. #29
    Director of Training Mike Phillips's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Stuart, Florida
    Posts
    35,023

    Re: The Difference Between a Cleaner/Wax and a Finishing Wax

    Quote Originally Posted by hondacare View Post
    This thread is like a encyclopedia. I can Lear so much just from here.

    There's a huge difference between a cleaner/wax and a finishing wax. Choosing the right wax for the condition of your car's paint plus your goals for the paint is very important to the success of your end-results or lack thereof.



    Mike Phillips
    Host - Competition Ready on Velocity Channel
    Director of Training Autogeek & Marine 31
    IDA Board Member
    CD-SV, RT
    Competition Ready Facebook Page
    Mike Phillips Facebook Page
    Twitter
    Instagram

    Click on a book to get your own copy.



  10. #30
    Junior Member JeepGeek's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Posts
    15

    Question Re: The Difference Between a Cleaner/Wax and a Finishing Wax

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike.Phillips@Autogeek View Post
    Good question...

    The thought on forums like this is that when you top a synthetic paint sealant with a Carnauba based car wax that

    A. The sealant will stick to the paint
    B. The Carnauba Wax will stick to the sealant
    C. After the Carnauba wax wears off the sealant will still be on the surface to provide protection until you detail the car again.


    At least that's the theory...
    <snip>

    , Glazes, Paint Cleaners and Waxes



    So much great information, so little time to absorb.. Thank you for helping us all.

    Couple questions about the above theory..
    I interpret the theory to mean that
    A. Sealant last longer than Carnauba and
    B. You put Carnauba over it for the Carnauba effect.. ie better / different shine or glossiness.
    C. Autogeek product pages state flat out that Sealants can't match Carnauba for ultimate shine. "A Carnauba wax is the only way to go for protecting your car’s finish. This is the wax of choice for show car owners. It offers the best-looking deep, wet shine of any wax, bar none." Poorboy's World Polish with 100% Carnauba, Poorboys Polish Wax, polish with carnauba wax

    My questions are:
    1. If sealants don't produce the best shine, but are put directly on the paint and topped with carnauba, Doesn't this create a "Hybrid" shine? better than a sealant maybe but less than Carnauba since the carnauba is in effect enhancing the shine of whatever the sealant has produced?

    2. If I have properly prepared my paint, why wouldn't I just layer say Collinite 915 and skip a WGDGPS (for example) undercoat? would seem to satisfy kiss method..

    I just want to winterize my car and I have an abundance of elbow grease to do it with but am obviously confused about layering. I want the best carnauba shine I can get with a serious dose of toughness to protect it long ways into the winter. Thing is, I'd rather use the fewest products needed to get this result..

    Thanks for any and all advice along these lines!

Page 3 of 4 FirstFirst 1234 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Microfiber Cutting pads VS polishing/finishing pads, any difference?
    By coupe07 in forum Wool & Foam Buffing Pads
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: 05-15-2015, 08:21 PM
  2. Replies: 0
    Last Post: 05-21-2013, 05:13 PM
  3. Difference ... Prewax cleaner/cleaner wax
    By Vizzin72 in forum Auto Detailing 101
    Replies: 8
    Last Post: 03-29-2012, 05:45 PM
  4. Difference between Po85rd (Finishing Polish) and PO106 (Super Finish)
    By bigaizsosexy in forum Auto Detailing 101
    Replies: 15
    Last Post: 10-15-2011, 02:09 PM
  5. Replies: 4
    Last Post: 05-29-2007, 12:05 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

» January 2017

1 2 3 4 5 6 7
8 9 10 11 12 13 14
15 16 17 18 19 20 21
22 23 24 25 26 27 28
29 30 31 1234